Law/Nt/Legalism/Antinomiam thought/kitchen sink...pt3

The Old Covenant saved No One. “Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.” (Galatians 3:21) (KJV 1900)

 

Except that the 10 were not separated apart, as Jesus and the NT Apostles all brought back to us the 10, not hte 2 Commandments!

 

We strive to obey them, by walking in the empowering of the Holy Spirit.

 

No Icon, YOU'RE the one confused if you believe that the ministration of death 'regenerated' and sent anyone to heaven. Very confused you are.

 

Icon I know you're one of those 'faith alone' people (albeit not in reality). Would you give the reformed spin on this passage?:

5 but after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up for thyself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
6 who will render to every man according to his works:
7 to them that by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and incorruption, eternal life: Ro 2

 

9 .....of the Jew first, and also of the Greek;
10 ,,,,to the Jew first, and also to the Greek:
11 for there is no respect of persons with God.
14 (for when Gentiles that have not the law ......

I know 'heathen' fits the reformed spin here, but the idea is 'non-Jews, with the theme being 'God is no respecter of persons', which begs the question of 3:1.

What advantage then hath the Jew? or what is the profit of circumcision?

 

The Ten Commandments are the abolished Old Covenant. Only the Two Great Commandments remain. ““Indeed, a time is coming,” says the Lord, “when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and Judah.It will not be like the old covenant that I made with their ancestors when I delivered them from Egypt. For they violated that covenant, even though I was like a faithful husband to them,” says the Lord.” (Jeremiah 31:31–32) (NET)

 

The good works of Romans 2 is giving evidence that God has wrought within them [John 3:21; Hebrews 10:16; Jeremiah 31:33; 2 Corinthians 3:3]], i.e., "the work of the law written in their heart", "he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit..".

They're "patient in well-doing" v. 7, 'working good' v. 10, 'doing the law' v. 13, because THEY"RE ALIVE, they're regenerate, not some 'partially depraved' heathen who gets lucky every now and then and does something right.

 

First of all, obeying the seventh commandment and loving one's wife are not mutually exclusive!!
But I am actively engaged in counselling an old friend of mine- not a member of my church- who has been committing adultery on a pretty industrial scale, but who insists that he loves his wife and loves God, and therefore he's not under law but under 'grace.' It's just that his wife can't meet his 'needs.' Unsurprisingly, his wife is not very happy about this. As I talk to the guy, he comes across as a Christian, but very badly taught (Salvation Army background).

I'm sure that if I told him that it's OK for him to carry on seeing prostitutes so long as he loves his wife, it would be a 'total relief to him.' But the fact is that he is mocking God. 'Why do you call me, "Lord, Lord," and not do what I say?' (Luke 6:46). He needs to obey the 7th commandment and seek the forgiveness of both his wife and, especially, God (Psalm 51:4).

I would love to say that this is the only example of this that I've come across, but I expect that most people on the board who have been involved in church oversight will have come across folk who say they love God but won't keep his commandments.

And I have to say that if the fellow you're talking about starts committing adultery because you have told him not to focus on the commandment, you will be sharing the blame for it (James 3:1). It's not 'either.....or,' it's 'both.......and.' If he accepts Romans 8 and Ephesians 5, it should be his delight to keep Exodus 20:14.

 

You are completely misunderstanding the purpose of Paul in Romans 1:18 - 3:20. It is to prove that no one is righteous and to shut both Jew and Gentile up to Christ. The very point he's making is that Gentiles, even though they don't know the law sometimes keep it better than Jews. 'What shall we say then? Are we [Jews] any better than they? Not at all! We have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under sin. As it is written.................therefore no-one will be declared righteous in His sight by observing the law' (Romans 3:9-20).

 

The 10 Commandments, the very Law of God as to what he expects for standards of morality, cam to us before Sinai, so why just be OT?

 

I'm wondering if you read my post fully?

I said:

Yes i understand, not committing adultery is a good sign that you love your wife. But someone can neglect loving their wife and not be in adultery whatsoever.

This was not a "token nod" to the seventh Commandment.

Did you read the second part of this statement?

When you have invested your time and efforts blessing and helping another person--you generally keep yourself pure from offending them--Love works no ill towards his neighbor. Our Lord Jesus Said, "Where your treasure is, your heart is also." If you treasure your bride the Way Christ commands us to, then cheating on her is a hideously disgusting thing to even think about. I think you underestimate the Spirit of God working in this situation. Yes, we are still in fallen flesh, but We must Seek the Presence and power of God to live an Over coming Life.

Galatians 5
16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever[c] you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.


19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.


22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.


And i'll close with this...

Yes, i fully understand the implications of James 3, and i can assure you, we had many more words concerning this topic--none that i would like to post in a public forum.

I was not telling him to "Not obey commandments", I was telling him to actively love his wife and by default, he will be fulfilling the 7th command. Don't you get that? When you are actively loving someone you will not be destroying them! Yes, i understand it is a "both, and" not "either, or".

I hope this clears up some of my thoughts.

 

““The LORD our God made a covenant with us at Mount Sinai. The LORD did not make this covenant with our ancestors, but with all of us who are alive today.” (Deuteronomy 5:2–3)