is "losing one's faith" a myth?

[The Angel of the South]

I have never read Calvin's Institutes of the Christian Religion, but I thought I heard once that he doesn't even give that much discussion to questions of free will or predestination; and it's mostly others who made Calvinism what it is today.

 

[tyndale1946]

My church's Calvinist theology teaches that salvation cannot be lost. God will not withdraw it. I believe this, since--having been in a churchgoing Christian long enough to develop a theological position--my theology is also Calvinist (but not militantly Calvinist). What about losing one's faith?

At some point relatively recently, I thought about all these people who say they "lost their faith." They allegedly lost their faith a long time ago, after a crisis, etc. Is that just as impossible as losing one's salvation? I know faith is of course a different thing from salvation, but they are both a gift from God. As another gift from God, would faith also never be withdrawn?

I am also figuring out that "losing one's faith" may be a smokescreen for something the person does not want to admit: that they simply rebelled. They lost their obedience, not their faith. Am I right?

1 Timothy 1:18 This charge I commit unto thee, son Timothy, according to the prophecies which went before on thee, that thou by them mightest war a good warfare;

1:19 Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck:

1:20 Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme.

What was Hymenaeus and Alexander's rebellion?... The following says what Hymenaeus was and adds another but unless it is stated another place, Alexander's must have been under the same condemnation... Brother Glen

1 Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

2:16 But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.

2:17 And their word will eat as doth a canker: of whom is Hymenaeus and Philetus;

2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some.

 

[Yeshua1]

I have never read Calvin's Institutes of the Christian Religion, but I thought I heard once that he doesn't even give that much discussion to questions of free will or predestination; and it's mostly others who made Calvinism what it is today.

Augustine and other theologians had taught Calvinism before, and Calvin expounded further upon it in his books, especially His Institutes, as he gave the skeleton to the theology, while others after him fleshed it fully out!

 

[Salty]

(Former Rev) Bruce Gerencser, was an independent Bap pastor.
He is now an atheist.

Click here for a quick bio of Gerencser

 

[The Angel of the South]

(Former Rev) Bruce Gerencser, was an independent Bap pastor.
He is now an atheist.

Click here for a quick bio of Gerencser

Unless one is God, it's honestly impossible to be sure whether the man never actually believed in God in the first place or whether he has, as a saved person, rebelled and will repent in the future.

 

[Steven Yeadon]

Unless one is God, it's honestly impossible to be sure whether the man never actually believed in God in the first place or whether he has, as a saved person, rebelled and will repent in the future.

Well, what if he believed in God, but never had saving faith in Jesus Christ? Many people believe in some God. Even belief in the Living God can be useless, as James 2:19 shows the devil knows God exists and trembles. Mental assent means nothing, but as Romans 10:9 shows a heartfelt faith in Jesus Christ does save. I do agree though, that we will know when he dies what his final state was.

 

[The Angel of the South]

The point is that I'm reluctant to make too many assumptions about what's really going on between him and God.

 

[Yeshua1]

(Former Rev) Bruce Gerencser, was an independent Bap pastor.
He is now an atheist.

Click here for a quick bio of Gerencser

How about the former right hand man of Billy graham?
credohouse.org/.../billy-graham-and-charles-templeton-the-sad-tale-of-two-evangelists

 

[robycop3]

(Former Rev) Bruce Gerencser, was an independent Bap pastor.
He is now an atheist.

Click here for a quick bio of Gerencser

Having been a skeptic long as I can remember, I have never accepted anything by blind faith. However, I asked myself a question long ago: HOW DID EVERYTHING COME INTO BEING?

As science progressed, I learned that everything is made of atoms & all atoms are made from sub-atomic particles such as protons & electrons. then, I learned these particles are made of quarks, which come in six varieties known as "flavors". Far as I know, the quark is the most-basic physical object there is.

But my question remained unanswered? WHERE DID QUARKS COME FROM? How did each quark acquire its "flavor"? Where did the law come from that a certain combo of quarks of certain flavors makes an electron, etc. etc.

As I studied the Bible, the answer became obvious! ONLY GOD claimed to have created everything! And ONLY GOD claims to have established order in the universe, and made unbreakable laws of science and physics. For example, a group of eight protons is an atom of oxygen, and nothing else. same with other groups of protons. A single free proton is an atom of hydrogen & nothing else. On & on. Those laws of physics CANNOT be broken by anything mankind can do!

And what fuels gravity? Gravity is the commonest, most-pervasive physical force in the universe. Every last particle in the universe has gravity! If two sub-atomic particles were the only things in existence, and were placed at the opposite boundaries of the universe, they'd still be attracted toward one another! BUT WE DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT GRAVITY CONSISTS OF, OR WHAT POWERS IT, from a human point of view. But we know it's GOD who powers it, and who made the unbreakable law that a body of X mass exerts Y amount of gravity at Z distance from the center of that mass.

Those facts, plus all the fulfilled prophecies, and miracles such as the survival of the Jews til they once again have their own nation with Jerusalem as its capital have thoroughly convinced me of God's existence and omniscience, so it's easy to believe by faith that Jesus is His Son & is God Himself, and the ONLY One who makes me acceptable to His Father, even though I've never knowingly seen Him.

That's not BLIND faith, but BIBLICAL faith based upon SUBSTANCE & EVIDENCE, as stated in Hebrews 11:1

Now, if Mr. Gerencser fails to see those facts, I cannot help him. It'll take the HOLY SPIRIT to open his eyes. But his rejection seems so set-in that I doubt if he will repent, and besides, there's God's word in Hebrews 6:4-6.

 

[John D. Wright]

The Bible means just what it says.

But in light of what it says in the following two verses of the Bible, why do you suppose that the Devil would like for us to believe that it is impossible for us to fall away from our own stedfastness?

1 Timothy 4:4
4 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils

2 Peter 3:17
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

Is falling here losing your salvation or your witness? Paul himself talked of being put on the shelf but to me that would hardly indicate he lost his salvation.

There were those who departed in 1 John who he says were never of them. So there is that truth as well. I believe there are those who will believe false things but won't necessarily lose their salvation. They will believe things that are not true and depart from the true faith. For example, the believe you can lose your salvation once you have truly believed. After salvation, God makes it about Him. If we are lost once saved then God's power has been broken.

But then many Christians try to say it is because they were not real Christians to start with then.

There are several types of people who stop being faithful.
1. Yes those who were never saved. The parable of the sower is clear on this point.
2. Those who have become carnal who at the bema seat judgment will have works that are totally consumed (the straw, hay, stubble). These may never return.
3. Those who will for a short while lose fellowship with God. God will chastise them and they will return. I knew a man out of church for forty years. He said he felt God's call to return to church because he was a child of God.

This is referring to False Teachers who lure People away from the Truth that they once held to...

2 Peter 2:18-22
18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

What is the holy commandment given unto them? I do believe it will be worse for those who end up lost if they heard the gospel preached strongly and rejected it. Is faith knowledge? Mere belief is not saving? Not everyone who says Lord Lord is one of His.

Philippians 1:6 (ESV) 6 And I am sure of this, that he who began a good work in you will bring it to completion at the day of Jesus Christ.

John 10:27-28 (ESV) 27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. 28 I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.

Our salvation depends upon Christ and Christ alone.