Featured Biblical Argument for Cessationism

You can not teach someone to speak in tongues? The Holy Spirit gives the utterance...but you do have to open your mouth and speak.

 

Tongues were spoken by others..not just the apostles! Prophecy too!

 

1 Corinthians 12:30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?
31 But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.

The inference is: Very few spoke with the Biblical gift of tongues.

 

I have explained this to you before...

As I recall that in every example of people speaking in tongues in the book of Acts, I see that all new believers spoke in tongues. Doesn't it seem like there's a contradiction here? In other words, God shows us groups of people speaking in tongues in the book of Acts, but in the that passages He tells us that speaking in tongues is a gift of the Spirit which only certain people will receive.

Faith is listed as a gift of the Spirit. Does this imply that only certain people will ever have faith? No, because all believers are meant to have faith.

Serving is listed as a spiritual gift. Does this imply that only certain people will ever serve? No, because we are all commanded to be servants (see for example John 13:1-17 and Philippians 2:3-16).

Teaching is listed as a spiritual gift. Does this imply that only certain people will ever teach? No, because we are all commanded to be able to teach (see 2 Timothy 2:24-25).
Encouraging others, contributing to the needs of others, showing mercy to others, helping others, and so on are listed as spiritual gifts. Does this imply that only certain people will ever do these things? No, because we are all commanded to do these things.
Evangelism is listed as a spiritual gift. Does this imply that only certain people will ever share the Gospel? No, because we are all commanded to do evangelism (see Matthew 28:18-20).

There are various things which all believers are told to do, but which certain people will have a special gift for doing. So in a sense there are two forms of these gifts: One form which any believer can do, and another form which is the special gift of the Spirit.
THere are two forms of tongues.. The public form of tongues (which must always be interpreted) edifies the church congregation just as the gift of prophecy does (1 Corinthians 14:5). This is the spiritual gift of tongues because spiritual gifts are given for the public good (1 Corinthians 12:7). The gift of tongues and the gift of interpretation go hand in hand. In contrast, the private form of tongues is for praying to God in the Holy Spirit, and this is the form of tongues which all Christians are told to do.

 

The tongues that people supposedly speak in today are not those mentioned in Scripture which are languages. The tongues of today are unintelligible gibberish. I saw/heard Oral Roberts get excited on TV and start speaking such.

 

Well if Oral Roberts spoke in tongues without interpretation in church, he was out of order.

Point is you can not disprove the real because of the fake! There are fake teachers/preachers etc. But we also have real ones too! There are false christ...but we know there is the Real Christ!

 

Check Acts 1:
Acts 1:15 And in those days Peter stood up in the midst of the disciples, and said, (the number of names together were about an hundred and twenty,)
--There were only 120 disciples at the very most that could speak in tongues.

Acts 2:3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them.
4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
--This refers to the 120, or some say just the 12. Either way it was no more than 120 that could have possibly spoken in tongues.

The Result:
Some accused them of being drunk.
Then Peter preached.
There were about 100,000 Jews present, all unsaved. Out of that number, 3,000 were saved, NONE of which spoke in tongues.

Faith is not a God-given gift for the unsaved. He must come to Christ in faith. Faith is not a gift today, but a fruit of the Spirit. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God. It comes from walking with God, from a close relationship with God. It is not some mystically given gift. It is a simple confidence in the promises of God, that what God has said, God will do.
The gift of the Spirit that is called faith, was something different. It has ceased. It was supernaturally given.

I think it would be wiser to spend the time discussing those gifts which are labeled "sign gifts" for most of us (Baptists) are agreed on that.
When speaking of the gift of tongues there is only one gift, one kind of gift of tongues--and it is a foreign language. It must always be interpreted. It always edifies the church. There is no other kind of tongues spoken of in the Bible.
There is no private form of tongues taught in the Bible. You can say that is what you do, but you can't back it up with Scripture. You pray in nonsense syllables and say it is from God. It isn't. Prayer is communication and you aren't communicating to God. You say you are praying to God in the Holy Spirit. That is a claim, but not a demonstrable claim. You don't know if it is the Holy Spirit or not, because you don't know what you are saying. There is no communication. God doesn't operate that way. There is no such thing as a private prayer language in the Bible. You have not been able to demonstrate that in the Bible.

You have not been able to demonstrate that any of the "sign gifts" are in operation today: miracles, prophecy, revelatory knowledge, Biblical tongues, the gift of healing, etc. Not one of these gifts have you given any evidence that they are still in operation today.

Who can heal like Peter did in Acts 5:16 today? No one can. The gift has ceased, just like tongues.

 

I am only going to touch on a few of these..because the others I have hashed out enough.

Lets look at faith again..
The gift of faith is the supernatural ability to believe God without doubt, combat unbelief, and visualize what God wants to accomplish. It is not only an inner conviction impelled by an urgent and higher calling, but also a supernatural ability to meet adverse circumstances with trust in God's word and messages.

The Bible speaks of several different types of faith which increase from faith to faith (Rom. 1:17):
Saving faith-faith which gets you into heaven (Eph. 2:8-9)
Fruit of faith- faith which gets heaven into you (Gal. 5:22-23)
Gift of faith- stems from saving faith and the fruit of faith; It is the ability to believe for the miraculous (2 Thess. 1:3).

This gift not only operates in healings and in miracles, but in the realm of the impossible as well. Saving faith produces the active faith of the fruit of the Spirit which, in turn, produces the gift of faith. When the gift of faith is empowered, the results are miraculous!

 

If this had to be a supernatural gift then no Christian would serve God today. You do not understand faith. Every person is commanded to have faith. We are commanded to walk by faith. It is not a supernatural ability; it is a command for all.

There are not several different kinds of faith. Faith is used as a verb, as in believing, and as a noun, as in "the faith" that body of doctrine in which we believe.

--trust, confidence, that is all it is. It is not supernatural or magical.

It is one of the fruits of the Spirit because "our faith" has an object. the object of our faith is Jesus Christ, not the world, the flesh, or Satan. That is why it is one of the fruits of the Spirit. It still remains the same--trust, confidence, in the promises of Jesus Christ.

There is no gift of faith, per se. Faith comes from hearing and hearing by the Word of God. Get to know the Word, and your faith will increase. Spend time with the Lord, through his word, and your faith will increase. It is not a magical formula. Faith is trust, confidence.

Nonsense.
No one has the gift of healings today. If they did you would be able to give that evidence. But you can't. That is precisely what irks me on to call you a fraud. You claim things that you cannot verify. You even claim to do things that you can't back up with Scripture such as speaking in tongues. You can't back up your experience with Scripture not even demonstrate that it is a Biblical experience from the Bible.

You are saying that faith produces faith. That is not true.
Read again. It is Romans 10:17:
Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God.
Faith does not come from faith, but from the Word of God.

 

You do realize that there are over 20 apostles named in the NT?

 

What are you going to do with Mark 16..and these signs will follow those that believe the apostles doctrines?

Not sure what you are referring to here?

He is correcting them in a church assembly...he does not forbid praying in the spirit at home!

THere are many values to praying in the spirit.

Things of the Spirit are spiritually discerned! "The natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God; for they are foolishness unto him; neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned"

 

Just a note...have not reasearched it all out..but found this..


The manifestation of the Holy Spirit declined after the apostolic age, due largely to the fact that the church had become lukewarm. This is evidenced by the Lord’s warning to the church at Ephesus in Revelation 2:4-5.

In the second and third centuries they continued to more or less manifest.
But shortly after Constantine’s Edict making Christianity the national religion, at which time the church came into Imperial favor, the ministry of the gifts rapidly declined. Although it is important to note that the operation of the gifts never altogether ceased. The story of St. Francis contains thrilling incidents of miracles of healing.

Middle ages. The history of the persecuted sects of the Waldenses and Albigenses shows that the gifts of the Spirit were in manifestation even then.

18th Century. John Wesley records remarkable Pentecostal phenomena in his journals in the meetings of the early Methodists. The Morovians and other contemporary groups also experienced many unusual supernatural manifestations.

19th and 20th century revivals. When at last men began to earnestly to pray for their restoration to the Church, outpourings of His Spirit resulted.

 

Your inference here is that we (Baptists) who do not pray in tongues are spiritually discerned and therefore "the natural man," or unsaved. Are you claiming that you are the only saved person on the board.

The verse you are quoting in 1Cor.2:14, and refers to the unsaved man who receives not the of the Spirit of God. It has nothing to do with either praying or speaking in tongues. You are taking the verse way out of context.

 

I too am a Baptist...but believe in the manifestation of the Holy Spirit..
No, I am not saying that!! Some christians live out of there flesh and not there spirit. Things of the spirit have to be spiritually discerned! We can not look at it from a fleshly standpoint!

But the natural man. (\~qucikov de anyrwpov\~.) The word natural here stands opposed evidently to spiritual. It denotes those who are governed and influenced by the natural instincts; the animal passions and desires, in opposition to those who are influenced by the Spirit of God.

 

First, I don't believe you are a Baptist. I believe that the belief systems of Baptists and those of Charismatics are incompatible. It is like trying to be a Muslim and a Christian at the same time. It can't be done.

Second, your interpretation of 1Cor.2:14 is wrong. "The natural man" speaks of the unsaved man.

1 Corinthians 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Verse 12: We have received the spirit which is of God...comparing spiritual things with spiritual things. This is descriptive of ALL Christians.
Verse 14: The natural man receives not the the things of the Spirit of God.
This statement is false for any Christian, for every Christian receives some things of the Spirit of God, just some Christians more than others.
However all natural men, all unsaved men do not receive the things of the Spirit of God; they are foolishness unto them; neither can they know them. This can only be true of an unsaved person, and can never be speaking of a christian. If you think this speaks of a Christian I would question your definition of a Christian.

Your mystical meaning of the "manifestation of the Holy Spirit" is meaningless. I doubt if you can define it yourself. However, if you use more Biblical language and speak of the gifts of the Holy Spirit you might be more understandable.

 

Yes. Paul pretty much summed it up. He said the ecstatic manifestations will cease and pass away once the church reaches a degree of growth and establishment.

 

I do not believe that the whole man is changed at rebirth. I believe our spirit man is. Our natural man (mind and body) are in a process of being renewed by the word of God, our bodies not until we get our glorified body at His coming.j

You can question all you want! It is not your opinion of me that matters! It is Gods and He is pleased with me. I am His child!

YOu deny the manifestation of the Holy Spirit because if you believe it ...it will changes your theory to seeing the truth!

The promise of the Holy Spirit is the Fathers...He gave it to His Son...His Son poured it out on the Day of Pentecost and it is still here today. The manifestations are clear in 1 Cor. 12..Tongues being one of them! To deny that is to deny the word!

 

It did not say a degree of growth and established! It said it will cease when we know as we are known and we see face to face!

1 Cor. 1: 7-8 also says not to come behind in any gift..."WAITING FOR THE COMING OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST"...If this has happened...I must have missed it!