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Ephesians 1 Clearly teaches Calvinism as to Salvation

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Yeshua1, Sep 27, 2018.

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  1. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    You may not realize that Abrahams faith was not automatic. He was a sinner just like the rest of us. His own faith was there before the righteousness was imputed to him. The scriptures you present prove what you claim to be in error.

    Noticed this verse clearly states that we must hear the gospel and believe first. It is not In Him. The correct terms is( In whom ) It is clearly stating that we must hear the gospel and believe first before we are sealed

    Not exactly. We hear the gospel we believe and we are saved. Then and only then are we adopted.
    MB
     
  2. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Not Judaism. We are adopted to be part of God's family
     
  3. loDebar

    loDebar Well-Known Member

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    Were all Jews in God's family?
     
  4. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    You are discounting this " Therefore if any man [be] in Christ"
    I believe most will go to hell.
    Mat 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:
    Mat 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

    Believers

    God loves the whole world. It isn't His will that men go to hell. They go there by there own choosing. Every man has enough light to point him in the right direction, yet some men are afraid of the light. They will not come to the light. Like I've said many times, men go to hell because of there lack of belief in Christ Jesus.
    The unforgivable sin is the rejection of Christ as Savior. This is why people can go to hell.
    I am a sinner yet I'm saved imagine that. All my sins have been forgiven because I have trusted in Christ as my Savior. When men reject Christ He lets them go there own way because of Love. It Hurts Christ because He loves us all so much. It is not His will that any perish. Still many head right in to the flame.
    All our sins have been forgiven the atonement has been made. Yet we still have to believe it.
    MB
     
  5. MB

    MB Well-Known Member

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    Just those who descended from Jacob. His sons are named for each tribe of Jews.
    MB\
    p.s. There are many who claim all who descend from Abraham. Though only those who are related to Jacob directly. You see Jews came to be through Jacob.
    MB
     
  6. loDebar

    loDebar Well-Known Member

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  7. Gup20

    Gup20 Active Member

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    Your response is so contentious, yet you and I agree. What is the point of your argument and how does it differ from what I said?

    Romans 9:4-8 (NASB) 4 who are Israelites, to whom belongs the adoption as sons, and the glory and the covenants and the giving of the Law and the temple service and the promises, 5 whose are the fathers, and from whom is the Christ according to the flesh, who is over all, God blessed forever. Amen. 6 But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel; 7 nor are they all children because they are Abraham's descendants, but: "THROUGH ISAAC YOUR DESCENDANTS WILL BE NAMED." 8 That is, it is not the children of the flesh who are children of God, but the children of the promise are regarded as descendants.

    My point is that we are not saved as a direct result of faith as both Calvin & Arminius presupposed. We are saved indirectly by our faith qualifying us for human adoption into the descendants of Abraham, and then inheriting Christ’s righteousness (as an INDIRECT result of our faith) through inheritance.

    Colossians 1:12 (NASB)
    giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified us to share in the inheritance of the saints in Light.

    Genesis 17:4-8 (NASB) 4 "As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, And you will be the father of a multitude of nations. 5 "No longer shall your name be called Abram, But your name shall be Abraham; For I have made you the father of a multitude of nations. 6 "I will make you exceedingly fruitful, and I will make nations of you, and kings will come forth from you. 7 "I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you.

    Note it speaks to Abraham being the father of many nations (not just Israel), and then immediately says the everlasting covenant will be inherited by those descendants (from many nations).

    Galatians 4:21-31 (NASB) 21 Tell me, you who want to be under law, do you not listen to the law? 22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by the bondwoman and one by the free woman. 23 But the son by the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and the son by the free woman through the promise. 24 This is allegorically speaking, for these women are two covenants: one proceeding from Mount Sinai bearing children who are to be slaves; she is Hagar. 25 Now this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26 But the Jerusalem above is free; she is our mother. 27 For it is written, "REJOICE, BARREN WOMAN WHO DOES NOT BEAR; BREAK FORTH AND SHOUT, YOU WHO ARE NOT IN LABOR; FOR MORE NUMEROUS ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE DESOLATE THAN OF THE ONE WHO HAS A HUSBAND." 28 And you brethren, like Isaac, are children of promise. 29 But as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so it is now also. 30 But what does the Scripture say? "CAST OUT THE BONDWOMAN AND HER SON, FOR THE SON OF THE BONDWOMAN SHALL NOT BE AN HEIR WITH THE SON OF THE FREE WOMAN." 31 So then, brethren, we are not children of a bondwoman, but of the free woman.
     
  8. Gup20

    Gup20 Active Member

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    The Jews were the original “replacement theologians.”

    Genesis 17:2-7 (NASB) 2 "I will establish My covenant between Me and you, And I will multiply you exceedingly." 3 Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying, 4 "As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, And you will be the father of a multitude of nations. 5 "No longer shall your name be called Abram, But your name shall be Abraham; For I have made you the father of a multitude of nations. 6 "I will make you exceedingly fruitful, and I will make nations of you, and kings will come forth from you. 7 "I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you throughout their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and to your descendants after you.

    God promises to multiply Abraham exceedingly and make him the father of many nations. Ask any Jew & most Christians & they will tell you this promise is to the Jews alone... yet from the very beginning it’s clear that God intended this covenant to be inherited by descendants from many nations.

    Isaiah 54:1 (NASB) "Shout for joy, O barren one, you who have borne no child; Break forth into joyful shouting and cry aloud, you who have not travailed; For the sons of the desolate one will be more numerous Than the sons of the married woman," says the LORD.

    In fact Isaiah prophesied those descendants from other nations (adopted descendants) would outnumber natural ones.
     
  9. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    Six Hour Warning
    This thread will be closed sometime after 7 AM Pacific.
     
  10. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    This thread is closed.
     
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