Hark
Well-Known Member
The exciting conclusion.... 
Kind of like followers of an idol. Their kids may not always worship the idol, but they may fear the idol just in case.
I would have thought the quote from the Catholic catechism was enough.
http://www.usccb.org/beliefs-and-te...techism-of-the-catholic-church/epub/index.cfm
"The Holy Sacrifice, because it makes present the one sacrifice of Christ the Savior and includes the Church’s offering."
If a Catholic believes in the Lord Jesus Christ and that God raised Him from the dead, they are saved whether or not they believe the end result for believing those two things, however, God the Father will punish them as His people for not believing that they are saved.
The idea of having a sacrifice is to bind the offer at the altar and kill it, thus signifying how strong the person making the sacrifice. Jesus gave up His life as a ransom for many so that no man took His life away.
John 10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. 18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.
And so I see 1 Corinthians 10:14-22 as referring to how the believers were doing communion like the Israelis and the Gentiles as if we are stronger than God in making this offering unto God which we are not.
I shall pass on that for now. I hope the Lord will lead me to post threads that every member here can get on that applies to christians in general.
As you say... speak of the Truth, and I can hope that God may cause the increase in reproving the works of darkness in that way.
It is obvious that proving the errors of the Catholic catechism or at least what they officially teach, is not going to convert any one to leave the Catholic church, but it was worth a shot to see if He would recover some that way.
....which I would again remind you is where we all start. I was never in fear of losing salvation when I was a babe in Christ due to ignorance, nor even due to weakness in obedience. So I can have compassion on those who are under poor teaching, but believe that God rewards those who are diligent in their efforts to know truth. And the fact remains, most in the average congregation, no matter which group we might examine, are ignorant of Scripture and most do not have a faith that is their own, derived from Study, but have basically borrowed the faith of those who instruct them.
It's kind of like people's kids. Usually they embrace the beliefs of their parents. We find someone who is racist, and his parent/s was were racist usually.
Kind of like followers of an idol. Their kids may not always worship the idol, but they may fear the idol just in case.
If the adherent believes this, then they are in serious error. But I don't really see that in the quote. Perhaps you could quote more of it's context.
I would have thought the quote from the Catholic catechism was enough.
http://www.usccb.org/beliefs-and-te...techism-of-the-catholic-church/epub/index.cfm
"The Holy Sacrifice, because it makes present the one sacrifice of Christ the Savior and includes the Church’s offering."
Agreed.
And this is where Catholics fail, they do not understand positional sanctification as opposed to progressive sanctification. For many of them, salvation is something that comes after a successful course. Very sad, but, for those who are actually saved among them, they will still be saved regardless. And like those who teach loss of salvation, most will never think they are one of the ones who will fail, lol.
If a Catholic believes in the Lord Jesus Christ and that God raised Him from the dead, they are saved whether or not they believe the end result for believing those two things, however, God the Father will punish them as His people for not believing that they are saved.
The "provocation" in view can be, I think, tied directly to his previous reference to the provocation itself, which was the idolatry of Israel in the Wilderness. Paul asks a simple question...is that what we want to do? Ti maintains a consistency to what he is trying to teach them/us.
The idea of having a sacrifice is to bind the offer at the altar and kill it, thus signifying how strong the person making the sacrifice. Jesus gave up His life as a ransom for many so that no man took His life away.
John 10:17 Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. 18 No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father.
And so I see 1 Corinthians 10:14-22 as referring to how the believers were doing communion like the Israelis and the Gentiles as if we are stronger than God in making this offering unto God which we are not.
Very kind of you, Hark. Give me a little time with that chapter to review and place it in a context of the issue you have raised. My primary point was that this passage is not, in it's historical context, speaking about Transubstantiation. While we can use passages and teachings to address more modern (even if it dates back to 3rd and 4th century origination) errors, I think we need to be very careful about that sort of thing. The idea of partaking of literal flesh and blood was something that was used to discredit Christianity, rather than something that originated from Christianity. As far as Catholic belief, I would only address that which comes directly from their own sources which hold legitimacy for the Catholic Church, Again, how their doctrine is interpreted varies from Catholic to Catholic, so if you would like to start a thread that examines theirs doctrine that would probably be interesting.
God bless.
I shall pass on that for now. I hope the Lord will lead me to post threads that every member here can get on that applies to christians in general.
As you say... speak of the Truth, and I can hope that God may cause the increase in reproving the works of darkness in that way.
It is obvious that proving the errors of the Catholic catechism or at least what they officially teach, is not going to convert any one to leave the Catholic church, but it was worth a shot to see if He would recover some that way.