Featured Ideas on how to love and serve others in church

Stop preaching now and provide for that family. One who does not provide for his own is worse than an infidel.

 

John, you posted this on another thread. I'm not going to derail that one, so I post it here:

How about I let you speak for yourself?

I don't know how much you owe, but I'd guess that $300 would be a welcome payment to one of your creditors, yet you make an excuse here instead of saying, "OK, I'll spend that money as I should."

Going online to find a job is OK when you have a job and are meeting your obligations. Besides online job ads don't tell you who's really hiring anyway. The companies that post online are not urgently trying to fill a need. They're posting a "wish list." You desperately need a second job. It's way past time to go door to door in shopping centers, strip malls, office buildings, and leave resumés everywhere. You have a wife and child to support and everything you've said here and elsewhere on this thread is selfish and self-centered. Sorry to be so blunt, but there it is.

Who cares how much debt someone else has?? We're talking about you -- you always talk about your debt, so let's stick to the subject, OK?

The level of desire one has is evident in the lengths to which he will go to meet his obligations. And ... ? Where does that leave you?

Which is totally irrelevant to your situation.

So again, I ask, John ...

 

Excellent advice.

Though I will say that he doesn't necessarily need to quit open air preaching if he has a second job. I did it for most of a year; 2 jobs, Monday through Friday (Saturday often times too) and street evangelism/open air preaching Saturday night. It is doable.

If you are under a lot of debt I believe you are morally obligated to everything you can to pay it off. The sooner the better. Any little bit helps, even if the 2nd job only nets a couple hundred a month. Everything helps.

 

Well, that's not a lot of money to pay debt with, but you need to quit buying books and DVDs all the time. You probably haven't read half of them.

If you can pay just $20 per week on your debt, that's $1040 per year. It might take you ten years to pay your debt off, but someday you will. It's slow and steady.

But you need to quit spending money you don't have. I do not have any debt. That is not because I am a genius, or make fantastic money, but because I have a rule I do not spend money I do not have. You don't have to have everything your eye sees.

 

I lived in Colorado for six years, '04-'10, John -- I know you can find cheaper housing than that, and in decent neighborhoods, so don't try to tell me that. You could cut $200, easily, out of your monthly rent. If you can't find a place in Denver, move south all the way to Palmer Lake. It's close the the Springs, and only 30 minutes from Littleton, 45 minutes from the 16th Street Mall, up CO-105. And you'll pay no where near $1,000/month for rent.

Assuming you make an average of $12/hr @ 15 hours working the part-time job, after taxes you have about $2,400. That doesn't count your wife's income. It ain't much, but there are pastors on this board making less and doing fine. I worked for a couple years out there at a rescue mission earning about the same thing, and had no problem living on it, and I had a new car loan and $900 a month house payment. So now what's your excuse, John? If you don't have the money to pay off your debt, it isn't because you don't have the income to do it. You haven't decided its important enough.

Don't just "keep your eye out" for such a job, go find the job!

And by the way, I'm between clients right now, and its Friday, so I don't have a lot of appointments. I've already been to the two job sites where I have houses going up and won't need to return til after lunch, so I've got some time on my hands.

But what are you doing online? You could be out knocking on doors of potential employers.

 

You are always talking about new books you bought. You need to spend that money on bills.

Axe repairs?

Don't listen to Crown, send that money in to pay bills.

All those books do is keep you mixed up. One week you come on here saying one thing, the next week you say just the opposite, all according to which book and author you are listening to at the time.

Read your Bible, you don't need men to tell you what it says.

 

Teachers in the first century taught in person, up close and personal.

Books of the Bible, yes. Everything else is just the opinion of some man -- or, over the last 50 years, some woman.

And I believe this whole post qualifies as yet another excuse.

 

With due respect, John, that doesn't surprise me.

We have manageable debt. You don't, or you wouldn't constantly be expressing worry about it. So the question's irrelevant.

Fine. Just make sure you're paying down you're debt at the same time. If you're not, it's a poor witness and your ministry will not be honored by God.

 

Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Exactly, I believe Ephesians 4:11 means teachers who teach believers what the scriptures are truly saying in the church, not all these multitudes of books on all sorts of subjects you see at the Christian bookstore.

 

For example, John has taken two courses on street preaching from WOTM. I imagine he had to pay for those courses.

Where in the Bible are we given instructions on how to street preach? John insists we have to preach the Ten Commandments, where do the scriptures tell us to stand in the street and yell the Ten Commandments at others?

John, I am not trying to insult you here, I think it is great you have a heart for lost folks and preach on the streets. But where did WOTM get these methods you insist must be followed?

I see Jesus sitting down in a boat and making all the people sit down. He used the water to amplify his voice so he wouldn't have to shout. I didn't see him telling folks they were sinners as WOTM teaches.

Mar 4:1 And he began again to teach by the sea side: and there was gathered unto him a great multitude, so that he entered into a ship, and sat in the sea; and the whole multitude was by the sea on the land.
2 And he taught them many things by parables, and said unto them in his doctrine,

This to me is a very decent and orderly service, not unlike church service itself. It is not this embarrassing commotion where the crowd is incited into a frenzy.

I am not saying you do that John, none of your videos I have seen have you done this. But I have seen many videos of street preachers that get crowds upset, often the police are called. I don't believe this is what we are to do.

If you read of Paul, often he preached in the street and a commotion ensued, but that was because the Jews stirred the people up, not because Paul was shouting at them the Ten Commandments.

So where did WOTM get this method from?