(See bold) That is one of the most historically inaccurate statements I have ever seen. At the end of the first century, the NT orders of ministry were still in place in which bishop/pastor/elder/presbyter were one and the same office. Monarchical bishops and bishops as a third order of ministry were late second century developments.
I thought I would not continue to get into this, but I must correct blatant error. Some of your points are valid, but you cannot defend them from historical inaccuracy.
BTW, this is not meant to be a personal attack.
Ok, timothys letters as best I can tell show tim, titus too as the lead over the church of an area. An area of thousands didn't meat in one house. There were multiple locations in a location. They were over them. You have to rewrite history to poo poo this away that easily.
Clement wrote as a leader to a leader. The Bishop in Corinth was leading excommunications of former teachers, which you say os the same office. Hmmmmm seems it would be hard for one pastor, to run around excommunicating other pastors and stir up such an uproar.
Tnerefore the Bishop at Corinth was over many other Pastors and there were levels of pastoral folk with an area leader. Other points in Clement's letter bsck this up as well.
Now, I would refute your claim, but what you have done was spit on the birthday cake and said you were running home.
You assert I'm historically inaccurate in an exagerated way. You offer one reason only, your personal proclamation that the church was..... a way clement said it wasnt; assert I'm wrong about history; declare you can't t8lerate the unhistorical facts; offer nothing but your declaration that I'm not historical.
Clement's letter is a big part of the history of this period. It backs me up. Show me otherwise, or stop flapping the jaws to posture at my expense. :tonofbricks:
The fact is, from those I have witnessed, the issue is more of not liking when they aren't allowed to make Rcc are evil proclamations unchallenged. When challenged here things get .......crabby....... and folk start rewriting scripture and all to suit their needs, making personal attacks, and leaving unrefuted the arguments that dejustified their position. And, love you guys you have a tough job as sheriffs in a place like this, but its from the top down. Which is why its allowed to be so out of line rude regarding catholics, gays, etc. Yo7 violate the boards rules, but as someone said, its catholics, its always in the rules if it's catholics.
So, all this we are spiritually correct on these issues, na na na na na na I don't hear what you say I am too busy being right, na na na na, and its our duty to judge rcc's and correct them, even though they are more in line with biblical claims tnan "I am".... well its transparent bigotry. You can put as much lipstick as you want on that pig, but that is what it is. I figure if its ok for you to get that personal, and you f3el you are obligated to tell them what you see is so obvious, then I would have the same obligation that you have.
However since my observation isn't what you want to hear, I'm likely to upset the unholy huddle around here and be banned. Since this sin, falls from the top of this board down to the members, all I can do is the matthew 18, share my observations.
I would suggest one of you sherrifs read the book unChristian. The arrogance I've experienced here shows its a rampant need to understand what the book discusses.
The, we are right the world is wrong, we must attack others and defend our beliefs, up to cramming them down your throat, theology, is how the fine baptist organaztion, Ku Klux Klan was founded.
Now I'm not saying you are the kkk. But they are bible based, based for religious reasons, established by baptist congrgation of churches, to protect their beliefs from corruptable things, like black me with white women, black men drinking from my fountain, etc.... here its much holier, its I judge and condemn this group and that one, because they understand the bible differently than I do. So they are stupid idiots and won't learn they deserve what they got coming.
The two men eating meat said not to challenge these things between yourselves. Discuss them? Fine! But to judge them and attack them so? Folks you are vomiting pure vitriol here, and justifying it as doing god's work.
So, I will take my heretical self and say my good byes, as I'm sure I'm on the shortest of short lists here, but I would be very unbiblical not to make you aware of how pompously arrogant, naieve, and hateful the air on here is.
I can stay for checks and balances reasons, or you can ban me because you can't refute me, either way I'm fine with it. But there is little debate, more like an intellectual gang bang on anyone that don't pat you on the back and doesn't know the good ole boy handshake.
