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Featured The myth of Israel being in Egypt 400 years.

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by 37818, Mar 25, 2019.

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  1. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Aside from Exodus 12:40 Hebrew text, a long time missing the words, "and of their fathers in the land of Canaan and." No where in the Bible does it teach that Israel was in Egypt 400 years. Now the prophecy of Genesis 15:13 is really three prophecies, the third being simply, "and they shall afflict them four hundred years;." That prophecy began in Genesis 21:9, ". . . (v.8) the child grew, and was weaned: and Abraham made a great feast the same day that Isaac was weaned. (v.9) And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born unto Abraham, mocking. . . ."

    Now understand the 430 years was from Abraham given the promise (Genesis 12:7) to the giving of the Law (Galatians 3:17).
     
    #1 37818, Mar 25, 2019
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  2. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    I understood that Israel was in Egypt 230 years.
     
    #2 David Kent, Mar 25, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2019
  3. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    From what I understand about 215 years. I have not resolved that understanding in my study. My Oxford Cyclpedic Corcordance that I have had since early 1960's gives that as the time span. I have been a Christian since 1962. I may have bought it some time between 1963-1964. I only read that part as a young adult in around some time since 1968.
     
    #3 37818, Mar 25, 2019
  4. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    The myth of Israel being in Egypt 400 years.

    Acts 7:6 And God spake on this wise, That his seed should sojourn in a strange land; and that they should bring them into bondage, and entreat them evil four hundred years.

    Is this inspired scripture a myth?

    How long were the Children of Israel enslaved in Egypt, according to the Bible?
     
    #4 HankD, Mar 25, 2019
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  5. David Kent

    David Kent Well-Known Member
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    I have edited my post to say 230 years. My number lock must have been off..
     
    #5 David Kent, Mar 25, 2019
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  6. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    That prophecy has 3 parts:

    1)And God spake on this wise, That his seed should sojourn in a strange land;
    2)and that they should bring them into bondage,
    And
    3)and entreat them evil four hundred years.
    That 3rd part began as recorded in Genesis 21:9.
    From the time that God gave the promise to Abraham (Genesis 12:7) to the giving of the Law (Exodus 12:40) according to the Holy Spirit through the Apostle Paul was 430 years (Galatians 3:17).
    In the Genesis account Abraham was 75 when God gave him the promise. And when Isaac was born 100 (Genesis 21:7). We can deduce Isaac was 5 years old when he was weaned (Genesis 21:7-9). Giving us 30 of the 400 years.
     
    #6 37818, Mar 25, 2019
  7. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    ???
     
    #7 HankD, Mar 25, 2019
  8. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Acts 7:6 is not merey one prophacy but actually 3. Separated by "and's." Galatians 3:17 teaches between Abraham and the Law is the 430 years. ". . . the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, . . ."
     
    #8 37818, Mar 25, 2019
  9. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Baloney.

    And you didn't answer the question.

    Is this inspired scripture a myth?

    Acts 7:6 And God spake on this wise, That his seed should sojourn in a strange land; and that they should bring them into bondage, and entreat them evil four hundred years.
     
    #9 HankD, Mar 25, 2019
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  10. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    First, my argument never ever said holy scripture is a myth. So your question really amounted to a false accusation by implication.
    Acts 7:6 does not say Israel was in Egypt 400 years. It just does not. What it says regarding the 400 years is "and entreat them evil four hundred years." And the "them" is explicitly the "seed" of Abraham in that prophecy. And the historical fact is Isaac is part of that seed and is the beginning of that 400 year period, Genesis 21:9.

    Galatians 3:17 explicitly gives the 430 years from the promise given to Abraham (Genesis 12:7) to the giving of the Law. It so happens the Hebrew text of Exodus 12:40 omits "and of their fathers in the land of Canaan." As found in the Samaritan and Alexandrine copy of the LXX.
     
    #10 37818, Mar 26, 2019
  11. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    No it is NOT a false accusation seeing that its a logical implication not a false implication.

    You still haven't given a direct answer to my question.

    Go back and read the site I pointed to

    How long were the Children of Israel enslaved in Egypt, according to the Bible?
     
    #11 HankD, Mar 26, 2019
  12. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    That interpetation is not in my understanding correct.

    Please qualify for me your question. Please simply restate it.

    It is my understanding the 430 years begins in Genesis 12, per Galatians 3:17. 30 years later by Genesis 21:9. Why explicitly is that not correct?
     
    #12 37818, Mar 26, 2019
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  13. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    My question has to do with your use of the word "myth" applied to the scripture.
    I don't now you 37818 - whether you believe that there are myths in the bible or not.

    Personally I reject your assertion that the 400 years of Acts 7:6 is a myth

    Acts 7:6 And God spake on this wise, That his seed should sojourn in a strange land; and that they should bring them into bondage, and entreat them evil four hundred years.

    Are the words "four hundred years - ἔτη τετρακόσια" of Acts 7:6 inspired?
     
    #13 HankD, Mar 26, 2019
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  14. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    OK - No, I do not believe it is correct.
    In post #3 you indicate this "From what I understand about 215 years".
     
    #14 HankD, Mar 26, 2019
  15. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    That 215 years was what a book of mine said Israel was in Egypt.

    Now you did not explain why you think that Genesis 21:9 when Isaac was weaned and the Son of the Egyptian mock Isaac, was not the begining of the 400 years in Acts 7:6 c, ". . . and entreat them evil four hundred years." Genesis 15:13 c, ". . . and they shall afflict them four hundred years; . . ." That was 30 years from the promise God gave Abraham, which Galatians 3:17 said was 430 years to the giving of the Law.

    The written word of God is not myth, but men believe myths about what it teaches.
     
    #15 37818, Mar 26, 2019
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  16. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Not the scripture.

    The sons of Israel were in Egypt for 430 years, which means they were in Egypt 30 years before they were enslaved.

    OK. Understood and I agree brother - But then I would say that Israel being in the land of Egypt for ONLY 215 years according to the scripture is a myth that men believe.
     
    #16 HankD, Mar 26, 2019
  17. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Here is what you seem to not be understanding. The Apostle Paul wrote, "Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect."

    Abraham was 75 (Genesis 12:4) when the covenant was first given to him, Genesis 12:7, and 100 when Isaac was born Genesis 21:5. That alone is 25 years. Paul by the Holy Spirit seemed to have written 430 years from then to the giving of the Law. How do you reconile this with the Hebrew reading for Exodus 12:40? (Which omits reference to the fathers and being in the land Canaan in part of that time).
     
    #17 37818, Mar 27, 2019
  18. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Kudos to you for meditating on the Word in this manner and for articulating your thoughts on this obvious conundrum in the scriptures, but Hank is right, you should have left off any connection of "myth" with scripture, but I'll forgive you for it. :)

    My thoughts on the conundrum:

    The "giving of the law":
    5 Thou shalt not bow down thyself unto them, nor serve them, for I Jehovah thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children, upon the third and upon the fourth generation of them that hate me, Ex 20​

    'Visiting the father's sin unto the fourth generation' seems to be an explanation to the Exodus generation concerning their bondage BECAUSE of what their fathers did to Joseph in betraying him and selling him into bondage. AND it was precisely the fourth generation that came out of Egypt:

    16 And these are the names of the sons of Levi according to their generations: Gershon, and Kohath, and Merari; and the years of the life of Levi were a hundred thirty and seven years.
    17 The sons of Gershon: Libni and Shimei, according to their families.
    18 And the sons of Kohath: Amram, and Izhar, and Hebron, and Uzziel; and the years of the life of Kohath were a hundred thirty and three years.
    19 And the sons of Merari: Mahli and Mushi. These are the families of the Levites according to their generations.
    20 And Amram took him Jochebed his father`s sister to wife; and she bare him Aaron and Moses: and the years of the life of Amram were a hundred and thirty and seven years. Ex 6

    The fourth generation came out of Egypt just as it was precisely predicted three verses down from your OP passage:

    13 And he said unto Abram, Know of a surety that thy seed shall be a stranger in a land that is not theirs, and shall serve them; and they shall afflict them four hundred years;
    16 And in the fourth generation they shall come hither again..... Gen 15

    IMO, you're probably on the right track with your explanation of the 400 year time element of the prophecy.
     
    #18 kyredneck, Mar 27, 2019
  19. HankD

    HankD Well-Known Member
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    Well I think you have shown a bit of wonderment yourself - you said "Paul by the Holy Spirit seemed to have written 430 years from then to the giving of the Law". Personally I don't see the problem. I categorize this with issues like the 12 tribes (depending on who and how you count them) and the 12 apostles (depending on who and how you count them).

    So for me its 430 years minus the 30 they were not in bondage.

    The word "myth" in your O/P Title was a flashing red light for me.
     
    #19 HankD, Mar 27, 2019
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  20. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    Where did I say or call scripture "myth?" The myth is in the interpretation or at worst jn a textual variant.
     
    #20 37818, Mar 27, 2019
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