quantumfaith
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I am in total agreement with you Winman, the pages of scripture are filled with illustrations of man "resisting" and "refusing" God.
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Is Irresistible Grace "resistible"?
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I am in total agreement with you Winman, the pages of scripture are filled with illustrations of man "resisting" and "refusing" God.
Good, now that youve had your say, why dont you just shut up then.
Q.... Didnt I say this back on post #8? Why are you guys belaboring this?
Here is my quote:
Boice indicates that the term "Irristable Grace" is misleading...It does not mean that God drags you Kicking & Screaming into the kingdom. Boice prefers "Efficacious Grace" be used.
quantumfaith
Active Member
EWF: Currently reading about the topic of efficacious grace, may have more to say, if when I can wrap my "arms around" it.
Bro, I gave you a good book to read up on this stuff. Im not suggesting it to fool anyone. Its well written & comprehensive
You're not the only one who has said it to these guys. I've said it a dozen times. I've read others say it to them.
We have said repeatedly that God's grace is resistable until it is not.
We have said very clearly that all that man can DO is resist God's grace until God gives him a new heart.
We have said that irresistable grace simply means that man cannot resist God's grace when God gets ready to save. Hecertainly WILL resist it until then.
Winman posts a billion verses thinking that makes him the victor that say nothing agaisnt the Calvinistic doctrine of irresistable grace.
We are wasting our time saying it again and again when they refuse to get it.
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Nobody said anything about "kicking and screaming" but that fact it is not able to be resisted.
Come on web, you know this is being beaten into the ground.....and by educated people too. enough is enough.
quantumfaith
Active Member
You are "almost" running yourself in circles Luke, the point the "rest" of are trying to make, is man can also resist God regenerating him, or as you say, "giving" him a new heart. Man can resist God all the way to the end of his life. But then you would probably say. "he wasnt going to be a recipient of this grace anyway". Sadly, man can say no to God. God has granted him that right, privilege and responsibility. Man cannot save himself, but he can reject God's offer of that salvation.
Just drop it tonight, Im tired of this bickering nonsense. Most people dont enter into Reformed Theology readily unless they have researched it & have become very acquainted with the doctrines. I fought Limited Atonement & Predestination up until I had enough information & life experience with it personally. Others are born in it, as my wife was & then indoctrinated. Most are happy with their pastors, go to church weekly & pray to Jesus. Why then are there people on here bent on critiquing? Its just insane.
Isa 63:7 I will mention the lovingkindnesses of the LORD, and the praises of the LORD, according to all that the LORD hath bestowed on us, and the great goodness toward the house of Israel, which he hath bestowed on them according to his mercies, and according to the multitude of his lovingkindnesses.
8 For he said, Surely they are my people, children that will not lie: so he was their Saviour.
9 In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them: in his love and in his pity he redeemed them; and he bare them, and carried them all the days of old.
10 But they rebelled, and vexed his holy Spirit: therefore he was turned to be their enemy, and he fought against them.
Isaiah speaks here of God's lovingkindnesses, great goodness, and mercy toward Israel. He was their Saviour, he saved them, in his love and in his pity redeemed them, bared and carried them.
Does that sound like grace?
And what did they do? They rebelled and vexed his Holy Spirit.
God's grace can be resisted.
8 For he said, Surely they are my people, children that will not lie: so he was their Saviour.
9 In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them: in his love and in his pity he redeemed them; and he bare them, and carried them all the days of old.
10 But they rebelled, and vexed his holy Spirit: therefore he was turned to be their enemy, and he fought against them.
Isaiah speaks here of God's lovingkindnesses, great goodness, and mercy toward Israel. He was their Saviour, he saved them, in his love and in his pity redeemed them, bared and carried them.
Does that sound like grace?
And what did they do? They rebelled and vexed his Holy Spirit.
God's grace can be resisted.
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No, just a sinner saved by God's grace.
Please answer the question, does Isaiah 63:7-10 show God showing great grace toward Israel? Did they resist it?
Good, then your in the same boat as everyone else.
What boat are you in?
And try answering the question, did Israel receive great grace from God? Did they resist it?
No I wont even look at your question. Go away
Typical. You know for a fact that this passage clearly shows God showing great grace toward Israel. And it is speaking of salvation, it directly says he is their Saviour, he saved them, and he redeemed them.
And yet, they rebelled against God and vexed his Holy Spirit.
You just don't like the truth.
No it means I have nothing & will never have anything to discuss with you. And because your unusually thick its obvious you dont see this. youve insulted me, my faith, and my family & my friends. Thus I will never have any discussion with you. Now, leave me alone. Are we clear.
The reason you don't like me is because I present much scripture that refutes your false doctrine. And it is not difficult, if you spend time in the scriptures you will easily see that for yourself.
If you don't want to talk to me, that's fine. There are more than a few Calvinists here that have a strong dislike for me because I constantly present scripture that refutes it. That's OK, you are entitled to believe whatever you want.
I fully realize that many Calvinists are completely indoctrinated. But there are a few who can think for themselves. It is for those who want to truly know what the scriptures teach that I present these scriptures.
Now, I don't for one second think I know or understand everything about the Bible. But I know this, it clearly refutes Calvinism.
Of course. God is resisted everyday. You resisted God before you were saved. Irresistible grace doesn't mean that God cannot be resisted. It's a terrible title, I'll give you that. It's a misleading title. It's not that one cannot resist, but that when God want's to save him, God will save him. At THAT moment, not before, His grace is irresistible. And it's not that you come dragging your feet. It's that God changes your hear and you want nothing more than to come to him. kinda like a dessert that's "irresistible."
Now, please represent the doctrine correctly. If it is wrong(and I know you think it is) then you should be able to accurately present the doctrine and not give a straw man. Looking at the title and giving a definition that no Calvinist would give you is a straw man.
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