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Featured The Irony of moral opposition to Trump

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by Calminian, Aug 20, 2016.

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  1. Calminian

    Calminian Well-Known Member
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    There's nothing wrong with opposing evil rulers. We see examples of them in the Bible, beheading Christians and sacrificing Babies to the gods, etc.. But now, in this modern Church generation in America, we're seeing a massive moral outrage toward candidate Donald Trump. "Anyone but him!!" The irony is truly amazing.

    Trump doesn't do any of the above evils mentioned, in fact, he's the only viable candidate that is promising to literally put "life-saving" justices on the Supreme Court. He's provided a lift of candidate anyone can look at. On the other hand, Hillary is promising to put murdering justices on the bench. Yes, I believe the murder of the unborn is a holocaust that's been going on way too long on out country. It's a stench in God's nostrils.

    Think about this for a moment. Biblical qualifications for a governing authority are probably best outlined in Romans 13. They are very narrow, but very important. Punish evil and minister to the innocent. It's a difficult but simple job. If Trump loses, we will have the most liberal supreme court ever in our nation's history. They have no mercy at all on the unborn, and are hostile to most Christian values. I have 5 kids that this deeply disturbs me. If it has to be, it has to be, but what's more bothersome is the fact that the modern Church, in the name of morality, may play a huge role in bringing this about.

    Why? Why are they so opposed to DJT? Is it because he's advocating murder, beheadings, etc.? No. The chest beating detractors are screaming that he's too vulgar. He fights back too much. He doesn't turn the other cheek! LOL. Oh God, help this lost generation.

    Other's will cry, "But he's not truly a Christian!" The truth is, we've likely never had a Christian president apart from perhaps Jimmy Carter. Yet, the Church of the 80s rejected him for Ronald Reagan. Reagan was a former liberal (a flip flopper on abortion) and a divorced man. But the church saw he was better on policy than Carter, the Southern Baptist Sunday School teacher. So they elected Reagan. Thank God!

    This generation? I really hope they're that smart. If they continue to be foolish, like they're promising to do, thinking they're making a conscience vote, God help us. They're literally advocating for an increase of murder and many other evils.

    Good polling came out today for Trump, so I'm hopeful. But let's put this notion to rest, once and for all. A vote for anyone else but Trump, including a non-vote, is a vote for evil. You're conscience should be seared not relieved. Blood will literally be on your hands.
     
    #1 Calminian, Aug 20, 2016
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  2. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    False.


    Sent from my Motorola Droid Turbo
     
    #2 InTheLight, Aug 20, 2016
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  3. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    Calm's statement is Partially true

    Full truth - a 3rd party vote or not voting - COULD help Hillary win! and that is a fact.!!!
     
    #3 Salty, Aug 20, 2016
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  4. InTheLight

    InTheLight Well-Known Member
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    Depends on the state you're living in. Probably 30+ states it will make no difference, including California, New York, Texas, and Illinois, 4 of the top 5 most populated states.

    Sent from my Motorola Droid Turbo
     
    #4 InTheLight, Aug 20, 2016
  5. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    Yes, you are correct - but I believe that the election could be very close - and that a few swing states/commonwealths will make the difference.
     
    #5 Salty, Aug 20, 2016
  6. Alcott

    Alcott Well-Known Member
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    What do you mean by that? That unless the election in a particular state is decided by a single vote, that YOU [the voter addressed] did not help to elect, or unelect, a certain candidate?
     
    #6 Alcott, Aug 20, 2016
  7. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    a single vote- true - BUT - if a 3rd party candidate wins 2,500 votes, and the major party candate looses by 2,000 votes ........
     
    #7 Salty, Aug 20, 2016
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  8. Use of Time

    Use of Time Well-Known Member
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    Nobody is "literally" advocating for an increase in murder and refusing to vote for Trump does not "literally" place blood on my hands.
     
    #8 Use of Time, Aug 20, 2016
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  9. Salty

    Salty 20,000 Posts Club
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    We wont bring up those suspicion deaths, but
    when it comes to abortion., Hillary is all for it.
     
    #9 Salty, Aug 20, 2016
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  10. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Refusing to vote does not literally "place blood on your hands", I agree. We do not offer our voices in opposition to, but in support of. Christians were never called to stand against evil but to stand for Christ and we need to stop trying to do Kingdom work through worldly ways.

    Put your support behind the platform you believe best glorifies God, and know that you are accountable for how you use your voice. Don't vote against something you reject, that's cowardly. Vote for something for which you are willing to stand. Instead of allowing evil to dictate your stance, let your stand for God be your stance against evil.
     
    #10 JonC, Aug 20, 2016
  11. StefanM

    StefanM Well-Known Member
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    Which generation? NeverTrumpers have come from a variety of generations.

    Besides, as several folks (myself included) have said on the board, people in safe/throwaway states have the luxury to vote 3rd party or abstain from voting without any effect on the election at all.

    On another thread, I think you made a valid point about actively advocating against Trump to swing state voters or in ways swing state voters could be exposed to the discussion.

    As part of the discussion, you (and others) have actually convinced me to change my mind. I'm in a throwaway state, but I won't advocate against Trump. He's not the best candidate, but he's the one we have. I still have my concerns, but you are right about SCOTUS appointments and the liberal direction of the court.

    I haven't decided with 100% certainty if I will vote for him, but I won't vote for Hillary.

    If you asked me today, I'd vote for Trump, though.
     
    #11 StefanM, Aug 20, 2016
  12. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    On the contrary:
    Who will rise up for me against the wicked? Who will take a stand for me against evil? (Ps. 94:16)
    If anyone, then, knows the good they ought to do and doesn't do it, it is sin for them. (James 4:17)
    Let those who love the Lord hate evil...(Ps. 97:10)
    Romans 9 tells us to "Hate what is evil."
    Hate evil, love good; maintain justice in the courts.(Amos 5:15)
     
    #12 Rippon, Aug 20, 2016
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  13. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Insofar as the interpretation/application of Scripture, I strongly disagree.

    The context of Psalm 97 is God's reign and sovereignty; the context of Amos 5 is seeking God; the context of Romans 9 of God's sovereignty. None of these passages seem to have in mind opposing evil except in the context of standing for God. Again, it is not what we oppose but for Whom we stand.

    If you truly believe that Trump's platform glorifies God, then I say "go for it". But those who suggest a "lesser of two evils" approach may benefit from a little meditation on Psalm 97, Amos 5, and Romans 9.
     
    #13 JonC, Aug 20, 2016
  14. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Hillary : Eugenics and Hillary when she (Hillary) received the Margaret Sanger Award :

    Enough said?

    http://www.weeklystandard.com/sec.-...e-of-eugenicist-margaret-sanger/article/28444

    HankD
     
    #14 HankD, Aug 21, 2016
  15. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    First a disclaimer - I am not making a comparison here to Trump, but to a principle many seem to advocate this election year (I may still vote for Trump, but not because I want to vote against Hillary).

    For some reason, I keep being reminded that the Germans who supported Hitler did so (at least in part) in opposition to communism.
     
    #15 JonC, Aug 21, 2016
  16. Rippon

    Rippon Well-Known Member
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    You are off on the deep end of the pond there Jon.

    Do you mind if the majority of Muslims entering America want Sharia as a way of life in the USA? Further, what about the bulk of Muslims that have been living here a long time --some since birth who are in favor of Sharia instead of the U.S. Constitution?
     
    #16 Rippon, Aug 21, 2016
  17. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I think we should strengthen our boarders and enforce our laws. Like I said, my comment was not directed towards Trump or even his platform. It was directed against the principle of casting your vote for someone you don't support because it opposes someone you dislike even more.
     
    #17 JonC, Aug 21, 2016
  18. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    Setting aside the misuse of Romans 13 in the op it is also a misuse of scripture to to say that any candidate is not evil because he doesn't do any number of cherry picked sins so that makes him ok. It does not.

    Trump is an unrepentant immoral man. I do not care about the past and repentant actions of others. I also hold leaders to a higher standard. Ephesians 5:11 says we are not only to refrain from sinfulness (unfruitful works of darkness) but we are to expose them.

    Trump can make promises but his words are unreliable. He character is untrustworthy and I am unwilling to support a man who is a womanizer, who has supported both parties over the years in order to gain more money, and he lacks self control. I understand the stakes with regards to the SC and a number of other things. It just does not justify voting for him. When we are willing to compromise our principles to gain an agenda then we will get exactly what we deserve in our leaders.


    “Silence in the face of evil is itself evil: God will not hold us guiltless. Not to speak is to speak. Not to act is to act.” Dietrich Bonhoeffer.
     
    #18 Revmitchell, Aug 21, 2016
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  19. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Exactly. :Thumbsup
     
    #19 JonC, Aug 21, 2016
  20. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    The undeniable/unsolvable result (apart from voting for a pro-life candidate): to allow a baby murderer to hold the office of POTUS.

    HankD
     
    #20 HankD, Aug 21, 2016
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