Pastor turned athiest

[Winman]

I read the article, and it seems to me that the pastor-turned-agnostic/atheist was trying to reconcile tradition with scripture, and simply couldn't.

He was bound in the shackles of confusion, unable to answer tough questions about evil and sin, supposed righteousness that still looks very evil, carnality in a supposedly righteous saint, worldliness in so many children of God.

I could once relate to his appetite for intellectualism, love of knowledge, his love for books and appreciation for scholarly authority. He wanted to have concrete answers for life's tough questions, and thought that men could adequately provide them.

I've read Bart Ehrman and Elaine Pagels, with their heavy appeals to the Gnosticism and all their empty rhetoric, and numerous other "scholars" with their pompous claims of authority on spiritual matters.

I'll admit that those "scholars" make some compelling arguments that appeal to intellectual pride, with the feeling that one has been enlightened above all others. But in the end, they are simply shipwrecked by empty philosophy and a prideful desire to define truth by what seems right in their own eyes

Who goes to a self professed agnostic for concrete answers? By his own admission, he has no concrete answers.


What I see in that agnostic is someone who was convinced of his Christian doctrine by men, and was not firmly grounded in truth by the Holy Spirit. Then when other men came along with seemingly better rationale, he fell headlong into the same ditch.

You should write that fellow, I think he would listen to you.

 

[Inspector Javert]

I read the article, and it seems to me that the pastor-turned-agnostic/atheist was trying to reconcile tradition with scripture, and simply couldn't.

He was bound in the shackles of confusion, unable to answer tough questions about evil and sin, supposed righteousness that still looks very evil, carnality in a supposedly righteous saint, worldliness in so many children of God.

I could once relate to his appetite for intellectualism, love of knowledge, his love for books and appreciation for scholarly authority. He wanted to have concrete answers for life's tough questions, and thought that men could adequately provide them.

I've read Bart Ehrman and Elaine Pagels, with their heavy appeals to the Gnosticism and all their empty rhetoric, and numerous other "scholars" with their pompous claims of authority on spiritual matters.

I'll admit that those "scholars" make some compelling arguments that appeal to intellectual pride, with the feeling that one has been enlightened above all others. But in the end, they are simply shipwrecked by empty philosophy and a prideful desire to define truth by what seems right in their own eyes

Who goes to a self professed agnostic for concrete answers? By his own admission, he has no concrete answers.


What I see in that agnostic is someone who was convinced of his Christian doctrine by men, and was not firmly grounded in truth by the Holy Spirit. Then when other men came along with seemingly better rationale, he fell headlong into the same ditch.

I'm not sure that Bart Ehrman (although a smart and knowledgeable guy) is a particularly convincing scholar.....

He accepts these historical facts:
1.) Jesus died on "Good Friday" by crucifiction
2.) He was buried in a tomb by Joseph of Arimathea
3.) The tomb in which Jesus was buried was found to be empty and no body was ever recovered.
4.) The Disciples and hundreds of others saw and witnessed a bodily resurrected Christ
5.) The disciples did not previously believe that Jesus claimed that he would raise bodily from the dead.
6.) Jesus' body was never recovered.
7.) The Early Church exploded in numbers after the day of Pentecost due to an honestly held belief that Jesus had bodily resurrected from the dead.

His explanation for these facts which he accepts:............
.......................
Mass hallucinations.



William Lane Craig makes mince-meat out of Ehrman in debates regularly:
His Doctoral Thesis in Theology was on the Resurrection.

Ehrman is the definition of "willfully ignorant". You have to WANT to disbelieve the Scriptures in order to hold to ideas so patently stupid as Ehrman does....

Ehrman WANTS to deny Scriptures, so he does.
This blogger WANTS to agree with Ehrman.....so he does.

Anyone who claims you can't "CHOOSE" to believe something is gravely mistaken....you ABSOLUTELY CAN. Ehrman CHOOSES to believe a lie, and a preposterous one at that.

Rom 1:21
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Rom 1:25
Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Rom 1:28
And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;

 

[JamesL]

I'm not sure that Bart Ehrman (although a smart and knowledgeable guy) is a particularly convincing scholar.....

I'm not sure he's all that convincing for many, but he and others make compelling arguments. Their rhetoric can make someone think and doubt. And to those who don't have the discernment or desire to verify claims, they can sound right because they speak as ones having authority

through the use of empty rhetoric, and the unspoken promise of intellectual superiority, their arguments have the potential to appeal to those who are attracted to the idea that they alone can discover a truth that places them above mere men.

Basically, Ehrman and others whisper a promise that men can become gods through intellectualism - with the help of others who now hold the knowledge of good and evil apart from any authority other than self

 

[Van]

From Easy Believism to 5 Point Calvinist to Atheist:

1) Embrace another gospel, one that values dead faith.

2) Embrace the idea that nothing we do will change the outcome of our lives.

3) Therefore embrace atheism, since nothing we do will alter the outcome of our lives.

One, two, three - its as easy as taking broccoli from a baby.

 

[righteousdude2]

Thanks .... happy you asked!

Interesting read...this guy was a Baptist pastor....so what are your thoughts?:smilewinkgrin:

http://quitplayingchurch.wordpress.com/tag/bruce-gerencser/

I can't see any rational person, especially one who came to Jesus, become an atheist. When I look into the night sky, I know, that I KNOW, that there is a creator of that massive expanse. When I gaze into a mirror and see the wonders of the human body and the miraculous things that needed to happen in order for life to exist [just the mystery and chemistry of blood, blood gases, etc.] are a marvel that tells me there is more to this life than what we see, feel, touch and assume to know!

The personality and love of God are all around us, and once a person reckons with themselves that there is a creator, and that creator is Jehovah Jireh ... to turn back to empty beliefs makes me wonder if the guy ever, EVER believed beyond simple book knowledge.

In my heart of hearts .... there may be fleeting wisps of doubt [where the devil will try to whisper in my ear, our you sure. Are you REALLY sure?], but when it comes down to atheism versus God and creation, there is no other choice or option, at least for me!

In fact, with age has come wisdom, and I think the devil has about given up on me; because he got tired of asking me if I was really sure? Because each time he asked, I came up with more reasons to believe. He saw that wasn't working! That's the neat thing about the devil, you and temptaton! The more he tempts us, the more confident we become in our faith ... because temptations [at least for me] always takes me back to square one, and once I'm there [at square one], the decision to give that temptation a boot in its red hot rear, becomes just that much easier.

Maybe that's why he only tempted Jesus three times. Once he heard the answers, he decided that it was a hopeless battle plan.

So, IMHO, I can't see a true believer giving way to atheism!:wavey:

 

[evenifigoalone]

I can kinda see it happening, in a way. Just going by my own experiences in the past with doubts, I mean. But in the end, God wouldn't let me leave and I came out of those experiences more encouraged than ever before.
I tend to agree that a true believer will never be able to truly leave, but at the same time I can see how the arguments of atheism can seem very persuasive. IDK, I can see and kinda understand the thinking behind atheism, even though I'm quite sure it's false. If I weren't a believer and didn't have a faith in God or experienced the things I have, I'd probably be an agnostic atheist.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I can't see any rational person, especially one who came to Jesus, become an atheist. When I look into the night sky, I know, that I KNOW, that there is a creator of that massive expanse. When I gaze into a mirror and see the wonders of the human body and the miraculous things that needed to happen in order for life to exist [just the mystery and chemistry of blood, blood gases, etc.] are a marvel that tells me there is more to this life than what we see, feel, touch and assume to know!

The personality and love of God are all around us, and once a person reckons with themselves that there is a creator, and that creator is Jehovah Jireh ... to turn back to empty beliefs makes me wonder if the guy ever, EVER believed beyond simple book knowledge.

In my heart of hearts .... there may be fleeting wisps of doubt [where the devil will try to whisper in my ear, our you sure. Are you REALLY sure?], but when it comes down to atheism versus God and creation, there is no other choice or option, at least for me!

In fact, with age has come wisdom, and I think the devil has about given up on me; because he got tired of asking me if I was really sure? Because each time he asked, I came up with more reasons to believe. He saw that wasn't working! That's the neat thing about the devil, you and temptaton! The more he tempts us, the more confident we become in our faith ... because temptations [at least for me] always takes me back to square one, and once I'm there [at square one], the decision to give that temptation a boot in its red hot rear, becomes just that much easier.

Maybe that's why he only tempted Jesus three times. Once he heard the answers, he decided that it was a hopeless battle plan.

So, IMHO, I can't see a true believer giving way to atheism!:wavey:

Correct....he was always a reprobate but he has added whistle blowers to his resume....and now he takes donations! I find that hilarious....now he is a hypocrate with a tin cup. :smilewinkgrin:

 

[Jkdbuck76]

Here is the article everyone should read;

http://brucegerencser.net/2014/02/stopped-believing/

Sounds like he was not grounded and was double-minded. I'd sooner put a gun to head and pull the trigger than go to websites about debunking Christianity "for answers". He did it to himself. If he truly is an atheist, then he was NEVER indwelt with the Holy Spirit. Bruce is gonna have to answer FOR HIS OWN ACTIONS on the dreaded Day of Judgment, and "gee, American Christians were too worldly" will not cut it. The goal is Christ, not our peers.

Here is the better thing: how many former atheists are now Christians and even pastors? Let's focus on them. See what God has done in their lives.

 

[JamesL]

You should write that fellow, I think he would listen to you.

I've been thinking about it. Your encouragement to do so helps.

I've read about 2 dozen of his posts, and there is much more to it than simply defecting from the faith. Lots of baggage attached.

I feel for him, as it seems that I come from a very similar upbringing. Only thing is I became disillusioned at a far younger age, about 12 years old, long before I ever had to he wherewithal to consider other doctrinal persuasions

 

[Salty]

Sounds like he was not grounded and was double-minded. I'd sooner put a gun to head and pull the trigger than go to websites about debunking Christianity "for answers". He did it to himself. If he truly is an atheist, then he was NEVER indwelt with the Holy Spirit. Bruce is gonna have to answer FOR HIS OWN ACTIONS on the dreaded Day of Judgment, and "gee, American Christians were too worldly" will not cut it. The goal is Christ, not our peers.

Here is the better thing: how many former atheists are now Christians and even pastors? Let's focus on them. See what God has done in their lives.

The reason I read it was so I can understand where he is comming from

 

[Jkdbuck76]

And that's great, Salty.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

I've been thinking about it. Your encouragement to do so helps.

I've read about 2 dozen of his posts, and there is much more to it than simply defecting from the faith. Lots of baggage attached.

I feel for him, as it seems that I come from a very similar upbringing. Only thing is I became disillusioned at a far younger age, about 12 years old, long before I ever had to he wherewithal to consider other doctrinal persuasions

The only thing he wants outa you is a donation.