The Gift of Prophecy

[evangelist6589]

Spoke with a gal the other day whom told me she had this gift. But her definition was that she could foresee things, and knew things about people that they never told her. I asked for a biblical passage that describes this gift in this way and she only gave me her experience. I do not know if a devil is giving her these revelations about people as this would not be possible (I do not think) if she is a born again believer. Demons/fallen angels can pick up on phone conversations and conversations and then deliver this, and this is called the gift of prophecy by this gals definition.

I also believe to have this gift, and according to an in depth look at this gift by a Charles Stanley sermon, what she describes as the gift is very very unbiblical. Charles Stanley is against the third wave/signs & wonders & word of faith movements. Dr. Stanley referred often to the apostle Peter in his sermon and compared and contrasted him with the gift of prophecy. He was very biblical in his approach to this gift, and unfortunately many under the third wave movement have a very unbiblical perspective on the gifts of the spirit.

What do you say?


John

 

[Van]

Hi John, let me start at the beginning and sorry if I should have taken all this for granted.

Prophecy is used in two ways in scripture, one is conveying what God told you to tell others, i.e. to speak the words of a Prophet, and the other way is to speak the truth concerning God's revealed word. Two entirely different gifts.

I am what is called a "cessationalist" which holds the gift of prophecy ended in the first century, now we have teachers of the word, but no one is currently gifted to add to God's word with new revelation.

So if your friend is claiming God speaks to her for the purpose of revealing His will for others, then based on my understanding of the text she is delusional.

OTOH, 1 Cor. 12:10 refers to various gifts including the gift of prophecy, so if not revealing God's will based on personal revelation, what is in view. Here I believe Paul's idea is of being able to explain God's word such at those being taught understand it correctly.

Anyway, that is my two cents worth.

 

[Tom Butler]

Do you know if this woman has ever been wrong about one of her prophecies?

Remember how God said we could recognize if a prophet was coming from God? He had to be 100% right 100% of the time.

 

[freeatlast]

I am kind of in line with the responses. I agree that prophesy has to sides. One is new revelation and that has passed as there will be no new revelation. Nothing is going to be added to scripture. The other is the ability to understand and reveal what has already been given. I believe that part is still alive and well. We would hope our preachers and teachers have this part, or can read and learn from those who do.
I agree if anyone says they are giving new information not revealed in the bible they have to be 100% accurate 100% of the time or they are false prophets.
I will say, this thing of telling someone about something extra biblical is not the gift of prophesy. If God wants to communicate with someone He can and does not need any go between other then what He has set up for the church and how it is to operate with preacher/teachers.

My guess is that she is not going to listen to anything you say so the best thing is to pray for her and RUN!

 

[JesusFan]

Spoke with a gal the other day whom told me she had this gift. But her definition was that she could foresee things, and knew things about people that they never told her. I asked for a biblical passage that describes this gift in this way and she only gave me her experience. I do not know if a devil is giving her these revelations about people as this would not be possible (I do not think) if she is a born again believer. Demons/fallen angels can pick up on phone conversations and conversations and then deliver this, and this is called the gift of prophecy by this gals definition.

I also believe to have this gift, and according to an in depth look at this gift by a Charles Stanley sermon, what she describes as the gift is very very unbiblical. Charles Stanley is against the third wave/signs & wonders & word of faith movements. Dr. Stanley referred often to the apostle Peter in his sermon and compared and contrasted him with the gift of prophecy. He was very biblical in his approach to this gift, and unfortunately many under the third wave movement have a very unbiblical perspective on the gifts of the spirit.

What do you say?


John

As the resident 'baptacostalist" here on the BB!

Would say that the office of the prophet has been officially closed with the canon of scripture, as that is all that we would to have 'revelaed" to us concerning future evnts, as they were inspired by God to give forth revelation to their immediate time era, and to us today!

Would say this the gift of prophesy would still be operational even today, but not is same sense as giving forth future 'revelations", but in sense that the Lord can either give you the means to "understand/apply" prophesy for today, or else grant one an immediate knowledge/wisom for someone in local assembly...

ALWAYS remember that the Bible is primary and ONLY fully infallible and inspired revelation from God to man today!

 

[plain_n_simple]

Desire the gifts

 

[evangelist6589]

Thanks for the replies. I do not agree that the gift of prophecy has ceased (at least the way Dr. Stanley defined it). I believe that tongues, miracles, and healings ceased, but all other gifts are in operation. I do not know how people get from scripture some of their conclusions. When Dr. Stanley explained this gift back in 2006 or 2007 he went right from the scripture.

 

[plain_n_simple]

God did not cease any of the nine. Funny how people say some gifts are no longer given, but others are. Anyone can say they have the gift of knowledge, wisdom, descerning of spirits and faith. Most Christians are quick to acknowledge these because they are so easy to proclaim with very little or no evidence. Tongues and interpretation of tongues is plain spooky for most so it's easy to throw out those gifts because of what Paul said about them. Forget about what they are for, get rid of them. Prophecy is a little more difficult but most Christians water it down with the excuse that all the prophecies have been given in scripture. God gives the prophecy gift for a reason. Then comes the tough ones. Miracles and healings. Here's the main excuse: "Those are no longer needed because we have the completed scripture." What they are realy saying is: "If we can't do it, take it off the list. Twist some scripture to justify it." It looks to me like we have built doctrine to fit what we cannot do. It would be honest and refreshing if we could just say "I don't have that gift but I know God did not reduce the list from 9 to 4." Don't let a lack of experience and belief write your doctrine. Just because you have not seen or experienced some of the gifts, does not mean they do not exist. He said we will do His works. Desire the gifts. They edify and confirm.

 

[JesusFan]

God did not cease any of the nine. Funny how people say some gifts are no longer given, but others are. Anyone can say they have the gift of knowledge, wisdom, descerning of spirits and faith. Most Christians are quick to acknowledge these because they are so easy to proclaim with very little or no evidence. Tongues and interpretation of tongues is plain spooky for most so it's easy to throw out those gifts because of what Paul said about them. Forget about what they are for, get rid of them. Prophecy is a little more difficult but most Christians water it down with the excuse that all the prophecies have been given in scripture. God gives the prophecy gift for a reason. Then comes the tough ones. Miracles and healings. Here's the main excuse: "Those are no longer needed because we have the completed scripture." What they are realy saying is: "If we can't do it, take it off the list. Twist some scripture to justify it." It looks to me like we have built doctrine to fit what we cannot do. It would be honest and refreshing if we could just say "I don't have that gift but I know God did not reduce the list from 9 to 4." Don't let a lack of experience and belief write your doctrine. Just because you have not seen or experienced some of the gifts, does not mean they do not exist. He said we will do His works. Desire the gifts. They edify and confirm.

Just curious...

Do you hold to a'classic" pentacostal view reagrding this?
thereis a second act of Grace "baptism in Holy Ghost"?
Tongues evidence of that?

Do you hold to modern Apostle/prophets, and that we have word of fath/healings/prosperity etc now?

 

[plain_n_simple]

I read my bible and have been involved in and witnessed gifts and healings. They did not happen because of some method or doctrine. I do not hold to any Pentecostal doctrines. Alot are fake and have no use. I saw it happen. I prayed and it happened. It reflects the bible. It's that simple.

 

[JesusFan]

I read my bible and have been involved in and witnessed gifts and healings. They did not happen because of some method or doctrine. I do not hold to any Pentecostal doctrines. Alot are fake and have no use. I saw it happen. I prayed and it happened. It reflects the bible. It's that simple.

thanks!

What does God use tongues/prophesing for than today in the church?

 

[plain_n_simple]

Edification and confirms the one speaking

 

[JesusFan]

Edification and confirms the one speaking

Does your Baptist Church official see the Spiritual Gifts continuing for today?

Which group does it belong to in Baptist circles

 

[plain_n_simple]

Does your Baptist Church official see the Spiritual Gifts continuing for today?
I never asked. Jesus is my official.
Which group does it belong to in Baptist circles
I never considered or cared once I saw a healing. It seemed worthless to justify a miracle with people that do not believe. The people that belong to a circle keep going round in circles lol.

 

[JesusFan]

Does your Baptist Church official see the Spiritual Gifts continuing for today?
I never asked. Jesus is my official.
Which group does it belong to in Baptist circles
I never considered or cared once I saw a healing. It seemed worthless to justify a miracle with people that do not believe. The people that belong to a circle keep going round in circles lol.

Are you officially a Baptist Christian than?

 

[plain_n_simple]

Are you officially a Baptist Christian than?

What would that matter if I saw a miracle and participated in another, knowing that Jesus heals and the devil comes to steal, kill, and destroy? When I saw a womans hearing restored, I did not pull out my Baptist membership card to confirm I attend a Baptist church lol. I cried and praised God!

 

[JesusFan]

What would that matter if I saw a miracle and participated in another, knowing that Jesus heals and the devil comes to steal, kill, and destroy? When I saw a womans hearing restored, I did not pull out my Baptist membership card to confirm I attend a Baptist church lol. I cried and praised God!

How would you know if the miracles/healings were from God, not false ones by Satanic forces though?

 

[plain_n_simple]

The devil comes to kill steal and destroy. "In Jesus name hearing be new." The gospel is preached in word and power. If Satan is healing in Jesus' name, and Satan took the hearing away to begin with, Satan sure has changed from what my bible told me about the roaring lion. In the last days, they will call evil good, and good evil.

 

[The Biblicist]

How would you know if the miracles/healings were from God, not false ones by Satanic forces though?

Here you are getting to the real crux of this issue. Plain_and_simple has refused to subject his eye witness experience to the criteria's set forth in the Scriptures.

However, this not surprising. When it comes down to their "experience" versus God's Word as final authority, their experience always trumps God's Word!

Often they respond the have not's cannot judge the have's, which means they do not believe you are qualified to speak about their "experiences" if you have never experienced what they claim to experience. Hence, a "gnostic" response.

According to that theory, we would have experience homosexuality, fornication, murder, adultery, etc., etc., before we could qualify to make a sound judgment on such things. In other words the plain teaching of God's Word is either insufficient OR all who are without their "experience" are not spiritually capable of discerning God's Word correctly.

Plain_and_simple responds like most charismatics when you challenge their experiences by the criteria from God's Word.

Good luck, because I could never get him to answer simple investigative questions about his "experience."

 

[plain_n_simple]

What do you require to qualify whether or not a miracle is from God?