Sojourners Pleads: Keep Russell Moore

[Jerome]

Liberal evangelical group upset at talk of top bureaucrat at SBC's ERLC being reined in or let go:

Sojouners - Firing Russell Moore Would Create 'Trump Baptist Convention'

Sojourners - Attacking Russell Moore a Mistake

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Liberal evangelical group upset at talk of top bureaucrat at SBC's ERLC being reined in or let go:

Sojouners - Firing Russell Moore Would Create 'Trump Baptist Convention'

Sojourners - Attacking Russell Moore a Mistake

Jerome, do you seriously think anyone would care? Im asking you sincerely ....because what Ive seen of Moore leads me to believe he is proudly very left oriented. I could be wrong however. I would like to hear more commentary.

 

[FollowTheWay]

Liberal evangelical group upset at talk of top bureaucrat at SBC's ERLC being reined in or let go:

Sojouners - Firing Russell Moore Would Create 'Trump Baptist Convention'

Sojourners - Attacking Russell Moore a Mistake

It already is the "Trump Baptist Convention." It's been the Republican Baptist Convention for a long time. All of this political entanglement has been very destructive to the church. Jesus said that a man can't serve two masters. Well, most Southern Baptists chose the Republican Party over Him especially by backing a satanic candidate like Trump.

 

[JonC]

It already is the "Trump Baptist Convention." It's been the Republican Baptist Convention for a long time. All of this political entanglement has been very destructive to the church. Jesus said that a man can't serve two masters. Well, most Southern Baptists chose the Republican Party over Him especially by backing a satanic candidate like Trump.

1. Are you Southern Baptist? (If not, why would you even have an opinion that demands voicing of a convention to which you are not affiliated? If so, are you one of these "many"?)

2. I am a Southern Baptist and your assassment seems foreign to my experience with the churches in my area and our local associations. Please evidence your claim that MOST Southern Baptists choose the GOP over Christ.

Edit - Please respond to #2 if you are a member of a SBC church as if it is gossip and slander I really don't care.

 

[Revmitchell]

It already is the "Trump Baptist Convention." It's been the Republican Baptist Convention for a long time. All of this political entanglement has been very destructive to the church. Jesus said that a man can't serve two masters. Well, most Southern Baptists chose the Republican Party over Him especially by backing a satanic candidate like Trump.

None of this is true

 

[FollowTheWay]

1. Are you Southern Baptist? (If not, why would you even have an opinion that demands voicing of a convention to which you are not affiliated? If so, are you one of these "many"?)

2. I am a Southern Baptist and your assassment seems foreign to my experience with the churches in my area and our local associations. Please evidence your claim that MOST Southern Baptists choose the GOP over Christ.

Edit - Please respond to #2 if you are a member of a SBC church as if it is gossip and slander I really don't care.

I have been a life-long Baptist. I grew up in a Southern Baptist church. I was the Youth-Week Pastor and preached to a congregation of about 800 as a Sr. in high school. While working in the Northeast for a long time, I belonged to an American Baptist church. I moved back to the South and joined a dual aligned church (CBF-SBC) which I have found pretty much follows the SBC. I just call myself a Christian and a follower of Jesus of Nazareth these days. Of course I accept and love true Christians from other denominations. I stand on the teaching of Jesus and not the whims of a denominational body. Remember the concept of "priesthood of the believer?"

In my last two churches I have served as a Deacon, Sunday School teacher, member of the choir, greeter and done lay preaching at retirement homes. I served on two pulpit committees in the American Baptist church and drafted their statement of faith based primarily on the New Hampshire Confession. My brother is an ordained Baptist Minister. We co-preached our mother's funeral because we had the strongest feeling that Mom wanted her boys to take her home. It was one of the most meaningful experiences of my life.

Why would I have an opinion on the overwhelming support Southern Baptists gave to Trump? Because I feel that did a huge amount of damage to the church I love and have served. The unsaved already looked at us as hypocrites. This gave them a much better reason for thinking that. Also, I find a lot of hate in the church these days. There is no room for hate in true Christianity. Christians are characterized by their love for God, their neighbor (including blacks, Muslims, Hispanics and Democrats), and even their enemies.

I believe the statement in the Bible which says "Strait is the way and narrow is the path that leadeth unto salvation and few shall find it." I believe those few are the ones who have had a genuine born-again Christian conversion, follow Christ and exhibit Christian love. These are Baptists who believe and preach that repentance is not required for salvation and that a noticeable change in a person's life does not accompany it. I reject those false teachings.

 

[Baptist Believer]

...because what Ive seen of Moore leads me to believe he is proudly very left oriented.

Moore is in no way "left oriented." He just sounds left-wing because "left" and "right" are the only categories that many in the United States understand - and they are related to the Democratic and Republican Parties. If you oppose the Republican candidate for any reason, folks assume that you are "left." I opposed Trump, therefore many friends and even family members assumed that I was a hard-core Democrat, which is a long way from the truth.

Biblically, there were very strong reasons to oppose every candidate that was in contention for the Presidency. Those who recognized this fact had difficult choices to make.

 

[FriendofSpurgeon]

I view Moore as a voice of reason within the Baptist community. Sorry to hear that he is under such fire at the SBC.

 

[Revmitchell]

I hardly ever agree with Moore. That said there is way to much emotion over moore and it is not deserved.

 

[JonC]

I have been a life-long Baptist. I grew up in a Southern Baptist church. I was the Youth-Week Pastor and preached to a congregation of about 800 as a Sr. in high school. While working in the Northeast for a long time, I belonged to an American Baptist church. I moved back to the South and joined a dual aligned church (CBF-SBC) which I have found pretty much follows the SBC. I just call myself a Christian and a follower of Jesus of Nazareth these days. Of course I accept and love true Christians from other denominations. I stand on the teaching of Jesus and not the whims of a denominational body. Remember the concept of "priesthood of the believer?"

In my last two churches I have served as a Deacon, Sunday School teacher, member of the choir, greeter and done lay preaching at retirement homes. I served on two pulpit committees in the American Baptist church and drafted their statement of faith based primarily on the New Hampshire Confession. My brother is an ordained Baptist Minister. We co-preached our mother's funeral because we had the strongest feeling that Mom wanted her boys to take her home. It was one of the most meaningful experiences of my life.

Why would I have an opinion on the overwhelming support Southern Baptists gave to Trump? Because I feel that did a huge amount of damage to the church I love and have served. The unsaved already looked at us as hypocrites. This gave them a much better reason for thinking that. Also, I find a lot of hate in the church these days. There is no room for hate in true Christianity. Christians are characterized by their love for God, their neighbor (including blacks, Muslims, Hispanics and Democrats), and even their enemies.

I believe the statement in the Bible which says "Strait is the way and narrow is the path that leadeth unto salvation and few shall find it." I believe those few are the ones who have had a genuine born-again Christian conversion, follow Christ and exhibit Christian love. These are Baptists who believe and preach that repentance is not required for salvation and that a noticeable change in a person's life does not accompany it. I reject those false teachings.

We share many concerns. I also grew up in a SBC affiliated church. I've been in a SBC church for over 40 years (although I've never considered SBC membership a criteria). I've been a deacon, taught, preached, graduated from a SBC affiliated seminary .... and I share some of your concerns. But you stereotyped a large number of those people you profess to love when you said MOST Southern Baptists choose the GOP over Christ.I believe many see the lie in your statement.

From articles, interviews, and blogs (many referenced on this forum) most Baptists who have voiced a support for Trump have done so because of their love for Christ and their neighbors. You may argue against their conclusions and applications but you cannot argue against their motives (which you assume satanic by choosing a secular political party over Jesus Christ). Given your experience you should have known better.

So again, please evidence the claim that MOST Southern Baptist have chosen the Republican Party (you could include those who supported the DNC also, as numbers indicate many voted that way) over Christ.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Moore is in no way "left oriented." He just sounds left-wing because "left" and "right" are the only categories that many in the United States understand - and they are related to the Democratic and Republican Parties. If you oppose the Republican candidate for any reason, folks assume that you are "left." I opposed Trump, therefore many friends and even family members assumed that I was a hard-core Democrat, which is a long way from the truth.

Biblically, there were very strong reasons to oppose every candidate that was in contention for the Presidency. Those who recognized this fact had difficult choices to make.

Brother, I like my church.....part of the reason is that they never took a political stance, not in the pulpit, not in conversation ....Really nothing. The focus was entirely on Christ. Now I have been to churches who attempt to influence voting but not here. Therefore if Russel Moore was vocal on politics, then his next position should be in politics.

 

[Rob_BW]

I guess we'll have to start kicking Republicans out of the SBC until the numbers get back to 50/50, because fairness.

 

[Baptist Believer]

Therefore if Russel Moore was vocal on politics, then his next position should be in politics.

Except that is his role. He is the head of the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission of the SBC. It is the public policy arm of the Convention.

 

[FollowTheWay]

We share many concerns. I also grew up in a SBC affiliated church. I've been in a SBC church for over 40 years (although I've never considered SBC membership a criteria). I've been a deacon, taught, preached, graduated from a SBC affiliated seminary .... and I share some of your concerns. But you stereotyped a large number of those people you profess to love when you said MOST Southern Baptists choose the GOP over Christ.I believe many see the lie in your statement.

From articles, interviews, and blogs (many referenced on this forum) most Baptists who have voiced a support for Trump have done so because of their love for Christ and their neighbors. You may argue against their conclusions and applications but you cannot argue against their motives (which you assume satanic by choosing a secular political party over Jesus Christ). Given your experience you should have known better.

So again, please evidence the claim that MOST Southern Baptist have chosen the Republican Party (you could include those who supported the DNC also, as numbers indicate many voted that way) over Christ.

I was using the statistic that 81% of white evangelical voted for Trump. I fail to see how voting for such an unChristian man could be done because of a love for Christ and their neighbors. This man has never considered anything as important in his life other than himself, money, power and sex. If you consider that to represent a great Christian role model we'll agree to disagree. I don't. Would Trump have passed the "rich young ruler" test. I'm not the judge but I think not. So what motivated all these evangelicals to support such a man? Politics not their faith.

 

[FollowTheWay]

I was using the statistic that 81% of white evangelical voted for Trump. I fail to see how voting for such an unChristian man could be done because of a love for Christ and their neighbors. This man has never considered anything as important in his life other than himself, money, power and sex. If you consider that to represent a great Christian role model we'll agree to disagree. I don't. Would Trump have passed the "rich young ruler" test. I'm not the judge but I think not. So what motivated all these evangelicals to support such a man? Politics not their faith.

The discussion here has included the situation that several SBC pastors have threatened to disassociate from the SBC because one leader actually spoke out against Trump's obvious moral shortcomings. That's simply amazing to me and makes me feel sad.

 

[JonC]

I was using the statistic that 81% of white evangelical voted for Trump. I fail to see how voting for such an unChristian man could be done because of a love for Christ and their neighbors. This man has never considered anything as important in his life other than himself, money, power and sex. If you consider that to represent a great Christian role model we'll agree to disagree. I don't. Would Trump have passed the "rich young ruler" test. I'm not the judge but I think not. So what motivated all these evangelicals to support such a man? Politics not their faith.

Just because you fail to see something does not make it true. I fail to see how a Christian could even consider supporting one Democrat candidate for any type of leadership position without immediately being driven to his or her knees in repentance for their support of policies that can only be termed "anti-Christ". But you know what? Just because I fail to see it does not make it true. There are plenty of Christians who are Democrats. How? I have absolutely no idea. But I do not have the right to say that every believer who voted for Clinton chose the DNC over Christ, I don't even know their understanding of the issues, the party, or the platform they support. You went to far, brother. That is what I am saying. I am not denying that you bring up some points that may warrant consideration. But you went too far and I really do not see how you can't see that.

Insofar as my vote, I will tell you. I voted for the GOP platform. We can argue that we should vote for the man and not the platform until the cows come home (I never understood that expression). We can argue that my understanding or view of that platform is wrong. But the fact remains that my vote for Trump was not "choosing the Republican Party over Christ", although for you to vote that way it may be.

 

[Revmitchell]

I was using the statistic that 81% of white evangelical voted for Trump. I fail to see how voting for such an unChristian man could be done because of a love for Christ and their neighbors. This man has never considered anything as important in his life other than himself, money, power and sex. If you consider that to represent a great Christian role model we'll agree to disagree. I don't. Would Trump have passed the "rich young ruler" test. I'm not the judge but I think not. So what motivated all these evangelicals to support such a man? Politics not their faith.

What you do not understand young man/woman is that Evangelicals voted for Trump because they felt like he would look out for their interests not because he was a fine specimen of a Christian. You are arguing against an idea no one is proposing and supporting. It's called a "strawman". Don't assume you know why evangelicals voted for Trump, the possibilities are not as limited as you would like them to be.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Except that is his role. He is the head of the Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission of the SBC. It is the public policy arm of the Convention.

There is no commonality between ethics and politicians as he is learning

 

[Baptist Believer]

There is no commonality between ethics and politicians as he is learning

In years past, the role always included a blanket endorsement of the Republican candidate. This year that did not happen and some high-profile Trump enthusiasts who act like they are a big deal on SBC life, are after him.

 

[Revmitchell]

In years past, the role always included a blanket endorsement of the Republican candidate. This year that did not happen and some high-profile Trump enthusiasts who act like they are a big deal on SBC life, are after him.

Sorry that is pure spin. There is much more to it than that.