Thinking of doing a series of messages after the 1st of the year entitled, "The Elephant in the Room." What theological, cultural, or practical "elephants" come to your mind?
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Elephant in the Room
- Thread starter PastorGreg
- Start date
Why is it a leap of faith to go into debt as a church, but it's considered sinful and irresponsible if a person does it?
Church: builds a buys a bigger facility and goes into debt, struggling to pay the big bill. This is somehow viewed as good.
Family: builds or buys a home and goes into debt, struggling to pay the big bill. This is viewed as irresponsible.
What's the difference?
Church: builds a buys a bigger facility and goes into debt, struggling to pay the big bill. This is somehow viewed as good.
Family: builds or buys a home and goes into debt, struggling to pay the big bill. This is viewed as irresponsible.
What's the difference?
The Bible says names can be blotted out of the book of life, but Baptists claim it can't be taken out. One pastor told me "oh, that's a DIFFERENT book" and walked away after I asked.
What's the truth? Do we all start out in the book of life and then get blotted if we don't believe, which would mean universal salvation until unbelief is stated, or do we get written in the book of life at salvation, but have the ability to be removed?
Neither goes with the concept of eternal security, which is plainly stated also. How do we untangle this and find the truth about the book of life?
What's the truth? Do we all start out in the book of life and then get blotted if we don't believe, which would mean universal salvation until unbelief is stated, or do we get written in the book of life at salvation, but have the ability to be removed?
Neither goes with the concept of eternal security, which is plainly stated also. How do we untangle this and find the truth about the book of life?
glfredrick
New Member
For me, the big old elephants in the room are the big themes of God that get overlooked in the proof-texting that we so often do.
For instance the mission of God to see His glory spread to all the peoples of the world.
The kingdom of God and all it entails for our walk, our congregation, community, etc.
The fact that the Christian walk is NOT a walk of personal nature, but rather a corporate issue where we are to lean on each other in harmony and relationship as we come to God who is Himself in relationship in the persons of the Trinity.
The stewardship God gave to we humans over our planet, life on this planet, our families, and our own souls.
The grace of God.
Eternity in Heaven.
For instance the mission of God to see His glory spread to all the peoples of the world.
The kingdom of God and all it entails for our walk, our congregation, community, etc.
The fact that the Christian walk is NOT a walk of personal nature, but rather a corporate issue where we are to lean on each other in harmony and relationship as we come to God who is Himself in relationship in the persons of the Trinity.
The stewardship God gave to we humans over our planet, life on this planet, our families, and our own souls.
The grace of God.
Eternity in Heaven.
Some great thoughts, Gina. Thanks.
For me, the big old elephants in the room are the big themes of God that get overlooked in the proof-texting that we so often do.
For instance the mission of God to see His glory spread to all the peoples of the world.
The kingdom of God and all it entails for our walk, our congregation, community, etc.
The fact that the Christian walk is NOT a walk of personal nature, but rather a corporate issue where we are to lean on each other in harmony and relationship as we come to God who is Himself in relationship in the persons of the Trinity.
The stewardship God gave to we humans over our planet, life on this planet, our families, and our own souls.
The grace of God.
Eternity in Heaven.[/QUOTE
Great points. Although I'm thankful that God and His glory do seem to be reclaiming their rightful place of prominence in many churches today.
The Bible says names can be blotted out of the book of life, but Baptists claim it can't be taken out. One pastor told me "oh, that's a DIFFERENT book" and walked away after I asked.
What's the truth? Do we all start out in the book of life and then get blotted if we don't believe, which would mean universal salvation until unbelief is stated, or do we get written in the book of life at salvation, but have the ability to be removed?
Neither goes with the concept of eternal security, which is plainly stated also. How do we untangle this and find the truth about the book of life?
Sister Gina------there ARE two different types of the "Book of Life"----just like your preacher friend said-----its too bad he didn't explain himself---if you want-I can explain them to you----its probably NOT as you have it to be!!!
Sister Gina------there ARE two different types of the "Book of Life"----just like your preacher friend said-----its too bad he didn't explain himself---if you want-I can explain them to you----its probably NOT as you have it to be!!!
I really don't have anything set in my mind about it because it's something I just don't understand and gave up on asking because nobody had it and I couldn't find any material that explained it.
I'd LOVE to have it explained! Thank you.
Trends.
It seems that every few years, it becomes trendy to help a certain group of people out.
Sometimes it is addicts, sometimes it is widowers, sometimes it is helping yourself, sometimes it's the poor, sometimes it's more trendy to go and offer emotional support to the more well-to-do because they "look okay but suffer inside."
It's always changing.
Sure, some are better in one area than another, but shouldn't everyone be being bettered by being around Christians and in the church? Why focus on one need over the other, and why put one over the other?
The result seems to be people who gravitate to a church that serves where they are in life and then when they don't need it anymore, they move on.
So why aren't believers trained to care about ALL needs? Use their talents, yes, but don't ignore someone in need because they don't fit into an area you "enjoy" helping.
Why do churches do that when it's clear that churches aren't supposed to put one group of people as more important than another group? Maybe if everyone did what they should, we wouldn't need a zillion special interest groups to keep people interested in praising God and learning more, which is what church is supposed to about, isn't it?
It seems that every few years, it becomes trendy to help a certain group of people out.
Sometimes it is addicts, sometimes it is widowers, sometimes it is helping yourself, sometimes it's the poor, sometimes it's more trendy to go and offer emotional support to the more well-to-do because they "look okay but suffer inside."
It's always changing.
Sure, some are better in one area than another, but shouldn't everyone be being bettered by being around Christians and in the church? Why focus on one need over the other, and why put one over the other?
The result seems to be people who gravitate to a church that serves where they are in life and then when they don't need it anymore, they move on.
So why aren't believers trained to care about ALL needs? Use their talents, yes, but don't ignore someone in need because they don't fit into an area you "enjoy" helping.
Why do churches do that when it's clear that churches aren't supposed to put one group of people as more important than another group? Maybe if everyone did what they should, we wouldn't need a zillion special interest groups to keep people interested in praising God and learning more, which is what church is supposed to about, isn't it?
Excellent insight there, Gina. Seems like in many churches, the "trend" is to focus on the youth group, but once the kids grow up and leave home, the parents leave the church.The result seems to be people who gravitate to a church that serves where they are in life and then when they don't need it anymore, they move on.
Trends.
It seems that every few years, it becomes trendy to help a certain group of people out.
Sometimes it is addicts, sometimes it is widowers, sometimes it is helping yourself, sometimes it's the poor, sometimes it's more trendy to go and offer emotional support to the more well-to-do because they "look okay but suffer inside."
It's always changing.
Sure, some are better in one area than another, but shouldn't everyone be being bettered by being around Christians and in the church? Why focus on one need over the other, and why put one over the other?
The result seems to be people who gravitate to a church that serves where they are in life and then when they don't need it anymore, they move on.
So why aren't believers trained to care about ALL needs? Use their talents, yes, but don't ignore someone in need because they don't fit into an area you "enjoy" helping.
Why do churches do that when it's clear that churches aren't supposed to put one group of people as more important than another group? Maybe if everyone did what they should, we wouldn't need a zillion special interest groups to keep people interested in praising God and learning more, which is what church is supposed to about, isn't it?
I like that, too, Gina. We do tend to follow fads - even in focusing on "ministering" to specific types of needs. Thought provoking stuff.
I guess I will just have to accept that I am blessed by my ignorance. I know nothing of churches that are against certain groups of people or minister only to certain groups of people.
Is it true that this is happening? Wrong question, I guess, or you would not be posting this information. Let's just say that I'm glad that I cannot testify to that being the case.
However, for the sake of discussion, let's imagine that you have a large garden. You and your family need to tend to it. You don't have enough family members or time to do the whole garden at one time, so you organize your family to start in the tomatos and cucumbers. Once they are done, then you will move on to the corn and beans. Perhaps that is why churches do one or two groups at a time?
Could be, I guess.
As for elephants in the room, I think I CAN see the pride and prejudice elephants very often. I battle my own pride issues quite often.
Is it true that this is happening? Wrong question, I guess, or you would not be posting this information. Let's just say that I'm glad that I cannot testify to that being the case.
However, for the sake of discussion, let's imagine that you have a large garden. You and your family need to tend to it. You don't have enough family members or time to do the whole garden at one time, so you organize your family to start in the tomatos and cucumbers. Once they are done, then you will move on to the corn and beans. Perhaps that is why churches do one or two groups at a time?
Could be, I guess.
As for elephants in the room, I think I CAN see the pride and prejudice elephants very often. I battle my own pride issues quite often.
4ever4Jesus
New Member
The Elephant in the room to me is the existence of God Himself. The Elephant in an empty room is not even what a child can not miss.
In God’s creation God makes himself known that He truly does exist. Take a look around there are patterns and designs like a signature of work. It almost seems like things have a mind of their own. But truly that God created things to behave just that way both in the organic the living and the non living. In the organic there is plenty of evidence of God that can not be missed. All what we have and see would not make sense by the Laws of chance. This is what Atheists like to lean on theories, chances, time and happenings. They have no reasoning why. They just said it happened.
The Elephant is in the room and you try to pretend the elephant is not there. The evidence is before their eyes but they reason not with God or believe him. They will make up a formula system that sounds well to the rest of us. Many are convinced by this man made formula. But you can not leave the room saying I never seen that Elephant. Or can you? If you believe in God you have seen the Elephant. If you did not it was not because you did not see him you just wanted to make up any excuse why the Elephant was not there. And for that reason any reason one might say God is not there when things He made are very obvious we can’t deny.
I used to believe the Bible was only part true but I did not doubt that no God existed. Even a Child can see God through His works. Don’t let go of the child inside of you. See things how they are. Believe what you seen. That’s God alright. That is his Workmanship is. You just can’t miss it like you can’t miss an Elephant with pink dots on it.
In God’s creation God makes himself known that He truly does exist. Take a look around there are patterns and designs like a signature of work. It almost seems like things have a mind of their own. But truly that God created things to behave just that way both in the organic the living and the non living. In the organic there is plenty of evidence of God that can not be missed. All what we have and see would not make sense by the Laws of chance. This is what Atheists like to lean on theories, chances, time and happenings. They have no reasoning why. They just said it happened.
The Elephant is in the room and you try to pretend the elephant is not there. The evidence is before their eyes but they reason not with God or believe him. They will make up a formula system that sounds well to the rest of us. Many are convinced by this man made formula. But you can not leave the room saying I never seen that Elephant. Or can you? If you believe in God you have seen the Elephant. If you did not it was not because you did not see him you just wanted to make up any excuse why the Elephant was not there. And for that reason any reason one might say God is not there when things He made are very obvious we can’t deny.
I used to believe the Bible was only part true but I did not doubt that no God existed. Even a Child can see God through His works. Don’t let go of the child inside of you. See things how they are. Believe what you seen. That’s God alright. That is his Workmanship is. You just can’t miss it like you can’t miss an Elephant with pink dots on it.