CAn A catholic Agree with me That we aLL are saints to god as Much As mary/Apostles?

[The Biblicist]

I'm sorry Trinity is an essential belief.

Can't read to well can you? I did not say the "DOCTRINE" of the trinity is not essential, what I said was that the "TERM" trinity was not essential.

Tertullian wasn't always a Montanist and he did coin the phrase Trinity as it wasn't named previously but it was believed it just wasn't defined.

Ahhh! Confession is good for the soul. Hence, the term is not essential for the doctrine! Neither did the council of Nicea coin the term! Hence, the doctrine is provided by the scriptures not by Nicean council. Hence, the doctrine was believed WITHOUT the term "trinity" and BEFORE and thus WITHOUT the Nicean council. And so it can be taught today by scriptures alone without every mentioning the word "trinity."

 

[Yeshua1]

Can't read to well can you? I did not say the "DOCTRINE" of the trinity is not essential, what I said was that the "TERM" trinity was not essential.




Ahhh! Confession is good for the soul. Hence, the term is not essential for the doctrine! Neither did the council of Nicea coin the term! Hence, the doctrine is provided by the scriptures not by Nicean council. Hence, the doctrine was believed WITHOUT the term "trinity" and BEFORE and thus WITHOUT the Nicean council. And so it can be taught today by scriptures alone without every mentioning the word "trinity."

just because the Apostles did not define it with exact greek words that the Council did when describing the nature of the trinity does NOT mean that they did not know it, nor that early church did not either!

 

[Thinkingstuff]

paul called Jesus the "express image" of the invisible God, so that he was the exact likeness of God in bodily form!

can you claim that?

And same Apostle called the Spirit of Christ is the Lord!

Regardless of greek term he sused, meant jesus and the Spirit are both God!

Its not regardless because it wasn't defined at that time. At the time of the Apostles the comon teaching was that there was one God. That Jesus was the Son of God yet still God and that the Holy Spirit too was God. That that is how the belief was for a long time. However in an effort to understand this Mystery that God is one yet Jesus and the Holy Spirit is God many theories started to arise. Modalism was one 1 God expressing himself in 3 ways tri-deism where there were three Gods the father being the greatest the son being less and the Holy Spirit the activity of God since these issues weren't really raised during The apostolic period there was no need to teach on the Trinity. However The Church inspired by the Holy Spirit sought to clarify exactly what was meant and declare these other beliefs heresy. And that was done at Nicea in 325 at a church council to which you all hold to the belief espoused by this council otherwise you would hold the belief of the earliest Christians and not bother whether Jesus was homoosious with the father or anything else. You would be limited to Yes Jesus was God yes the Father is God yes the Holy Spirit is God. Yes there is only one God. Well how does that work? It just does. Is Jesus the sames substance as God. Well not really sure but he's God so maybe. However, you've all taken on the teachings of the Catholic church of Nicea and and use the Term Trinity to express exactly what you mean. And that is a Catholic teaching.

 

[Yeshua1]

Its not regardless because it wasn't defined at that time. At the time of the Apostles the comon teaching was that there was one God. That Jesus was the Son of God yet still God and that the Holy Spirit too was God. That that is how the belief was for a long time. However in an effort to understand this Mystery that God is one yet Jesus and the Holy Spirit is God many theories started to arise. Modalism was one 1 God expressing himself in 3 ways tri-deism where there were three Gods the father being the greatest the son being less and the Holy Spirit the activity of God since these issues weren't really raised during The apostolic period there was no need to teach on the Trinity. However The Church inspired by the Holy Spirit sought to clarify exactly what was meant and declare these other beliefs heresy. And that was done at Nicea in 325 at a church council to which you all hold to the belief espoused by this council otherwise you would hold the belief of the earliest Christians and not bother whether Jesus was homoosious with the father or anything else. You would be limited to Yes Jesus was God yes the Father is God yes the Holy Spirit is God. Yes there is only one God. Well how does that work? It just does. Is Jesus the sames substance as God. Well not really sure but he's God so maybe. However, you've all taken on the teachings of the Catholic church of Nicea and and use the Term Trinity to express exactly what you mean. And that is a Catholic teaching.

Again, the Apostolic Church was taught and knew God as a trinity, the Councils just formalized it, due to those heresies creeping in, as was foretold by the Apostles by the Holy Spirit!

 

[Thinkingstuff]

Again, the Apostolic Church was taught and knew God as a trinity, the Councils just formalized it, due to those heresies creeping in, as was foretold by the Apostles by the Holy Spirit!

No it didn't because Trinity isn't anywhere in scripture. Neither is Homoosious. Those Heresies flurished just because things weren't defined so the One Holy and Apostolic Church did just that.

 

[Yeshua1]

No it didn't because Trinity isn't anywhere in scripture. Neither is Homoosious. Those Heresies flurished just because things weren't defined so the One Holy and Apostolic Church did just that.

the RCC did what the Apostles either failed to do, could not do?

You dare to presume the RCC has authority to do what Apostles could not, in your opinion?

 

[Thinkingstuff]

the RCC did what the Apostles either failed to do, could not do?

The Church Carried on the faith the Apostles gave them and defined doctrine because these weren't issues in the apostolic times. Just like today what would the apostles say about doing away with modern technology? Well, they certainly didn't address it in scripture but we can determine that they used the Technology of their day as Paul tells Timothy to drink a little wine to settle his stomach. If Pepto Bismo were around would he have said use it? Who knows because it wasn't an issue. However the Amish would disagree with you about using present technology.

You dare to presume the RCC has authority to do what Apostles could not, in your opinion?

You dare come at me without studing at least a little of Christian history? The Church carries on the Apostolic Tradition and God by Jesus words himself not only established the Church but gave it the authority to deal with those issues that niether Jesus nor the Apostles dealt with directly. For instance Birth Control what do you believe about that what does scriptures explicitly teach about those issues. Pretty seroius questions those. How about abort effacient. Scripture doesn't really deal with abortion save that if a man accidently kills an unborn baby he's guilty for that life. But apart from that where is the clear teaching in scripture? Where does it say a woman cannot abort an unborn child. Certainly it talks about not sacrificing living Children to pagan deities but what specifically about abortion? How about abort effacient drugs? I mean we can gleen from scripture what God most likely would have us do by what was written about life and the value of human life but there is a belief that if a fetus isn't to a certain point in its development its not really a human and not given its rights. Where exactly does scripture say life is human. Scripture has david saying you knew me in my mothers womb but scripture also suggest that God knew people before they were concieved do pre-concieved people have rights? And certainly what do you believe about contraception? Peter and Jesus or Paul never broached the subject.