Featured Pastor and Teacher, or Pastor/Teacher?

I'm putting this in this forum since it is a matter of ecclesiology.

On the NA28 thread in the Bible Versions forum the subject of Eph. 4:11 came up when I opined that John MacArthur was mistaken in his interpretation of it. MacArthur teaches that in that verse, the terms "pastors" and "teachers" are talking about the same individuals, based on the Granville Sharp rule of koine Greek grammar. So instead of both pastors and teachers in the church, we have pastor/teachers, one office.

I object to this interpretation on several grounds.

(1) MacArthur is misusing the Granville Sharp rule, which states that when there is the formation in the Greek, definite article + noun + kai (kai, "and") + noun, the two nouns are referring to the same person. But old Granville (the grammarian's name) only applied the rule to singular nouns, not plural, as MacArthur would have it. There are scholars who disagree with me, including a Greek scholar friend, but no less than Daniel Wallace did his dissertation on this, coming out on Granville's side. See a condensation of it at: http://bible.org/article/sharp-redivivus-reexamination-granville-sharp-rule. See a simpler explanation at: http://www.biblicalevangelist.org/index.php?id=1039&issue=Volume+41% 2C+Number+4.

(2) I see nowhere else in the NT where we might interpret that pastor and teacher are one and the same.

(3) It seems very plain from other passages that there are teachers who are not pastors: Acts 13:1, 1 Cor. 12:28, Heb. 5:12.

Personally, I highly value many of my teachers (who were not pastors) in Bible college and seminary over the years, not to mention the many wonderful SS teachers I've had or known. I think it is "dissing" them to not include them as important to Christ's church.

Caveat: I think one person can be a pastor, a teacher, or both. But they are not the same office.

 

Hi, Mexdeaf.

Jesus and Paul were both pastors and teachers, of course. Jesus was also called apostle and prophet in the NT, but no one wants to call Him a shepherd/apostle or a prophet/teacher. So I distinguish between Him being both a pastor and teacher, and the pastor/teacher paradigm, in which I see no room for a Bible teacher who is not a pastor, like for example many of our teachers at Temple: Fred Afman, Wymal Porter, etc.

Also, think of the pastors who are great leaders and motivators, but lousy preachers and teachers. The pastor/teacher paradigm would leave them out as un-Biblical.

 

I've heard it occasionally down through the years, but MacArthur is the one who uses the GS rule specifically

Would that have been Don Jennings? A great preacher, but I don't remember him referencing the Greek.

Would your NT Survey teacher have been a pastor/teacher or just a teacher? :smilewinkgrin: I remember a number of our great teachers there who did not pastor: Fred Afman, Wymal Porter, Dennis Wisdom. My Uncle Roger Martin pastored for years, but then for many years was "just" a teacher.

If Eph. 4:11 is a case of the GS applied to the plural, it is indeed unique there in the NT. However, there are plenty of cases in the NT where the plural construction is specifically about two groups, in particular many cases where scribes and Pharisees are mentioned: Matt. 5:20, 12:38, 15:1, etc. Or, where Pharisees and Sadducees appear: Matt. 3:7, 16:1, etc.

Daniel Wallace points out that the Greek commentators who argue for pastor/teacher in Eph. 4:11 don't give linguistic proof. However, there are usages outside the NT where a case for the plural might be made. My Greek prof friend says he'd love to mentor a PhD student who wants to do a dissertation updating the GS.

Actually, there are a number of passages where teachers are portrayed as an office: Acts 13:1, 1 Cor. 12:28-29 (where it is lined up with apostles and prophets), Heb. 5:12, etc. I think also that the teacher is in mind in 1 Tim. 5:17: "Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine (didaskalia, "teaching")."

Can you give me any instance (other than Eph. 4:11) where the pastor/teacher paradigm is clear?

I heard it rattle in there. :wavey:

 

I'm curious. Where in Scripture would you find that the pastor must be a teacher? I view him as a leader, a motivator for the Christian life, a shepherd (counselor). He may or may not be a teacher.

 

"If..."? :smilewinkgrin:

 

I agree. Timothy was told to be "apt to teach" (1 Tim. 3:2, 2 Tim. 2:24), but not "be a teacher." The Greek is didaktikos, "able to teach, apt to teach" (Souter), "apt at teaching" (Abbot-Smith).

 

Sorry, we're in the US until next week, so I don't have access to my MacArthur books. Maybe someone else can help you.

Edited in: Okay, some surfing! Note that on John's church's website it refers to him as "Pastor-teacher" (www.gty.org). So he feels strongly about it. And here's a sermon where he talks about that: http://www.gty.org/resources/Sermons/1926.

To show you that his exegesis is shallow in this sermon, he said, "I might add this, the word pastor only appears once in the whole Bible, and it's here." That's a mistake. The word "pastor" or "pastors" occurs 8 times in Jeremiah in addition to Eph. 4:11. Furthermore, the Greek word translated "pastors" there is poimen, usually translated "shepherd" and occuring 17 times in the NT.

 

I disagree. Don't you know people who could teach but don't?

 

Can you give Scripture for these points?

 

As I've been saying, I don't believe the Greek of Eph. 4:11 does not bear out this (though I'm open to argument on this). But even in English grammar I don't think you can get this. For example, what if I were to say, "There are some eggs, some bacon, and some coffee and donuts." You couldn't say then that the coffee and donuts are the same.