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Limited or Definite Atonement is the Gospel !

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Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
savedbymercy said:
It has everything to do, Christ, the Head of the Church is Abraham's Seed ! You deny that as well ? Gal 3:16

16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Now is that Christ the same as this one ? Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.
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Apostle paul stated that the promise was made to the seed (singular) of Abraham, in that the coming Messiah would be the One sent from God thru which all on earth would be blessed!

those who place who have faith like Abraham, who trust in his seed the Messiah, would be blessed and part of the family of God!

the Lord saves ALL through the atonement of Jesus upon the Cross, but God has His OT believers under Old Covenant, NT believers under new Covenant in the Church, those to be saved after the Rapture etc!
 
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savedbymercy

New Member
yesh

Apostle paul stated that the promise was made to the seed (singular) of Abraham
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I just quoted that Gal 3:16, that seed is Christ ! Now Christ, the Seed of Abraham is the Head of the Church ! Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

Is that the same Christ that is the seed of Abraham in Gal 3:16 or not ?
 
Y

Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
savedbymercy said:
yesh



I just quoted that Gal 3:16, that seed is Christ ! Now Christ, the Seed of Abraham is the Head of the Church ! Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

Is that the same Christ that is the seed of Abraham in Gal 3:16 or not ?
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Abraham was justified by God, basis of the coming atonement to be done by Messiah jesus, but STILL he had to place faith in the promised messiah to come!
Abraham part of the family of God, just not in the Church!
 
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savedbymercy

New Member
yesh

Abraham was justified by God
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Answer the question ! Is Christ the Seed of Abraham Gal 3:16

16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Is that Christ, the Seed of Abraham, the Head of the Church ? Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ[The Seed of Abraham] is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

Is the Seed of Abraham the Head of the Church ? Yes or no, according to the scripture I have provided !
 
The Biblicist

The Biblicist

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
savedbymercy said:
yesh



Answer the question ! Is Christ the Seed of Abraham Gal 3:16

16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Is that Christ, the Seed of Abraham, the Head of the Church ? Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ[The Seed of Abraham] is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

Is the Seed of Abraham the Head of the Church ? Yes or no, according to the scripture I have provided !
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Answering the question does not prove your interpretation of the answer. In fact the very fact that he was the seed of Abraham and head of the church proves the contrary to your position. He was not ALREADY and LITERALLY the seed of Abraham and head of the church before the world began but had to come and be born the seed of Abraham and had to build and become the head of the church in time and space. Likewise, until one is justified through faith they are still UNJUSTIFIED and thus still under CONDEMNATION as that is the reality for all who are not justified. Your response is to confuse the PURPOSE of justification with the actual APPLICATION of justification which is wrong.
 
The Biblicist

The Biblicist

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
savedbymercy said:
bib



Then you answer it !
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I did! He was slain from the foundation of the world in purpose and in type but not in reality and in time until the cross. He was the head of the church before the world began as far as purpose but he was not the head literally in time until he first built the church in his own ministry prior to Pentecost.

The term "head" is never used metaphorically for spiritual union but solely for "authority." The false idea of "spiritual union" applied to Ephesians 1:22 would demand pantheism. Spiritual union is obtained by regeneration not church membership which is obtained by water baptism. Metaphorically there is more than one kind of "head" over the body of Christ as 1 Corinthians 13:21 clearly states:

And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.

The term "head" in reference to Christ over the congregation simply means "final authority" as there are other lower levels of authorities that Christ has placed over the congregation which also are metaphorically represented by the term "head." Just as the term "head" is used figuratively of "authority" in 1 Cor. 11:3 in multiple lower levels of authority.
 
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savedbymercy

New Member
The Biblicist said:
Look carefully at Post #45
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I looked at it. What is your answer to this question.

Is the Christ, Abraham's Seed Gal 3:16

16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Is that Christ the same Christ that is the Head of the Church, here Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

Would I be correct in saying that the Seed of Abraham is the Head of the Church ? Yes or NO !
 
The Biblicist

The Biblicist

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
savedbymercy said:
I looked at it. What is your answer to this question.

Is the Christ, Abraham's Seed Gal 3:16

16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

Is that Christ the same Christ that is the Head of the Church, here Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

Would I be correct in saying that the Seed of Abraham is the Head of the Church ? Yes or NO !
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The "seed" of Abraham refers to his HUMANITY through the lineage of Abraham. The metaphor "head" of the church refers to his POSITION of Authority over the church. They are not equal terms with equal meaning or equal application.
 
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savedbymercy

New Member
bib

Yes it is the same Person
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Ok then. The Seed of Abraham is the Head of His Body the Church, and Abraham is not part of the Body His Seed is the Head of ? I cannot conceive of that, no scripture indicates that !
 
The Biblicist

The Biblicist

Well-Known Member
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savedbymercy said:
bib



Ok then. The Seed of Abraham is the Head of His Body the Church, and Abraham is not part of the Body His Seed is the Head of ? I cannot conceive of that, no scripture indicates that !
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As I said, your error is in the application of "seed" versus "head" and in your confusion of salvation with the body of Christ.

Abraham was not a member of the body of Christ as Paul explicitly states that he apostles were "FIRST" added to the church (1 Cor. 12:28; Eph. 2:20).
 
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savedbymercy

New Member
The Biblicist said:
As I said, your error is in the application of "seed" versus "head" and in your confusion of salvation with the body of Christ.

Abraham was not a member of the body of Christ as Paul explicitly states that he apostles were "FIRST" added to the church (1 Cor. 12:28; Eph. 2:20).
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The Seed of Abraham is the Head of the Church !
 
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savedbymercy

New Member
TCassidy said:
No, I am disagreeing with your false interpretation. :)
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Do you deny that the Seed of Abraham Christ Gal 3:16 is the Head of the Body the Church ?

16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.


Eph 5:23

23For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

There is no way that Abraham's Seed can be the Head of the Church, and Abraham be not part of the Church, his seed is the Head of !
 
TCassidy

TCassidy

Late-Administator Emeritus
Administrator
savedbymercy said:
Do you deny that the Seed of Abraham Christ Gal 3:16 is the Head of the Body the Church ?
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I believe that Christ is the seed of Abraham (according to the flesh).

And I believe that Christ was the Pastor of His church (the 12 and those who followed them amounting to 120 by the day of Pentecost).

I believe that Christ is the Head of every New Testament church today. The pastors are subordinate to Christ.

What you don't seem to understand is that there is no universal, invisible, mystical "church." The bible calls that entity "The Family of God" or "The Kingdom of God on Earth."
 
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