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Romans 9-15
- Thread starter Iconoclast
- Start date
Romans 11:11-12 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.
Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?
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Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?
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It was intentional (ordained of God) so that salvation may be offered to the Gentiles.
And that our salvation would provoke them to Jealousy at the end of this age (and really all throughout the "Church Age").
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And that our salvation would provoke them to Jealousy at the end of this age (and really all throughout the "Church Age").
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beameup
Member
Peter is the apostle to the circumcision. Peter is addressing his fellow Israelites, as hope remains for their national salvation.
Paul is the apostle to the uncircumcision. But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter Gal 2:7
Gospel of the Circumcision promised the "refreshing", "restoration" of the Earth under the Reign of Messiah (ie: Millennium):
Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;
And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: [Israel] Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began. Acts 3:19-21
*We know that the Temple was destroyed in 70 AD, which put an end to the preaching of the Gospel of the Kingdom.
Newsflash: The Temple will be rebuilt (ie: Third Temple) because the Apostle Paul refers to this fact in 2 Thessalonians [a physical Temple].
Internet Theologian
Well-Known Member
Lydia, Cornelius, Ethiopian eunuch, each disciple, Phillipian jailer, Abram, David...
All of Real Israel is Saved, Correct? All of the Real Church is saved, Correct?
You have to be a part of the Body of Christ in order to be Saved Correct?
Yes, there is an individual responsibility and calling, but One must be Part of the Nation in Which God ordained to be saved.
You have to be a part of the Body of Christ in order to be Saved Correct?
Yes, there is an individual responsibility and calling, but One must be Part of the Nation in Which God ordained to be saved.
Jon,
Jesus is the true Israel
If you are not in union with Him you are not saved.
Jesus is the elect Servant of the Lord.
Before the world was...He was named as the Elect servant.
Before the world was all of the elect were chosen In Christ.
We are In Him who is our mediator, and surety.
Look at 2 tim1:9
You quoted my post and disregarded it.
The Bride of Christ was Chosen (the Church) before the Foundation of the World, Not individuals, although individual make up the bride of Christ.
Individual Salvation is true, But you cannot separate the fact that If an individual is saved, they are part of a greater Body.
During the Mosaic Law, Did God say you have to be part of the Church? NO! He said you must be Part of the Nation of Israel, but obviously God had a deeper meaning than just being part of the head count. Being part of the Nation of Israel meant you had Faith in a Coming Messiah, you had a circumcised heart...Hence "Not all of israel is Israel."
Being IN CHRIST is what saves us, Like being IN the ARK. The Bible is Very Clear that because of His Foreknowledge He knew who would be IN CHRIST from before the foundation of the World. Election is a misnomer, it's taken too far. Biblical Election is a simple fact that God has Ordained those who are In Christ to Eternal Life. They are the ELECT, Because CHRIST IS THE ELECT. The Bride of Christ is One with Christ. Our election isn't an Individual Thing, IT is a Collective thing...The Church, The Bride of Christ is Elect, Ordained to Salvation because CHRIST, the TRUE ELECT, is our Head and We are the Body.
Christ Lives--We Live
Christ is Glorified--We are glorified
Christ is Loved--We are loved
Christ is heir--we are heirs
Christ received power--we receive power
Christ is one with the Father--we are One with Christ and One with the Father
HE IS THE ELECTION, we are in HIM.
EDITED TO ADD...
Rebekah is a perfect picture of this...
She didn't come to Isaac Kicking and Screaming...She willingly Came with Elezer....Although She was shown to Elezer in a vision that she would be the one...
Rebekah Inherited EVERYTHING Abraham had, because she was one with Isaac...The Chosen Seed...as Christ is the Chosen SEED.
Christ Lives--We Live
Christ is Glorified--We are glorified
Christ is Loved--We are loved
Christ is heir--we are heirs
Christ received power--we receive power
Christ is one with the Father--we are One with Christ and One with the Father
HE IS THE ELECTION, we are in HIM.
EDITED TO ADD...
Rebekah is a perfect picture of this...
She didn't come to Isaac Kicking and Screaming...She willingly Came with Elezer....Although She was shown to Elezer in a vision that she would be the one...
Rebekah Inherited EVERYTHING Abraham had, because she was one with Isaac...The Chosen Seed...as Christ is the Chosen SEED.
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How do you figure that...
Do you think the promised curses from Deut .28-33
Did not come I upon them?
I am not sure how you mean this at all
A church is an assembly of individuals who assemble.
In the Old Testament people were born Into national Israel in the New Testament people have to be born again will born from above to be in the church
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A
http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/reformed/israelaf.htm
Please take the time and read this and let me know what you think...
http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/reformed/israelaf.htm
Internet Theologian
Well-Known Member
But a Jew is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter. His praise is not from man but from God. Romans 2:29
Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
You Chose a verse that isn't talking about being "Israel" (Paul is talking about what a True Jew Looks like (not a gentile being a jew; Comparison of ethnic saved Jew vs. ethnic unsaved jew)..continue in chapter 3)...eisegeting the text my friend.
You are not a "spiritual jew" or part of "Spiritual Israel"
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Please read this, and let me know what you think...
http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/reformed/israelaf.htm
Internet Theologian
Well-Known Member
I made no interpretation. You did.
ok, you got me.
Internet Theologian
Well-Known Member
By the way the context isnt arguing ethnicity. You're arguing that into the text yourself.
Technically circumcision vs. uncircumcision as a "rite", within the realm of ethnic jews (implied...part of National Israel...seed of abraham...etc)...
17 Indeed you are called a Jew, and rest on the law, and make your boast in God....
24 For “the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you,” as it is written.