Monergism

[Martin Marprelate]

He said:
“You have answered correctly; DO THIS AND YOU WILL LIVE.”
GAME OVER.

Well no one's stopping you. Of you go and love God with all your heart, all your strength and all your mind (in Mark 12, Jesus says, "with all your soul," as well, so throw that in with good measure). And love your neighbour as yourself. Constantly, without fail, perfectly (James 2:10). Let me know how you get on, because if you can do that, you have nothing whatsoever to do with Jesus, because He says, "I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners" (Matthew 9:13).

And while you're at it, here are two very similar questions, one asked of the Lord Jesus and one asked of Paul and Silas:

"What must I do to inherit eternal life?" (Luke 10:25).
"What must I do to be saved?" (Acts 16:30).

Why are there two such very different answers to these questions?

 

[utilyan]

Well no one's stopping you. Of you go and love God with all your heart, all your strength and all your mind (in Mark 12, Jesus says, "with all your soul," as well, so throw that in with good measure). And love your neighbour as yourself. Constantly, without fail, perfectly (James 2:10). Let me know how you get on, because if you can do that, you have nothing whatsoever to do with Jesus, because He says, "I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners" (Matthew 9:13).

And while you're at it, here are two very similar questions, one asked of the Lord Jesus and one asked of Paul and Silas:

"What must I do to inherit eternal life?" (Luke 10:25).
"What must I do to be saved?" (Acts 16:30).

Why are there two such very different answers to these questions?

Same case righteous vs sinners:
Luke 7
44Turning toward the woman, He said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave Me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. 45“You gave Me no kiss; but she, since the time I came in, has not ceased to kiss My feet. 46“You did not anoint My head with oil, but she anointed My feet with perfume. 47“For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.”

We tell you love is the priority.


"What must I do to inherit eternal life?" (Luke 10:25).
"What must I do to be saved?" (Acts 16:30).


All three are same answer. Only one Gospel not three. You think believe can ONLY mean acknowledge existence?

If someone says you got a FLAT TIRE you might BELIEVE IN THEM and sure enough you do have a flat tire.
^That doesn't mean you worship them and assure other people they exist does it?^

Read real close 1 John 3: 23This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us.

That's ONE COMMANDMENT. But you can't believe because you don't believe God is TRUELY GOOD. You think he is EVIL with PRIVELEGES of doing stuff merely "CALLED" Good. When you can do what you want you can do EVIL and Call it good.

But God is GOOD WHOLEY GOOD. He is KIND and LOVING. Never evil.



The only person who says worship me and I will give you everything is SATAN:

7“Therefore if You worship before me, it shall all be Yours.” 8Jesus answered him, “It is written, ‘YOU SHALL WORSHIP THE LORD YOUR GOD AND SERVE HIM ONLY.’”



"Well no one's stopping you. Of you go and love God with all your heart, all your strength and all your mind (in Mark 12, Jesus says, "with all your soul," as well, so throw that in with good measure). And love your neighbour as yourself. Constantly, without fail, perfectly (James 2:10)."


Piece of CAKE. I got a good teacher, and you can do the same with great joy.

You have some strange view that sin is some kind of perk and loving God is some kind of chore.

Matthew 11
28“Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest. 29“Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and YOU WILL FIND REST FOR YOUR SOULS. 30“For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.”


"Let me know how you get on"

Agape is the highest priority. 1 Corinthians 13. 1 john 4.

Love is the entire goal of Christianity. 1 timothy 1:5


Very basics is you need to forgive people when they do you wrong and quit believing THEY themselves are bad but they are enslaved by bad motivations.

38“You have heard that it was said, ‘AN EYE FOR AN EYE, AND A TOOTH FOR A TOOTH.’ 39“But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40“If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, let him have your coat also. 41“Whoever forces you to go one mile, go with him two. 42“Give to him who asks of you, and do not turn away from him who wants to borrow from you.
43“You have heard that it was said, ‘YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR and hate your enemy.’ 44“But I say to you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45so that you may be sons of your Father who is in heaven; for He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46“For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? 47“If you greet only your brothers, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? 48“Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.


14“For if you forgive others for their transgressions, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15“But if you do not forgive others, then your Father will not forgive your transgressions.


Matthew 25

34“Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35‘For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.’ 37“Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink? 38‘And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You? 39‘When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40“The King will answer and say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.’

41“Then He will also say to those on His left, ‘Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels; 42for I was hungry, and you gave Me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me nothing to drink; 43I was a stranger, and you did not invite Me in; naked, and you did not clothe Me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit Me.’ 44“Then they themselves also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not take care of You?’ 45“Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ 46“These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”


Nothing about God visiting himself or feeding himself. What happens to the person who does all these things?

All this detail and explanation would not be necessary with your version.

King says those on right, "I picked you to go to heaven", King says to those on left "I picked you to go to hell" Why? Cause I says so and I'm the most merciful loving God, bye!

 

[MB]

Not ALL israel though was spiritual Israel of that time, as there were only a faitful remnant chosen out by God that received Christ!

Go back and take another look I didn't say Israel I Said Jesus came unto His own (Other Jews)
They were elected Jews that rejected Jesus. I would certainly believe that Jesus knew the difference between non Jew and His own.
MB

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Same case righteous vs sinners:
Luke 7
47“For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.”

We tell you love is the priority.

Well you're the guy who loves little, because your god is not the holy God of the Bible. If you knew the holiness and righteousness of God and His utter detestation of sin, you would know the amazing love of the Father that sent the Son to be the propitiation of your sins, not when you were a pretty OK kind of fellow who just needed to raise his game a bit, but when you were dead in trespasses and sins. It's not a question of working up some extra super love to satisfy Christ, it's understanding the cost of your redemption. If you knew this you wouldn't be bragging about how much you love God, you'd be saying,

'Died He for Me who caused His pain?
For me who Him to death pursued?
Amazing love! How can it be
That Thou, my God, should'st die for me?'

God forbid that I should boast save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ'

"What must I do to inherit eternal life?" (Luke 10:25).
"What must I do to be saved?" (Acts 16:30).
Only one Gospel not three. You think believe can ONLY mean acknowledge existence?

Amen! Only one Gospel. The scribe is like you. He thinks he can fulfil the law to be right with Christ. He has no idea of the sinfulness of his own heart. Our Lord refers him to the law, and then shows him that he doesn't keep it and can't keep it, so he needs a Saviour.
The jailor knows better. He came 'trembling' to Paul and Silas because he had seen the power of God and knew he was a sinner. So Paul refers him to grace: 'Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved' (Acts 16:31).

If someone says you got a FLAT TIRE you might BELIEVE IN THEM and sure enough you do have a flat tire.
^That doesn't mean you worship them and assure other people they exist does it?^

True saving faith is not believing that there was someone called Jesus who lived a long time ago and did a lot of good stuff. It is understanding that you are a sinner and that God would be perfectly just to send you to hell for all eternity. Then understanding that Jesus Christ has done everything necessary to save you. That He has taken your sin upon His sinless shoulders and paid the penalty for it in full. It is turning away from your sin and turning to Christ as your Prophet, Priest and King, not trusting in any righteousness of your own, but in the merits of Jesus, and determining to live the best life you can. not in order to be saved, nor to brag about it on the Baptist Board, but out of love for the Saviour who has loved us so much

Read real close 1 John 3:

That's another summary of Luke 10:27. To be sure it's a commandment, but if you are relying on that to save you, you are in for a shock, because the same person who wrote that also wrote. 'If we say we have not sinned, we make Him out to be a liar and His word is not in us' (1 John 1:10).

That's ONE COMMANDMENT. But you can't believe because you don't believe God is TRULY GOOD. You think he is EVIL with PRIVELEGES of doing stuff merely "CALLED" Good.

It seems to be you who thinks that God is evil, either because you believe that He demands of us righteousness we can't achieve without offering salvation, or because you believe that He is not holy and doesn't care about righteousness. You contradict yourself so often it's hard to tell which one it is you believe

When you can do what you want you can do EVIL and Call it good.

Is this part of your belief. It is very strange.

But God is GOOD WHOLLY GOOD. He is KIND and LOVING. Never evil.

Amen!

The only person who says worship me and I will give you everything is SATAN:

'Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting Gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth.........saying with a loud voice, "Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgements has come, and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water' (Revelation 14:6-7).
One difference between God and Satan is that Satan is a liar.

"Well no one's stopping you. Of you go and love God with all your heart, all your strength and all your mind (in Mark 12, Jesus says, "with all your soul," as well, so throw that in with good measure). And love your neighbour as yourself.

Piece of CAKE. I got a good teacher, and you can do the same with great joy.

'Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?' But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved in the same manner as they' (Acts 15:10-11).

You have some strange view that sin is some kind of perk and loving God is some kind of chore.

On the contrary: 'For I delight in the law of God according to the inward man. But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. O wretched man that I am! Who will deliver me from this body of death? I thank God- through Jesus Christ our Lord!' To love God is a delight and a privilege, but in order to love God as He deserves you need to understand how much you have been forgiven, and that takes us right back to Luke 7:44-45.

Matthew 11
28“Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest.

My favourite verse! Those who are weary and burdened trying to keep the law (such as Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18) can come to Christ and find rest at the foot of the cross.

Agape is the highest priority. 1 Corinthians 13. 1 john 4.

Love is the entire goal of Christianity. 1 Timothy 1:5

1 Timothy 1:5. 'Now the purpose of the commandment is love from a pure heart, from a good conscience, and from sincere faith.' Is your heart pure? Is your conscience good? Is your faith sincere? Have you seen yourself as a poor lost sinner and an unprofitable servant (Luke 17:10)? Are you wholly dependent on the Lord Jesus for salvation or are you so confident in this love you keep bragging about?

Very basics is you need to forgive people when they do you wrong

Amen! But you will only do that (and then not perfectly) when you are born again by the Spirit of God.

and quit believing THEY themselves are bad but they are enslaved by bad motivations.

So Christ didn't die for the ungodly then (Romans 5:6)? If He didn't, there's no hope for me Romans 3:10-18)..

38“You have heard that it was said, ‘AN EYE FOR AN EYE, AND A TOOTH FOR A TOOTH.’ 39“But I say to you, do not resist an evil person; but whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also. 40“If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, let him have your coat also. 41“Whoever forces you to go one mile, go with him two. 42“Give to him who asks of you, and do not turn away from him who wants to borrow from you.

So you are perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect are you? Congratulations. The rest of us give thanks for Jesus Christ.

Matthew 25

34“Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.... etc.

Nothing about God visiting himself or feeding himself. What happens to the person who does all these things?

There is the standard, but none of us keeps it. If we could, the Lord Jesus would have stayed in heaven and just sent us down some more stone tablets with commandments on. No need for Him to suffer and die for sinners. 'Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped and the whole world may become guilty before God. Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight for by the law is the knowledge of sin' (Romans 3:19-20)

All this detail and explanation would not be necessary with your version.

Absolutely necessary to convict sinners of their sin. If you can read that parable without realising that by nature you are one of the goats (Ephesians 2:3) and praising God for sending Christ to rescue you at measureless cost, you are totally blind. And if you don't desire to live more like the sheep in the parable, then you never been born again.

King says those on right, "I picked you to go to heaven", King says to those on left "I picked you to go to hell" Why? Cause I says so and I'm the most merciful loving God, bye!

If there are no sinners in heaven, then God is just and righteous. If Christ's blood availed for only one person, then God is also merciful and loving. In fact it has availed for a crowd so vast that no man can number it, and every one of them is 'crying out with a loud voice, "Salvation belongs to our God who sits upon the throne and to the Lamb!"' (Revelation 7:9-10).

 

[utilyan]

Well you're the guy who loves little, because your god is not the holy God of the Bible. If you knew the holiness and righteousness of God and His utter detestation of sin, you would know the amazing love of the Father that sent the Son to be the propitiation of your sins, not when you were a pretty OK kind of fellow who just needed to raise his game a bit, but when you were dead in trespasses and sins. It's not a question of working up some extra super love to satisfy Christ, it's understanding the cost of your redemption. If you knew this you wouldn't be bragging about how much you love God, you'd be saying,

'Died He for Me who caused His pain?
For me who Him to death pursued?
Amazing love! How can it be
That Thou, my God, should'st die for me?'

God forbid that I should boast save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ'

Amen! Only one Gospel. The scribe is like you. He thinks he can fulfil the law to be right with Christ. He has no idea of the sinfulness of his own heart. Our Lord refers him to the law, and then shows him that he doesn't keep it and can't keep it, so he needs a Saviour.
The jailor knows better. He came 'trembling' to Paul and Silas because he had seen the power of God and knew he was a sinner. So Paul refers him to grace: 'Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved' (Acts 16:31).

True saving faith is not believing that there was someone called Jesus who lived a long time ago and did a lot of good stuff. It is understanding that you are a sinner and that God would be perfectly just to send you to hell for all eternity. Then understanding that Jesus Christ has done everything necessary to save you. That He has taken your sin upon His sinless shoulders and paid the penalty for it in full. It is turning away from your sin and turning to Christ as your Prophet, Priest and King, not trusting in any righteousness of your own, but in the merits of Jesus, and determining to live the best life you can. not in order to be saved, nor to brag about it on the Baptist Board, but out of love for the Saviour who has loved us so much

That's another summary of Luke 10:27. To be sure it's a commandment, but if you are relying on that to save you, you are in for a shock, because the same person who wrote that also wrote. 'If we say we have not sinned, we make Him out to be a liar and His word is not in us' (1 John 1:10).

It seems to be you who thinks that God is evil, either because you believe that He demands of us righteousness we can't achieve without offering salvation, or because you believe that He is not holy and doesn't care about righteousness. You contradict yourself so often it's hard to tell which one it is you believe

Is this part of your belief. It is very strange.

Amen!

'Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting Gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth.........saying with a loud voice, "Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgements has come, and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water' (Revelation 14:6-7).
One difference between God and Satan is that Satan is a liar.

If there are no sinners in heaven, then God is just and righteous. If Christ's blood availed for only one person, then God is also merciful and loving. In fact it has availed for a crowd so vast that no man can number it, and every one of them is 'crying out with a loud voice, "Salvation belongs to our God who sits upon the throne and to the Lamb!"' (Revelation 7:9-10).

Martin , under your structure that woman would not have qualified you would claim she doesn't have the ability to love Jesus. We see her sins get forgiven because her act of love.

48Then He said to her, “Your sins have been forgiven.” 49Those who were reclining at the table with Him began to say to themselves, “Who is this man who even forgives sins?” 50And He said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”


You would argue that her sins would have to be forgiven first to be born again and then she gains the capability to love Jesus.

But not only is she qualified prior to being born again, even the Pharisee himself is qualified.


Luke 7

39Now when the Pharisee who had invited Him saw this, he said to himself, “If this man were a prophet He would know who and what sort of person this woman is who is touching Him, that she is a sinner.”

40And Jesus answered him, “Simon, I have something to say to you.” And he replied, “Say it, Teacher.” 41“A moneylender had two debtors: one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. 42“When they were unable to repay, he graciously forgave them both. So which of them will love him more?” 43Simon answered and said, “I suppose the one whom he forgave more.” And He said to him, “You have judged correctly.” 44Turning toward the woman, He said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave Me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. 45“You gave Me no kiss; but she, since the time I came in, has not ceased to kiss My feet. 46“You did not anoint My head with oil, but she anointed My feet with perfume. 47“For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.”

This teaching is for the Pharisee. You would say neither the Pharisee nor the woman are capable of love. Yet Jesus says they are capable and that forgiveness comes in proportion to the love.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Martin , under your structure that woman would not have qualified you would claim she doesn't have the ability to love Jesus. We see her sins get forgiven because her act of love.

48Then He said to her, “Your sins have been forgiven.” 49Those who were reclining at the table with Him began to say to themselves, “Who is this man who even forgives sins?” 50And He said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”

You can't even get the simplest thing right, can you? Her 'act of love' did not save her. "Woman your faith has saved you; go in peace."

Her faith, which was of course the gift of God (Ephesians 2:8), saved her. Her act of love was the evidence that her faith was genuine- 'works befitting repentance' (Acts 26:20).

You would argue that her sins would have to be forgiven first to be born again and then she gains the capability to love Jesus.

You have not the faintest idea what I would argue. She must be born again first, then she can trust in Jesus Christ for salvation and then she would love Him who loved her so much (cf. Acts 16:14-15).

But not only is she qualified prior to being born again, even the Pharisee himself is qualified.

John 3:3. Her act proves her to have been born again. Whether the Pharisee was saved or not we are not told. It is entirely possible because God says, 'I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy' (Romans 9:15).

 

[Yeshua1]

Martin , under your structure that woman would not have qualified you would claim she doesn't have the ability to love Jesus. We see her sins get forgiven because her act of love.

48Then He said to her, “Your sins have been forgiven.” 49Those who were reclining at the table with Him began to say to themselves, “Who is this man who even forgives sins?” 50And He said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”


You would argue that her sins would have to be forgiven first to be born again and then she gains the capability to love Jesus.

But not only is she qualified prior to being born again, even the Pharisee himself is qualified.


Luke 7

39Now when the Pharisee who had invited Him saw this, he said to himself, “If this man were a prophet He would know who and what sort of person this woman is who is touching Him, that she is a sinner.”

40And Jesus answered him, “Simon, I have something to say to you.” And he replied, “Say it, Teacher.” 41“A moneylender had two debtors: one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. 42“When they were unable to repay, he graciously forgave them both. So which of them will love him more?” 43Simon answered and said, “I suppose the one whom he forgave more.” And He said to him, “You have judged correctly.” 44Turning toward the woman, He said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave Me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. 45“You gave Me no kiss; but she, since the time I came in, has not ceased to kiss My feet. 46“You did not anoint My head with oil, but she anointed My feet with perfume. 47“For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.”

This teaching is for the Pharisee. You would say neither the Pharisee nor the woman are capable of love. Yet Jesus says they are capable and that forgiveness comes in proportion to the love.

God stated ta the ONLYway a sinner gets saved is due to what Jesus did on the Cross, and they received that thru faith alone. Period!
No water baptism, Communion, act of love etc can save anyone!

 

[utilyan]

You can't even get the simplest thing right, can you? Her 'act of love' did not save her. "Woman your faith has saved you; go in peace."

Her faith, which was of course the gift of God (Ephesians 2:8), saved her. Her act of love was the evidence that her faith was genuine- 'works befitting repentance' (Acts 26:20).

You have not the faintest idea what I would argue. She must be born again first, then she can trust in Jesus Christ for salvation and then she would love Him who loved her so much (cf. Acts 16:14-15).

John 3:3. Her act proves her to have been born again. Whether the Pharisee was saved or not we are not told. It is entirely possible because God says, 'I will have mercy on whomever I will have mercy' (Romans 9:15).

Your wrong. Had she been born again she would have known to been forgiven.

In other words forgiveness on God's part FIRST, given holy spirit, she already wiped clean, once saved always saved, then BORN AGAIN, then goes to Jesus seeking forgiveness, getting forgiveness twice.

That's NONSENSE.

Jesus Christ calls the shots.

He tells her "YOUR SINS HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN". He forgave her right there on the spot.

And Jesus says WHY, Because she loved much.

Your version would have been Your sins are forgiven, WHY? because I loved much not because SHE loved much.

This is easy debate simply because scripture doesn't back the idea of a evil God who would destroy the will of another person.

Lets say it happen your way. GOD lost, It would be a total failure. Since a person had no freedom to repent. Instead their will is replaced by a fake. Evil wins on the simple claim that God himself was afraid as to requiring to forcibly alter the will of another.


In fact your version is NO FORGIVENESS at all. Its a forced on zombie brain transplant. She had no choice, Her will is destroyed. She doesn't repent, you have it where God does all the repenting.

Jesus even indicates the PHARISEE who loves little, still gets forgiven even if only a little.

Did he get a mini-born again?

 

[Yeshua1]

Your wrong. Had she been born again she would have known to been forgiven.

In other words forgiveness on God's part FIRST, given holy spirit, she already wiped clean, once saved always saved, then BORN AGAIN, then goes to Jesus seeking forgiveness, getting forgiveness twice.

That's NONSENSE.

Jesus Christ calls the shots.

He tells her "YOUR SINS HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN". He forgave her right there on the spot.

And Jesus says WHY, Because she loved much.

Your version would have been Your sins are forgiven, WHY? because I loved much not because SHE loved much.

This is easy debate simply because scripture doesn't back the idea of a evil God who would destroy the will of another person.

Lets say it happen your way. GOD lost, It would be a total failure. Since a person had no freedom to repent. Instead their will is replaced by a fake. Evil wins on the simple claim that God himself was afraid as to requiring to forcibly alter the will of another.


In fact your version is NO FORGIVENESS at all. Its a forced on zombie brain transplant. She had no choice, Her will is destroyed. She doesn't repent, you have it where God does all the repenting.

Jesus even indicates the PHARISEE who loves little, still gets forgiven even if only a little.

Did he get a mini-born again?

NONE have ever been saved by acts of love, or any other good deed, its by Grace of God alone, thru receiving Jesus by faith alone!

ALL the things done by a Mother Theresa did NOTHING to save her!

 

[utilyan]

NONE have ever been saved by acts of love, or any other good deed, its by Grace of God alone, thru receiving Jesus by faith alone!

ALL the things done by a Mother Theresa did NOTHING to save her!

We do the command of God because God commands it.

We are not like some prostitute who hears commands of God and can only think "Will doing this save me?" or "whats my pay for the CHORE of doing what God says?"

Salvation is not our first concern. If you only care about salvation then your selfish you only care about yourself.

Hell for you is whether you get toasted or not. Our concern is others first.

ROMANS 9
3For I could wish that I myself were accursed, separated from Christ for the sake of my brethren

^What do you know about THAT? We know all about that. Who is this CATHOLIC in your church!?

If ever heard any of you sound remotely like this I WOULD EAT MY OWN SHOE, cause then I'd be up against a REAL CHRISTIAN.

But brother you ain't even close, not even to a rumor on the shadow of a breathe, to sounding ANYTHING like Paul.

Whatever Paul's faith is, it CLEARLY is not you. You wouldn't say the above, Your only taught to care about yourself and you get a "brand" name on whats on your mind and in your hand, which is to "save" yourself and condemn others.

Commandment #1 is not thou shalt save yourself!

 

[Yeshua1]

We do the command of God because God commands it.

We are not like some prostitute who hears commands of God and can only think "Will doing this save me?" or "whats my pay for the CHORE of doing what God says?"

Salvation is not our first concern. If you only care about salvation then your selfish you only care about yourself.

Hell for you is whether you get toasted or not. Our concern is others first.

ROMANS 9
3For I could wish that I myself were accursed, separated from Christ for the sake of my brethren

^What do you know about THAT? We know all about that. Who is this CATHOLIC in your church!?

If ever heard any of you sound remotely like this I WOULD EAT MY OWN SHOE, cause then I'd be up against a REAL CHRISTIAN.

But brother you ain't even close, not even to a rumor on the shadow of a breathe, to sounding ANYTHING like Paul.

Whatever Paul's faith is, it CLEARLY is not you. You wouldn't say the above, Your only taught to care about yourself and you get a "brand" name on whats on your mind and in your hand, which is to "save" yourself and condemn others.

Commandment #1 is not thou shalt save yourself!

What is te Gospel of Jesus ten? Is it saved by works/love, or by grace alone faith alone?

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Your wrong. Had she been born again she would have known to been forgiven.

In other words forgiveness on God's part FIRST, given holy spirit, she already wiped clean, once saved always saved, then BORN AGAIN, then goes to Jesus seeking forgiveness, getting forgiveness twice.

That's NONSENSE

It certainly is. It doesn't even make sense. Try it again in English, please

Jesus Christ calls the shots.

He tells her "YOUR SINS HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN". He forgave her right there on the spot.

And Jesus says WHY, Because she loved much.

Your version would have been Your sins are forgiven, WHY? because I loved much not because SHE loved much.

Yes, He tells her that her sins have been forgiven. Then He tells her why. 'Then He said to her,, "your sins are forgiven." And those who sat at the table with Him began to say to themselves "Who is this that even forgives sins?" Then He said to the woman, "Your faith has saved you. Go in peace."' Why are you arguing about this? How much clearer can He make it? Do you think Jesus was wrong? Or was He lying? Five words, that's all it is "Your faith has saved you." What is so difficult to understand?

Your version would have been Your sins are forgiven, WHY? because I loved much not because SHE loved much.

Exactly so. 'We love Him because He first loved us' (1 John 4:19). The Lord Jesus Christ set His love upon this woman from eternity, and in time He came to earth and bore her sins upon the cross. How should she not love the one who loved her so much?

This is easy debate simply because scripture doesn't back the idea of a evil God who would destroy the will of another person.

Indeed it doesn't. It states the truth of a kind and gracious God who says, "I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you shall keep My judgements and do them' (Ezekiel 36:26-27).

Lets say it happens your way. GOD lost, It would be a total failure. Since a person had no freedom to repent. Instead their will is replaced by a fake. Evil wins on the simple claim that God himself was afraid as to requiring to forcibly alter the will of another.

In fact your version is NO FORGIVENESS at all. Its a forced on zombie brain transplant. She had no choice, Her will is destroyed. She doesn't repent, you have it where God does all the repenting.

No one repents for us. It is we who have to repent and if anyone refuses to do so it is because of their sinful unregenerate heart (John 3:19; 5:40). God in His love and mercy gives wretched culpable sinners a new birth which enables them to repent. You may call it a zombie brain transplant if you wish. If it is that, I praise God for making me a zombie because I would never have believed unless God had given me faith; never repented unless He had given me repentance.

'Lord, I was blind! I could not see
In Thy marred visage any grace;
But now the beauty of Thy face
In radiant visions dawns on me.

Lord, I was deaf! I could not hear
The thrilling music of Thy voice;
But now I hear Thee and rejoice,
And all Thine uttered words are dear.

Lord, I was dumb! I could not speak
The grace and glory of Thy name;
But now, as touched with living flame,
My lips Thine eager praises wake.

Lord, I was dead! I could not stir
My lifeless soul to come to Thee
But now, since Thou hast quickened me,
I rise from sin's dark sepulchre.

Lord Thou hast made the blind to see;
the deaf to hear, the dumb to speak,
The dead to live; and lo! I break
The chains of my captivity.'

Jesus even indicates the PHARISEE who loves little, still gets forgiven even if only a little.

Did he get a mini-born again?

Show me where the Lord said his sins were forgiven. How can sins be forgiven 'only a little'? He thought he had little to be forgiven for and so he loved his Lord only a little or not at all (cf. Luke 7:44-47; Revelation 3:17). He needed to be like the Psalmist who cried out, 'For Your name's sake, O Lord, pardon my iniquity, for it is great' (Psalm 25:11). Perhaps the Lord saved him, but we are not told.
.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

ROMANS 9
3For I could wish that I myself were accursed, separated from Christ for the sake of my brethren

^What do you know about THAT? We know all about that. Who is this CATHOLIC in your church!?

If ever heard any of you sound remotely like this I WOULD EAT MY OWN SHOE, cause then I'd be up against a REAL CHRISTIAN.

But brother you ain't even close, not even to a rumour on the shadow of a breathe, to sounding ANYTHING like Paul.

You know nothing about any of us yet you are willing to condemn us out of hand. You are like the Pharisees who said, "This crowd that does not know the law is accursed" (John 7:49). I can tell you what we all are- we are sinners, saved by grace. None of us has anything to boast about, unlike you. But as for you, 'Whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted' (Matthew 23:12).

 

[Yeshua1]

You know nothing about any of us yet you are willing to condemn us out of hand. You are like the Pharisees who said, "This crowd that does not know the law is accursed" (John 7:49). I can tell you what we all are- we are sinners, saved by grace. None of us has anything to boast about, unlike you. But as for you, 'Whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted' (Matthew 23:12).

He speaks of gospel that cannot save anyone, as we all need to ge saved due to God work on our behalf, not the "works" we try to do for HIm on our behalf!

 

[Revmitchell]

What is te Gospel of Jesus ten? Is it saved by works/love, or by grace alone faith alone?

You guys need to stop trying to call everything under the sun works. It just gets to the point of being ridiculous.

 

[Yeshua1]

You guys need to stop trying to call everything under the sun works. It just gets to the point of being ridiculous.

We re not doing that, he is, as his view of Gospel istat acts of love save us!

 

[utilyan]

It certainly is. It doesn't even make sense. Try it again in English, please

Yes, He tells her that her sins have been forgiven. Then He tells her why. 'Then He said to her,, "your sins are forgiven." And those who sat at the table with Him began to say to themselves "Who is this that even forgives sins?" Then He said to the woman, "Your faith has saved you. Go in peace."' Why are you arguing about this? How much clearer can He make it? Do you think Jesus was wrong? Or was He lying? Five words, that's all it is "Your faith has saved you." What is so difficult to understand?

Exactly so. 'We love Him because He first loved us' (1 John 4:19). The Lord Jesus Christ set His love upon this woman from eternity, and in time He came to earth and bore her sins upon the cross. How should she not love the one who loved her so much?

Indeed it doesn't. It states the truth of a kind and gracious God who says, "I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you shall keep My judgements and do them' (Ezekiel 36:26-27).

No one repents for us. It is we who have to repent and if anyone refuses to do so it is because of their sinful unregenerate heart (John 3:19; 5:40). God in His love and mercy gives wretched culpable sinners a new birth which enables them to repent. You may call it a zombie brain transplant if you wish. If it is that, I praise God for making me a zombie because I would never have believed unless God had given me faith; never repented unless He had given me repentance.

'Lord, I was blind! I could not see
In Thy marred visage any grace;
But now the beauty of Thy face
In radiant visions dawns on me.

Lord, I was deaf! I could not hear
The thrilling music of Thy voice;
But now I hear Thee and rejoice,
And all Thine uttered words are dear.

Lord, I was dumb! I could not speak
The grace and glory of Thy name;
But now, as touched with living flame,
My lips Thine eager praises wake.

Lord, I was dead! I could not stir
My lifeless soul to come to Thee
But now, since Thou hast quickened me,
I rise from sin's dark sepulchre.

Lord Thou hast made the blind to see;
the deaf to hear, the dumb to speak,
The dead to live; and lo! I break
The chains of my captivity.'

Show me where the Lord said his sins were forgiven. How can sins be forgiven 'only a little'? He thought he had little to be forgiven for and so he loved his Lord only a little or not at all (cf. Luke 7:44-47; Revelation 3:17). He needed to be like the Psalmist who cried out, 'For Your name's sake, O Lord, pardon my iniquity, for it is great' (Psalm 25:11). Perhaps the Lord saved him, but we are not told.
.

"Show me where the Lord said his sins were forgiven. How can sins be forgiven 'only a little'? "

Jesus Christ said it.


Luke 7
39Now when the Pharisee who had invited Him saw this, he said to himself, “If this man were a prophet He would know who and what sort of person this woman is who is touching Him, that she is a sinner.”
40And Jesus answered him, “Simon, I have something to say to you.” And he replied, “Say it, Teacher.” 41“A moneylender had two debtors: one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. 42“When they were unable to repay, he graciously forgave them both. So which of them will love him more?” 43Simon answered and said, “I suppose the one whom he forgave more.” And He said to him, “You have judged correctly.” 44Turning toward the woman, He said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave Me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. 45“You gave Me no kiss; but she, since the time I came in, has not ceased to kiss My feet. 46“You did not anoint My head with oil, but she anointed My feet with perfume. 47“For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.” 48Then He said to her, “Your sins have been forgiven.” 49Those who were reclining at the table with Him began to say to themselves, “Who is this man who even forgives sins?” 50And He said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”

He tells SIMON, he did not anoint his head nor gave no kiss. He let him in his house, he calls him teacher. He is classifying him:

47“For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.”


He didn't say he who gets no forgiveness are those who love little.

And why is Jesus Christ even BOTHER to tell this man, If it requires something on Christ's part for him to do the proper action?

Should not Simon have been just as attentive as the woman? The answer is yes and the Pharisee was absolutely capable of doing this.


"Try it again in English, please"

You want to challenge forgiving a little?

40And Jesus answered him, “Simon, I have something to say to you.” And he replied, “Say it, Teacher.” 41“A moneylender had two debtors: one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. 42“When they were unable to repay, he graciously forgave them both. So which of them will love him more?” 43Simon answered and said, “I suppose the one whom he forgave more.” And He said to him, “You have judged correctly.”

Brother if anyone needs to learn English, It ought to be the genius who skipped right over this part of the story.

You would argue Simon isn't even capable of judging correctly. That he has no capacity. Simon is no different than that woman, They both know what is right and both can do what is right.

This is why Jesus gives him the comparison, The whole teaching is geared to the sinner which is the Pharisee who has something to learn. Who exactly like you thinks he is the only one privileged with the capacity to do right.

 

[MB]

Seems to me loving anyone is not a bad thing. I do not agree that it's a work for Salvation nor do I agree Loving much will save anyone. Only thing that can save any of us is God and our faith and trust in Him. It is not enough to say we believe but believing causes us to also do His bidding. Not that Love has no part in Salvation. It does. Because we are saved because of God's Love toward us and our Love toward Him. I first began to Love Jesus when I first heard of His reason for dying for our sins. He Loved us first. We are all so blessed because we have a God who Loves us so much, He gave His only Son to pay for our sins. I thank God Almighty for His wonderful sacrifice for a low life such as me.
MB

 

[Yeshua1]

"Show me where the Lord said his sins were forgiven. How can sins be forgiven 'only a little'? "

Jesus Christ said it.


Luke 7
39Now when the Pharisee who had invited Him saw this, he said to himself, “If this man were a prophet He would know who and what sort of person this woman is who is touching Him, that she is a sinner.”
40And Jesus answered him, “Simon, I have something to say to you.” And he replied, “Say it, Teacher.” 41“A moneylender had two debtors: one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. 42“When they were unable to repay, he graciously forgave them both. So which of them will love him more?” 43Simon answered and said, “I suppose the one whom he forgave more.” And He said to him, “You have judged correctly.” 44Turning toward the woman, He said to Simon, “Do you see this woman? I entered your house; you gave Me no water for My feet, but she has wet My feet with her tears and wiped them with her hair. 45“You gave Me no kiss; but she, since the time I came in, has not ceased to kiss My feet. 46“You did not anoint My head with oil, but she anointed My feet with perfume. 47“For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.” 48Then He said to her, “Your sins have been forgiven.” 49Those who were reclining at the table with Him began to say to themselves, “Who is this man who even forgives sins?” 50And He said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”

He tells SIMON, he did not anoint his head nor gave no kiss. He let him in his house, he calls him teacher. He is classifying him:

47“For this reason I say to you, her sins, which are many, have been forgiven, for she loved much; but he who is forgiven little, loves little.”


He didn't say he who gets no forgiveness are those who love little.

And why is Jesus Christ even BOTHER to tell this man, If it requires something on Christ's part for him to do the proper action?

Should not Simon have been just as attentive as the woman? The answer is yes and the Pharisee was absolutely capable of doing this.


"Try it again in English, please"

You want to challenge forgiving a little?

40And Jesus answered him, “Simon, I have something to say to you.” And he replied, “Say it, Teacher.” 41“A moneylender had two debtors: one owed five hundred denarii, and the other fifty. 42“When they were unable to repay, he graciously forgave them both. So which of them will love him more?” 43Simon answered and said, “I suppose the one whom he forgave more.” And He said to him, “You have judged correctly.”

Brother if anyone needs to learn English, It ought to be the genius who skipped right over this part of the story.

You would argue Simon isn't even capable of judging correctly. That he has no capacity. Simon is no different than that woman, They both know what is right and both can do what is right.

This is why Jesus gives him the comparison, The whole teaching is geared to the sinner which is the Pharisee who has something to learn. Who exactly like you thinks he is the only one privileged with the capacity to do right.

The love was the fruit of her faith in Jesus to save her though! First saved, then love!