The truth about Nelson Mandela

[Judith]

The media and the governments of the world have lied to the people about Nelson Mandela. Some are still old enough to remember the truth about him and others know it from first hand experience.
http://www.wnd.com/2013/12/nelson-mandela-was-a-radical-marxist/print/

 

[Crabtownboy]

The media and the governments of the world have lied to the people about Nelson Mandela. Some are still old enough to remember the truth about him and others know it from first hand experience.
http://www.wnd.com/2013/12/nelson-mandela-was-a-radical-marxist/print/

Your source is wrong and his actions prove this very boldly.

We the ANC took control of South Africa it was by a democratic election with Mandela elected president. He was 75 at that time.

He had the backing of the people and could have set up any type of government he desired. He opted for a democratic multiple party state. That is not Communist.

He set up a "Truth and Reconciliation Commission", that is not Communist. The Communist way has always been to kill or put in prison your former enemies. He did not go this.

He set up a Capitalistic economy. That is not Communist.

He refused to run for re-election ... which he would have won easily. That is not the Communist way. The man at the top stays in power as long as possible, with no real election.

I can think of nothing he did while in office that shows any leanings toward Communism.
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Blessings to you and yours.

 

[Aaron]

The media and the governments of the world have lied to the people about Nelson Mandela. Some are still old enough to remember the truth about him and others know it from first hand experience.
http://www.wnd.com/2013/12/nelson-mandela-was-a-radical-marxist/print/

:thumbs::thumbs:

He would not be revered were he other than described there.

 

[Judith]

Your source is wrong and his actions prove this very boldly.

We the ANC took control of South Africa it was by a democratic election with Mandela elected president. He was 75 at that time.

He had the backing of the people and could have set up any type of government he desired. He opted for a democratic multiple party state. That is not Communist.

He set up a "Truth and Reconciliation Commission", that is not Communist. The Communist way has always been to kill or put in prison your former enemies. He did not go this.

He set up a Capitalistic economy. That is not Communist.

He refused to run for re-election ... which he would have won easily. That is not the Communist way. The man at the top stays in power as long as possible, with no real election.

I can think of nothing he did while in office that shows any leanings toward Communism.
--------------------------------------------------------

Blessings to you and yours.

You are saying this brother in Christ lied. I suggest you contact him and let us know of his response. By the way all the things that put him in prison are true. That is easily verifiable. Also all the things he pushed through as laws, abortion, homosexuality, and so forth. All are verifiable.
While he may have done some things that are considered good he also did things that are very evil. All needs to be told, not the slanted tellings of the press, liberals, and government officials who all lie to promote their agenda.

 

[Jerome]

Press? How about this liberal organ:

Baptist Press

"Southern Baptists joined diverse leaders worldwide who hailed the civil rights champion for his life's work against apartheid, economic injustice, AIDS and other ills.

Russell D. Moore, president of the Southern Baptist Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission, noted the heroism of the leader who rose from 27 years of incarceration to become the first black South African president as well as a hallmark of freedom and a leader of worldwide acclaim.

"Nelson Mandela's heroism will outlast him throughout untold generations. Mandela will be remembered for standing up to a racist regime, for persevering under persecution, and for leading his country toward democracy,” Moore told Baptist Press. “Mandela's move from prison cell to president's office was a living parable of the power of freedom over apartheid. Even those who don't agree with all of Mandela's political or religious views ought to give thanks for the many good things that came from his life and work. As we remember Nelson Mandela, let's pray for a South Africa that experiences the freedom not only of the voting booth but also of widespread gospel reconciliation to God and to one another.""

 

[Crabtownboy]

You are saying this brother in Christ lied. I suggest you contact him and let us know of his response. By the way all the things that put him in prison are true. That is easily verifiable. Also all the things he pushed through as laws, abortion, homosexuality, and so forth. All are verifiable.
While he may have done some things that are considered good he also did things that are very evil. All needs to be told, not the slanted tellings of the press, liberals, and government officials who all lie to promote their agenda.

Mandela rejected Communism;

Among other factors, it was Mandela's Christianity that steered him away from Communism and the class struggle that was spreading into South Africa in the 1940s. Despite befriending Gaur Redebe and Nat Bregman, prominent Xhosa and Jewish South African communists, he could not reconcile communism's atheistic attitudes with his Christian faith. Also, he felt that the idea of class struggle was misleading, and that South Africa's problems were primarily racial in origin. Although he was impressed that the local communist party saw Europeans, Africans, Indians, and those of mixed heritage all mixing equally, he clearly believed there was another way to go.

http://www.christiantoday.com/article/nelson.mandela.and.his.faith/34956.htm

If you mean the writer of the piece, he either lied or is very biased or is very ignorant. I do not know which. If you read what Mandela says about himself, acknowledging that he was a Christian and by his deeds there can be no other conclusion.

To defend the apartheid government in South Africa is simply astounding. There was nothing Christian about that government, absolutely nothing. That government threw people in prison for any and for no reason. Mandela set up a forgiving "Truth and Reconciliation Commission." I'd say that was much more Christian.

Everyone is both good and bad. No one, except Christ, is perfect. Overall he did much more good than bad.



It is much to the shame of the Dutch Reformed church that they supported apartheid.



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[church mouse guy]

The media and the governments of the world have lied to the people about Nelson Mandela. Some are still old enough to remember the truth about him and others know it from first hand experience.
http://www.wnd.com/2013/12/nelson-mandela-was-a-radical-marxist/print/

The hard left is trying to say that he did not rule as a communist and therefore he was not a communist. That is just not true. He was a communist and a high-ranking communist. There have already been a number of postings on this board illustrating his communist party activity, including his affirmation of Castro in Cuba.

I think that you have to take him with a grain of salt--he turned out in his old age not to be a Mugabe. However, as you show, he was not a saint and no one wants to live in South Africa.

 

[prophet]

He grew up in a country that had been stolen from his ancestors by racists. It took violence to implement change. He succeeded in living long enough to see that change.
Did any of us grow up this way? My Grandfather was 7 when our tribe was forcibly disbanded by the U.S.Government, because we continued our war for our land indefinitely.
By the time I was born we had been allowed to reband, 3 years earlier. My grandfather was 71, and was never going to trust the G again. By then, my father had become a Bhuddist. And though both of these men were saved during my early years, I was instilled with the permission from my ancestors to use violence to implement change.

Thank God, He interfered, and after 2 incarcerations, I realized that bitterness wasnt going to ever give me a good life, and I cast my care on the LORD.

With that said, I can sympathize with any man who grew up in apartheid S.A., a much worse situation. I cannot damn those natives, in any country, who have been conquered by another people, who live and fight to see the day when their people will once again take power.

Communism(tricked, but) trained and empowered oppressed minorities all over the planet, last century. In the Philippines, an ARMY Lt., Ed Ramsey, who'd escaped the Baton Death March, recruited communist activists, radicals, to help sabotage the Jap imperialists, and allow Mac to reinvade and quickly subdue the oppressors.
You never know the whole story, behind a Gideon from any country.

 

[Judith]

He grew up in a country that had been stolen from his ancestors by racists. It took violence to implement change. He succeeded in living long enough to see that change.
Did any of us grow up this way? My Grandfather was 7 when our tribe was forcibly disbanded by the U.S.Government, because we continued our war for our land indefinitely.
By the time I was born we had been allowed to reband, 3 years earlier. My grandfather was 71, and was never going to trust the G again. By then, my father had become a Bhuddist. And though both of these men were saved during my early years, I was instilled with the permission from my ancestors to use violence to implement change.

Thank God, He interfered, and after 2 incarcerations, I realized that bitterness wasnt going to ever give me a good life, and I cast my care on the LORD.

With that said, I can sympathize with any man who grew up in apartheid S.A., a much worse situation. I cannot damn those natives, in any country, who have been conquered by another people, who live and fight to see the day when their people will once again take power.

Communism(tricked, but) trained and empowered oppressed minorities all over the planet, last century. In the Philippines, an ARMY Lt., Ed Ramsey, who'd escaped the Baton Death March, recruited communist activists, radicals, to help sabotage the Jap imperialists, and allow Mac to reinvade and quickly subdue the oppressors.
You never know the whole story, behind a Gideon from any country.

I have no sympathy for a murderer of innocent women and children who does not repent just because he accomplishes his goal. Jesus said give unto Ceasar that which is Ceasars and unto God that which is His. He did not say to murder innocent people to become democratic. My hope is before Mr. Mandela died he came to repentance toward God and faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[pinoybaptist]

CBT:

I remember that name and have vague recollections of events prior to his imprisonment beginning with the Mau-Mau movement.
Now I'm not saying that Mandela was Mau-Mau, but when you're in an underground organization like one that is set to overthrowing a ruling government blood is on your hands oftentimes indirectly.
So, you tell us, is Mandela actually, certifiably free of blood on his hands ?

That's why I feel very uncomfortable joining the Praise Mandela bandwagon.

At the very least he was a fellow traveller of violent communists.
Now the second thing is how can somebody representing himself as a Christian unite himself with anything communistic and atheistic even if it appeals to one's intellectual mind ?

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

He grew up in a country that had been stolen from his ancestors by racists. It took violence to implement change. He succeeded in living long enough to see that change.
Did any of us grow up this way? My Grandfather was 7 when our tribe was forcibly disbanded by the U.S.Government, because we continued our war for our land indefinitely.
By the time I was born we had been allowed to reband, 3 years earlier. My grandfather was 71, and was never going to trust the G again. By then, my father had become a Bhuddist. And though both of these men were saved during my early years, I was instilled with the permission from my ancestors to use violence to implement change.

Thank God, He interfered, and after 2 incarcerations, I realized that bitterness wasnt going to ever give me a good life, and I cast my care on the LORD.

With that said, I can sympathize with any man who grew up in apartheid S.A., a much worse situation. I cannot damn those natives, in any country, who have been conquered by another people, who live and fight to see the day when their people will once again take power.

Communism(tricked, but) trained and empowered oppressed minorities all over the planet, last century. In the Philippines, an ARMY Lt., Ed Ramsey, who'd escaped the Baton Death March, recruited communist activists, radicals, to help sabotage the Jap imperialists, and allow Mac to reinvade and quickly subdue the oppressors.
You never know the whole story, behind a Gideon from any country.

Amen, Prophet, amen. No one but someone who has walked in those shoes is able to understand the complexities that went into making Nelson Mandela the man he was by the time he came out of that prison.

There seems to be a heavy tendency on this board to condemn a man for his past, and his past associations, without considering who he has become. Like you, I have been incarcerated for my own stupidity. Am I the man that went into prison? Absolutely not.

Does that matter to some? Absolutely not. To them, the tag "ex-con" will always hang over my head. I'm sure there are those who will not let you forget where you have been, either. Thank the Lord God Almighty, He knows who we are, He knows what heart-change has taken place. He knows who we are today.

He knows who Nelson Mandela is today as well, and has peaceably called him home. What people still in this mortal coil think of him, of you and I, is totally irrelevant. Godspeed, Prophet. Live well, for Him. :applause:

 

[prophet]

I have no sympathy for a murderer of innocent women and children who does not repent just because he accomplishes his goal. Jesus said give unto Ceasar that which is Ceasars and unto God that which is His. He did not say to murder innocent people to become democratic. My hope is before Mr. Mandela died he came to repentance toward God and faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

You have never fought, in your ancestral home, to free your family from racist invaders.
God judged Apartheid, weighed it in the balances, and found it wanting. And now it is gone.
The enemy's wife is raising his children to oppress yours. Therefore, they are also the enemy.
I am not defending Mandela's Christianity.
I am reminding you that God used him to help overthrow an evil, illegal, oppressive regime.
It is extremely hard for White Americans to understand that Mandela would have been a coward to go along with the society he grew up in.

 

[Aaron]

From the article in the OP:

“I’m astounded that so many in the West idolize Mandela and lift him up as a messianic figure because they obviously don’t know what he teaches, what he believes or what he does – or his support for some of the most radical Marxist dictatorships on the planet with some of the worst human-rights records, such as the governments of Red China and Cuba,” Hammond declared. “He has supported these dictators wholeheartedly and received them with the greatest honors.”​

I think the testimony of one who touched him, and lived and ministered under his administration is eminently better evidence than the propaganda fed to the West.

 

[Crabtownboy]

The hard left is trying to say that he did not rule as a communist and therefore he was not a communist. That is just not true. He was a communist and a high-ranking communist. There have already been a number of postings on this board illustrating his communist party activity, including his affirmation of Castro in Cuba.
.

You show no source of authority for your opinion. You remind me of the sentence in the book, "The Man Who Knew Too Much";

Modern intelligence won't accept anything on authority. But it will accept anything without authority.

 

[prophet]

He isnt a Messiah, he isnt Satán. He is a man who was born into a situation that caused him to act or be a coward.
What means were available to him?
Would the racist Eurocentric gov.s of the pre-WWII society help? Look at the World leaders during his formative years.
Did the World get outraged during the Bóer Wars?
Would the U.S. have helped?
He had no other vehicle, than guerrilla communism, to accomplish what manhood demanded, that he give his life to free his family and homeland.
Dont let 'conservatives' tell you what's right and wrong, they handed our country over to socialism, and then blamed the 'liberals'.
Proverbs26:17 reminds of how foolish we are to pick sides in someone else's fight.
Take a dog by the ears, get your nose bit off.
Mandella was who he was...an historical figure...who took a stand, and history will judge that stand.

 

[North Carolina Tentmaker]

From the article in the OP:

“I’m astounded that so many in the West idolize Mandela and lift him up as a messianic figure because they obviously don’t know what he teaches, what he believes or what he does – or his support for some of the most radical Marxist dictatorships on the planet with some of the worst human-rights records, such as the governments of Red China and Cuba,” Hammond declared. “He has supported these dictators wholeheartedly and received them with the greatest honors.”
​

I think the testimony of one who touched him, and lived and ministered under his administration is eminently better evidence than the propaganda fed to the West.

And did you google Rev. Peter Hammond and his ministry? I did. Go see for yourself. This man was a sworn enemy of Mandela before and after he took power.

No Mandela is no saint. Certainly I disagree with him on many political issues. But he had a cause he believed in and fought for, at great personal cost. And when faced with the choice of vengence and reparations or peace and forgiveness he chose peace.

He does not have to be perfect to deserve some respect.

 

[Aaron]

And did you google Rev. Peter Hammond and his ministry? I did. Go see for yourself. This man was a sworn enemy of Mandela before and after he took power.

No Mandela is no saint. Certainly I disagree with him on many political issues. But he had a cause he believed in and fought for, at great personal cost. And when faced with the choice of vengence and reparations or peace and forgiveness he chose peace.

He does not have to be perfect to deserve some respect.

OK. Googled him. I'm more inclined to believe him than before.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

OK. Googled him. I'm more inclined to believe him than before.

Hmpf. <--This is me, being not surprised.

 

[North Carolina Tentmaker]

OK. Googled him. I'm more inclined to believe him than before.

So you saw he was an apartheid supporter. You saw that he has charges of immorality against him. You saw that he was charged with lying about charities he raised money for in Sudan and then diverted to his own organization in South Africa.

I don't know if any of these charges are true, and I hesitate to repeat them. I did see where he is referred to as:

The Reverend Peter Hammond, a notable pro-apartheid and pro-military activist in the 1980’s, had his book Homo-Fascism in South Africa, censored by the Constitutional Court, . .

.-- Men of the Global South: A Reader, edited by Adam Jones, p 396.

Hammond is certainly anti muslim and anti gay, I probably agree with him more on political issues then I did Mandela. But there is no way you could call him an unbiased source of information.

 

[church mouse guy]

You show no source of authority for your opinion. You remind me of the sentence in the book, "The Man Who Knew Too Much";

All of this was documented on another thread on this board and I asked you then if you were conceding the fact that Mandela was a high-ranking communist such as Bill O'Reilly stated or if you were disputing the sources. Needless to say, you did not give me the courtesy of a reply.