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Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by utilyan, Feb 2, 2017.

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  1. AndThisGospel

    AndThisGospel Member

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    You haven't provided anything that remotely proves your Calvinistic views. I reject your theology, not the Bible....Learn the difference.
     
    #61 AndThisGospel, Feb 3, 2017
  2. AndThisGospel

    AndThisGospel Member

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    And He did, in Christ Jesus....

    No kidding, but we can chose to believe.....
     
    #62 AndThisGospel, Feb 3, 2017
  3. AndThisGospel

    AndThisGospel Member

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    Back to the point:

    No Sir, you are teaching universalism because you insist that when God's draws men to Himself that this grace is irresistible.

    " And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.”

    Since God draws "all people" to Himself and since (according to you) that draw is irresistible then all will be saved. This is the natural conclusion to your theology.
     
    #63 AndThisGospel, Feb 3, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
  4. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    Yep! I hate that term with a passion. Who are we to accept or reject God? It is God who accepts us- or not (Ephesians 1:6).
    Yep again! John 3:3, 19; 1 Corinthians 2:14; Revelation 9:20-21.
     
    #64 Martin Marprelate, Feb 3, 2017
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2017
  5. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    Does the passage say they will all be reconciled and redeemed?

    I ask because I suggest that the passage has nothing to do with salvation and thus you take the passage out of context.
     
    #65 MennoSota, Feb 3, 2017
  6. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    Indeed, you cannot show any such thing. Yet, I have provided multiple passages where God says he chooses and predestines. Why are you running away from what God very clearly says, yet clinging to a term never expressed in the Bible?

    We go in circles because you refuse to acknowledge God chooses, even though God explicitly tells you. Stop running away.
     
    #66 MennoSota, Feb 3, 2017
  7. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    LOL, the passage explicitly says that God actively ordained Pilate to do his will. How are you so oblivious to what is slapping you in the face? Honestly, you have quoted verse after verse that proves my point and yet you still argue against God's sovereign work. Shake my head.
     
    #67 MennoSota, Feb 3, 2017
  8. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    You reject very clear evidence.

    Re-read Ephesians 1 and 2 and then get back to me. Shake my head.
     
    #68 MennoSota, Feb 3, 2017
  9. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    You don't believe God is all powerful.

    God can do ANYTHING he wants.
    God can give everything free will and still be sovereign over all.


    God can put out the biggest fire with gasoline covered toothpick. Just because you can't doesn't mean he can't.
     
    #69 utilyan, Feb 3, 2017
  10. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    You contradict yourself.

    You claim that all are saved by virtue of unlimited atonement, yet you also claim that we choose to believe. Why does anyone need to choose to believe if we are already saved by virtue of unlimited atonement? The only choice in your scenario is the choice to run away from God's kingdom.

    Now, share with us the scripture that teaches what you preach.
     
    #70 MennoSota, Feb 3, 2017
  11. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    God can steal money from whom he wills, That doesn't mean God will steal money.

    God can shove his finger up anyone's nose, that doesn't mean he has.

    He can will to show mercy to NONE, He can will to show mercy to all.


    The error here is your going over his head saying he doesn't show mercy.

    But you are too late.

    God has commanded all not to sin, this is a mercy. And if anyone doesn't follow his command, they have sinned, to even call it a sin is a mercy.

    God has declared his want and desire. He wants all to love God and All to love neighbor.


    You say you cannot stop sinning, You say its because "sin nature", you tell the potter “Why did you make me like this,”

    Romans 9

    19You will say to me then, “Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?” 20On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, “Why did you make me like this,” will it?


    I never tell the potter that. When I sin the fault lies only with me.



    In fact "sin nature" is a perfect example of hypocrisy against God's perfect sovereignty. Because there is no such thing as anything being the cause and effect concerning you but GOD ALONE.

    I don't care if you have donut nature, God alone makes the calls. I don't care if your elect , enthroned and ate holy pancakes this morning, GOD ALONE makes the calls.

    Every answer to why should be GOD.


    We see the error of Calvinism start with ADAM.

    Genesis 3
    12The man said, “The woman whom You gave to be with me, she gave me from the tree, and I ate.”

    He's saying GOD YOU ORDAINED it when YOU gave me that woman, This is YOUR FAULT.



    Can you stop sinning forever today? why? you say GOD's FAULT.
     
    #71 utilyan, Feb 3, 2017
  12. Martin Marprelate

    Martin Marprelate Well-Known Member
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    Where have I ever posted this? I have spent a great deal of time arguing the exact opposite.

    Oh well! Back on ignore.
     
    #72 Martin Marprelate, Feb 3, 2017
  13. AndThisGospel

    AndThisGospel Member

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    Let me make it clearer to you:

    John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.

    Outside this truth there's no mercy! Do you follow?

    Therefore (now watch this) anyone claiming salvation by any other means other than through Christ is outside God's mercy.
     
    #73 AndThisGospel, Feb 3, 2017
  14. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    Tail between the legs again.

    Can you stop sinning forever today? why? you say GOD's FAULT.
     
    #74 utilyan, Feb 3, 2017
  15. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    God can do all things allowed by His nature ad attributes, but givng to His creation free will equal to his own not possible!
     
    #75 Yeshua1, Feb 3, 2017
  16. utilyan

    utilyan Well-Known Member
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    Says who? Your giving the spiritual and physical mechanics to existence WAY too much credit.

    Yeshua, will you ever be a partaker of Divine nature?

    Please explain how a drop of divine nature has no free will.

    I'm telling you a drop of a drop can make a million of these universes and existences.
     
    #76 utilyan, Feb 3, 2017
  17. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    I will NEVER be God!
     
    #77 Yeshua1, Feb 3, 2017
  18. AndThisGospel

    AndThisGospel Member

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    Your stalling...you have no answers....

    Again, you said that God draws men to Himself and that this grace is irresistible.

    I showed you that Christ, in hanging upon a cross, would draw ALL people to Himself. Therefore the conclusion is all men will be saved. You teach universalism.
     
    #78 AndThisGospel, Feb 3, 2017
  19. MennoSota

    MennoSota Well-Known Member
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    Will all humans stand before God and be judged?

    You are trying to strain beet juice from a turnip. Your passage has nothing to do with salvation. Nice try though. Your attempt to ignore Ephesians 1 and 2 is noted.
     
    #79 MennoSota, Feb 3, 2017
  20. AndThisGospel

    AndThisGospel Member

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    Again, you are stalling...

    You said that God draws men to Himself and that this grace is irresistible.

    I showed you that Christ, in hanging upon a cross, would draw ALL people to Himself. Therefore the conclusion is all men will be saved. You teach universalism.
     
    #80 AndThisGospel, Feb 3, 2017
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