lWhen did the Old Testament end?

[ituttut]

That's a new one on me. Show me please?

Hello kyredneck. I'm taking out tomorrow morning, and am back after Thanksgiving. Have a Happy one. This will give you time to delve closely into His Word.

Luke 13:6-9, "He spake also this parable; a certain man had a fig tree planted in his vineyard; and he came and sought fruit thereon, and found none.
7. Then said he unto the dresser of his vineyard, Behold, these three years I come seeking fruit on this fig tree, and find none: cut it down; why cumbereth it the ground?
8. And he answering said unto him, Lord, let it alone this year also, till I shall dig about it, and dung it:
9. And if it bear fruit, well: and if not, then after that thou shalt cut it down."

 

[ituttut]

When you say Old Testament it can be confusing as to the meaning. If you mean the Old Covenant then one might say that it ended by replacing it with the new as far as sacrifices and ceremonies. However if by Old testament you mean all that is written there in and all the covenants within the Old testament then the OT has not come to an end. There are still things that must be fulfilled under the Old. Even Jesus said this;
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Well heaven nor earth has passed and all is not fulfilled.

freeatlast can we notice that today God does not deal, or talk directly to man (other than His Word) as He did in the OT, and NT? Prophecy has stopped today, but will pick-up on the other side of the Rapture. Jesus fulfilled His Part, and did all of the works required. There is still prophecy to be fulfilled, and it will be in its time.

Scripture tells us something new happened, and is now in the act of playing out.

 

[ituttut]

From post #25:

I've asked this before, I'll ask it again. How does the literalist explain this seeming discrepancy?:

For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass away from the law, till all things be accomplished. Mt 5:18

....ye also were made dead to the law........we have been discharged from the law..... Ro 7:4,6

....the old covenant......is done away..... 2 Cor 3:14

....having abolished ......the law of commandments contained in ordinances....... Eph 2:15

All the work for the various covenants has been fulfilled, yet all has not yet come about for God will do this in His Time. Israel is no longer under a schoolmaster, and not being taught to try and live under the Law. Israel could not keep their end of the bargain for it is impossible for any man to do so.

Jesus Christ has taken care of that already as far as we are concerned for we are dead to the Law. All things will pass away, including heaven and earth, but not His Words from heaven and earth.

 

[lastday]

Lastday

Kyredneck,
You wrote:

The heaven and earth of the old covenant has been removed, and we are new creations of the new heaven and new earth of the new covenant. But the sad truth is that this interpretation simply is not exciting or sensational enough to suit the taste of most these days.

From what you write you assume the "old covenant (old earth) passed away in 70 AD"...as if "ALL THINGS THAT ARE WRITTEN WERE FULFILLED" at that time. Jesus stated the "days of vengeance against Israel would continue until the times of the Gentiles are finished". Luke 21:24. For the literal restoration of the nation of Israel awaits both the "end of Gentile times and the fullness of the Gentiles" for their understanding of the removal of the OLD Covenant that is still "about to vanish". Because Israel continues in a state of blindness! Heb.8:13; 2 Cor.3:14.

The word of the Lord requires that "the fullness of the Gentiles be realized before All Israel" can be saved and thus become beneficiaries of the NEW
Covenant. This is a "Mystery". Rom.11:25-26. The "vail" still remains before their eyes and so they are not yet participants
in the "fulfillment of all things that are written". Therefore they must wait until both HOUSES of Ephraim and Judah reunite as
"one stick" under the Kingship of Messiah AT HIS SC!! Ezek.37:14-28.

Your solution to the "end of time" fails to recognize the "restoration of all things awaits the return of Jesus from heaven to complete all things that are written". Acts 3:19-21. The next reality on the horizon is a global System to which you refer as having been destroyed in AD 70...Babylon the Great. The Mideast situation demands a "peace" that requires the administration
of that global System for a "short time"...before the 1260-Day Endtime can begin!!!
Mel

 

[lastday]

Lastday

Friends,

Our member, Ituttut, opened this thread and now challenges us with this:

Today God does not talk directly to man (other than His Word) as He did in the OT and NT...Jesus fulfilled His Part, and did all of the works required.
There is still prophecy to be fulfilled and will be in its time...Scripture tells us something new happened, and is now in the act of playing out.

My Response:
"All things written to be fulfilled" during the OLD Testament Dispensation of Law were completed at the climax of Daniel's 69th set of "7" when Christ rode into Jerusalem hailed as King and was crucified five days later on Nisan 14. Since Christ died, blessings of the NEW Dispensation of God's Grace have been extended to Gentile nations..."until Gentile times are finished"!
Luke 21:22-24.

The final day of 69 sets of "7" (173,880 days), counting from Sunday, Nisan 9 of 444 BC to Sunday, Nisan 9 of 33 AD, was Palm Sunday. Jesus identified that Day as the "day of visitation which Israel did not recognize"...though the 69th set of "7" ended with both Zech.9:9 and Dan.9:26A fulfilled on that Day, Nisan 9. And then Lev.23:5 was fulfilled five days "after that Day" according to Daniel...on Friday, Nisan 14 of AD 33. (Nisan 14 of AD 33 was also 173,880 days from Nisan 14 of 444 BC so that Passover occurred exactly 69 times on a Friday in 476 years). Jesus wept because the "days of vengeance" on His people would include the Temple's destruction in AD 70!! Luke 19:41-44.

The events of the "last days" concern this Dispensation of Grace in which Israel remains under God's judgment...while Jesus remains in heaven until
the "times to restore all things". The "times" involve OT and NT prophecies required for the "reunion and restoration of Israel and Judah as one stick... never again to be separated as two nations under God's Judgment. Joel
promises that God will "relent and rescue" the remnant He has chosen to
embrace Messiah when He is revealed...on "the Day of His Apocalypse"!!!
Luke 17:30-33; Luke 21:25-36.
Mel Miller of www.lastday.net.

 

[OldRegular]

Let me ask. By what covenant would a person today, Jew, Gentile or any other be brought into a relationship with God therefore becoming an heir?

By the same and only Covenant by which anyone is saved: The Covenant of Sovereign Grace!

 

[OldRegular]

I see ituttut is still attempting to spread the heresy of two Gospels!

 

[lastday]

Lastday

OldRegular wrote:

I see ituttut is still attempting to spread the heresy of two Gospels!

I have wondered why Ituttut has not responded to this offhanded remark.
What have I missed that gives rise to this accusation of "heresy"?
Mel Miller

 

[ituttut]

[/QUOTE]

Friends
Our member, Ituttut, opened this thread and now challenges us with this:
"Today God does not talk directly to man (other than His Word) as He did in the OT and NT...Jesus fulfilled His Part, and did all of the works required.
There is still prophecy to be fulfilled and will be in its time...Scripture tells us something new happened, and is now in the act of playing out".

My Response:
"All things written to be fulfilled" during the OLD Testament Dispensation of Law were completed at the climax of Daniel's 69th set of "7" when Christ rode into Jerusalem hailed as King and was crucified five days later on Nisan 14. Since Christ died, blessings of the NEW Dispensation of God's Grace have been extended to Gentile nations..."until Gentile times are finished"!
Luke 21:22-24

How can you reconcile your above with biblical truth that a Gentile was not saved into the Body of Christ until after Damascus Road?

The final day of 69 sets of "7" (173,880 days), counting from Sunday, Nisan 9 of 444 BC to Sunday, Nisan 9 of 33 AD, was Palm Sunday. Jesus identified that Day as the "day of visitation which Israel did not recognize"...though the 69th set of "7" ended with both Zech.9:9 and Dan.9:26A fulfilled on that Day, Nisan 9. And then Lev.23:5 was fulfilled five days "after that Day" according to Daniel...on Friday, Nisan 14 of AD 33. (Nisan 14 of AD 33 was also 173,880 days from Nisan 14 of 444 BC so that Passover occurred exactly 69 times on a Friday in 476 years). Jesus wept because the "days of vengeance" on His people would include the Temple's destruction in AD 70!! Luke 19:41-44.

I do believe something is amiss within what you have written above. We do make a grave error when we believe what man has decreed. Nissan 14 could not be on a Friday when Jesus was crucified. This assertion directly refutes what Jesus tells us.

]

The events of the "last days" concern this Dispensation of Grace in which Israel remains under God's judgment...while Jesus remains in heaven until
the "times to restore all things". The "times" involve OT and NT prophecies required for the "reunion and restoration of Israel and Judah as one stick... never again to be separated as two nations under God's Judgment. Joel
promises that God will "relent and rescue" the remnant He has chosen to
embrace Messiah when He is revealed...on "the Day of His Apocalypse"!!!
Luke 17:30-33; Luke 21:25-36.
Mel Miller of [URL="http://www.lastday.net."]www.lastday.net.[/URL]

What is said in this paragraph, only confirms what I have said before, viz. Prophecy has stopped but will pick up on the other side of our being caught up into the air to be with Him.

 

[ituttut]

I see ituttut is still attempting to spread the heresy of two Gospels!

Happy to see you can still understand what I am saying, but regret you still have difficulty in understanding what Paul points out to you. Peter speaks to this very point in his second book.

 

[ituttut]

OldRegular wrote:

I have wondered why Ituttut has not responded to this offhanded remark.
What have I missed that gives rise to this accusation of "heresy"?
Mel Miller

Mel, old friend, the answer can be found in His Word, which should one come across a post of mine, will find all I do is apply what I learned many years ago in Business College. Can a compedent Lawyer defend, or prosecute; or a reporter inform without knowing what to ask, and finding out who, when, where, why, and How it all happenned?