Featured Reformers' interpretations of the AntiChrist

Hobie · Feb 21, 2020

The Protestant churches today and even some brethren are backing away from identifying the AntiChrist power, and yet the Reformers and even those before them saw clearly who the AntiChrist was. What is happening to the churches today, are they becoming blind and forgetful of the truth they once saw clearly. Here is a list I came across of Pre-Reformation and Reformers Interpretations:

Date Name Reference Interpretation

c. 1310 Dante Alighieri
Rev. 17 Harlot=Roman Church

c. 1331 Michael of Cesena
Rev. 17 Harlot/Antichrist=Roman Church, Pope

c. 1345 Johannes de Rupescissa
Antichrist, Rev. 17 Babylon, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Roman church

c. 1350 Francesco Petrarch
Rev. 17 Harlot=Papal Court

c. 1367 John Milicz
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin=Papacy

c. 1379 John Wycliffe
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn. Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Papacy

c. 1388 Matthias of Janow
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Hierarchy/Papacy

c. 1390 John Purvey
Antichrist, Rev. 13 666, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

c. 1393 Walter Brute
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin=Papacy/Bishop of Rome/Papacy

c. 1412 John Huss
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

c. 1497 Girolamo Savonarola
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

Reformation Era Interpretations:

1522 Martin Luther
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1543 Philipp Melanchthon
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 Andreas Osiander
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1554 Nicolaus von Amsdorf
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1558 Johann Funck
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1560 Virgil Solis
Antichrist, Little Horn, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1570 Georg Nigrinus
Antichrist= Pope

1572 David Chytraeus
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin= Papacy

1530 Johann Oecolampadius
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1557 Heinrich Bullinger
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 William Tyndale
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 George Joys
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1554 Nicholas Ridley
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1553 Hugh Latimer
Antichrist=Papacy

1582 Thomas Cranmer
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 John Bale
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1562 John Jewel
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1587 John Foxe
Antichrist, Man of Sin=Bishop of Rome

1563 Anglican Formulas
Antichrist=Papacy

1547 John Knox
Antichrist, Little Horn=Church of Rome/Papacy

1593 John Napier
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 13 1st Beast, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast =Pope/Papacy/Latin Empire

1614 Thomas Brightman
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

1618 David Pareus
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Beast=Pope/Papacy

Sir Isaac Newton
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

John Wesley
Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy also Antichrist

And they ask the question, "In view of the foregoing Reformation interpretations identifying Papacy as the Antichrist and Man of Sin, why do so many Evangelical Protestants today believe the Man of Sin and Antichrist are future individuals?"

How can the churches of the Reformation forget what they once held firm?

Particular · Feb 21, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

The Protestant churches today and even some brethren are backing away from identifying the AntiChrist power, and yet the Reformers and even those before them saw clearly who the AntiChrist was. What is happening to the churches today, are they becoming blind and forgetful of the truth they once saw clearly. Here is a list I came across of Pre-Reformation and Reformers Interpretations:

Date Name Reference Interpretation

c. 1310 Dante Alighieri
Rev. 17 Harlot=Roman Church

c. 1331 Michael of Cesena
Rev. 17 Harlot/Antichrist=Roman Church, Pope

c. 1345 Johannes de Rupescissa
Antichrist, Rev. 17 Babylon, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Roman church

c. 1350 Francesco Petrarch
Rev. 17 Harlot=Papal Court

c. 1367 John Milicz
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin=Papacy

c. 1379 John Wycliffe
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn. Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Papacy

c. 1388 Matthias of Janow
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Hierarchy/Papacy

c. 1390 John Purvey
Antichrist, Rev. 13 666, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

c. 1393 Walter Brute
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin=Papacy/Bishop of Rome/Papacy

c. 1412 John Huss
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

c. 1497 Girolamo Savonarola
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

Reformation Era Interpretations:

1522 Martin Luther
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1543 Philipp Melanchthon
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 Andreas Osiander
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1554 Nicolaus von Amsdorf
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1558 Johann Funck
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1560 Virgil Solis
Antichrist, Little Horn, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1570 Georg Nigrinus
Antichrist= Pope

1572 David Chytraeus
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin= Papacy

1530 Johann Oecolampadius
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1557 Heinrich Bullinger
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 William Tyndale
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 George Joys
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1554 Nicholas Ridley
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1553 Hugh Latimer
Antichrist=Papacy

1582 Thomas Cranmer
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 John Bale
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1562 John Jewel
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1587 John Foxe
Antichrist, Man of Sin=Bishop of Rome

1563 Anglican Formulas
Antichrist=Papacy

1547 John Knox
Antichrist, Little Horn=Church of Rome/Papacy

1593 John Napier
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 13 1st Beast, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast =Pope/Papacy/Latin Empire

1614 Thomas Brightman
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

1618 David Pareus
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Beast=Pope/Papacy

Sir Isaac Newton
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

John Wesley
Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy also Antichrist

And they ask the question, "In view of the foregoing Reformation interpretations identifying Papacy as the Antichrist and Man of Sin, why do so many Evangelical Protestants today believe the Man of Sin and Antichrist are future individuals?"

How can the churches of the Reformation forget what they once held firm?
Click to expand...

Not everything that era of saints believed in is accurate.
In study of scripture it seems that the world will ultimately be ruled by agnostic/atheist socialists. Rome may, eventually, move that direction since the pope has decried any evangelism to humanity.
To imagine the Reformers were correct about everything is to put them on a higher pedestal than they deserve.

Yeshua1 · Feb 21, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

The Protestant churches today and even some brethren are backing away from identifying the AntiChrist power, and yet the Reformers and even those before them saw clearly who the AntiChrist was. What is happening to the churches today, are they becoming blind and forgetful of the truth they once saw clearly. Here is a list I came across of Pre-Reformation and Reformers Interpretations:

Date Name Reference Interpretation

c. 1310 Dante Alighieri
Rev. 17 Harlot=Roman Church

c. 1331 Michael of Cesena
Rev. 17 Harlot/Antichrist=Roman Church, Pope

c. 1345 Johannes de Rupescissa
Antichrist, Rev. 17 Babylon, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Roman church

c. 1350 Francesco Petrarch
Rev. 17 Harlot=Papal Court

c. 1367 John Milicz
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin=Papacy

c. 1379 John Wycliffe
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn. Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot=Pope/Papacy

c. 1388 Matthias of Janow
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Hierarchy/Papacy

c. 1390 John Purvey
Antichrist, Rev. 13 666, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

c. 1393 Walter Brute
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin=Papacy/Bishop of Rome/Papacy

c. 1412 John Huss
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

c. 1497 Girolamo Savonarola
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

Reformation Era Interpretations:

1522 Martin Luther
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1543 Philipp Melanchthon
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 Andreas Osiander
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1554 Nicolaus von Amsdorf
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1558 Johann Funck
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1560 Virgil Solis
Antichrist, Little Horn, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1570 Georg Nigrinus
Antichrist= Pope

1572 David Chytraeus
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin= Papacy

1530 Johann Oecolampadius
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1557 Heinrich Bullinger
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 William Tyndale
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1545 George Joys
Antichrist, Little Horn=Papacy

1554 Nicholas Ridley
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1553 Hugh Latimer
Antichrist=Papacy

1582 Thomas Cranmer
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

1550 John Bale
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1562 John Jewel
Antichrist, Abomination of Desolation, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast=Papacy

1587 John Foxe
Antichrist, Man of Sin=Bishop of Rome

1563 Anglican Formulas
Antichrist=Papacy

1547 John Knox
Antichrist, Little Horn=Church of Rome/Papacy

1593 John Napier
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 13 1st Beast, Rev. 17 Harlot, Rev. 17 Babylon
Rev. 17 Beast =Pope/Papacy/Latin Empire

1614 Thomas Brightman
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Pope/Papacy

1618 David Pareus
Antichrist, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Beast=Pope/Papacy

Sir Isaac Newton
Antichrist, Little Horn, Man of Sin, Rev. 17 Harlot
Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy

John Wesley
Man of Sin. Rev. 17 Harlot. Rev. 17 Babylon=Papacy also Antichrist

And they ask the question, "In view of the foregoing Reformation interpretations identifying Papacy as the Antichrist and Man of Sin, why do so many Evangelical Protestants today believe the Man of Sin and Antichrist are future individuals?"

How can the churches of the Reformation forget what they once held firm?
Click to expand...

Based upon false teachings and doctrines, the Church of rome, JW, Mormons, Sda would all qualify, but I do not see the Pope as Antichrist, but could well be the future False prophet!

Hobie · Feb 21, 2020

Particular said: ↑

Not everything that era of saints believed in is accurate.
In study of scripture it seems that the world will ultimately be ruled by agnostic/atheist socialists. Rome may, eventually, move that direction since the pope has decried any evangelism to humanity.
To imagine the Reformers were correct about everything is to put them on a higher pedestal than they deserve.
Click to expand...

So how are Christians of this 'era' any more correct, as they are still rejecting the truth in the scripture, putting aside the Commandments of God and clearly picking up traditions of man.

Particular · Feb 21, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

So how are Christians of this 'era' any more correct, as they are still rejecting the truth in the scripture, putting aside the Commandments of God and clearly picking up traditions of man.
Click to expand...

Which Christians of this 'era'? Are you referring to pre-trib dispensationalists?

The truth is that the spirit of antichrist has been present since the early church.

1 John 2:18-25 Children, it is the last hour, and as you have heard that antichrist is coming, so now many antichrists have come. Therefore we know that it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us. But you have been anointed by the Holy One, and you all have knowledge. I write to you, not because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and because no lie is of the truth. Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father. Whoever confesses the Son has the Father also. Let what you heard from the beginning abide in you. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, then you too will abide in the Son and in the Father. And this is the promise that he made to us—eternal life.

Yeshua1 · Feb 21, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

So how are Christians of this 'era' any more correct, as they are still rejecting the truth in the scripture, putting aside the Commandments of God and clearly picking up traditions of man.
Click to expand...

Big example of that would be the SDA Church!

Yeshua1 · Feb 21, 2020

Particular said: ↑

Which Christians of this 'era'? Are you referring to pre-trib dispensationalists?

The truth is that the spirit of antichrist has been present since the early church.

1 John 2:18-25 Children, it is the last hour, and as you have heard that antichrist is coming, so now many antichrists have come. Therefore we know that it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us. But you have been anointed by the Holy One, and you all have knowledge. I write to you, not because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and because no lie is of the truth. Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father. Whoever confesses the Son has the Father also. Let what you heard from the beginning abide in you. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, then you too will abide in the Son and in the Father. And this is the promise that he made to us—eternal life.
Click to expand...

isn't he a Sda? if yes, then he would be like the very ones that he rails against here!

Hobie · Feb 21, 2020

Particular said: ↑

Which Christians of this 'era'? Are you referring to pre-trib dispensationalists?

The truth is that the spirit of antichrist has been present since the early church.

1 John 2:18-25 Children, it is the last hour, and as you have heard that antichrist is coming, so now many antichrists have come. Therefore we know that it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us. But they went out, that it might become plain that they all are not of us. But you have been anointed by the Holy One, and you all have knowledge. I write to you, not because you do not know the truth, but because you know it, and because no lie is of the truth. Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son. No one who denies the Son has the Father. Whoever confesses the Son has the Father also. Let what you heard from the beginning abide in you. If what you heard from the beginning abides in you, then you too will abide in the Son and in the Father. And this is the promise that he made to us—eternal life.
Click to expand...

Correct, the antichrist power was coming into the church, but Paul now begins to point it out and tells others.

2 Thessalonians 2:3
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"

So the man of sin, the son of perdition is being held back, but what is this exactly. In John 17:12 we see the same name:

John 17:12
"While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled."

Some say he was referring to Judas, but Paul is not talking about Judas as he is already gone from the scene, so it must be the evil which comes into men. That which seeks to be like God and fights against Christ, a antichrist power. The word Antichrist occurs only five times and only in the books of 1st and 2nd John.

1 John 2:18-22
"18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.21 I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son."

In John's time there were many antichrists and he says they went out from them (the Church) but were not of them or they would have continued with them. This tells us the Antichrist came from God's true Church but they went out on their own.

So lets take a look at what shows us the antichrist power with its mystery of iniquity:

2 Thessalonians 2:7 King James Version (KJV)
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New International Version)
7For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New Living Translation)
7 For this lawlessness is already at work secretly, and it will remain secret until the one who is holding it back steps out of the way

So what is this mystery of iniquity, this lawlessness already at work secretly, and what is holding it back. Well lets start with the power holding it back:

For more than 500 years, half a millennium, Rome was invincible. Its laws and legions stretched out from Rome and crushed those who would challenge it, but it too finally faded and it stopped holding back what prophecy had foretold.

Geneva Study Bible

(7) He foretells that when the empire of Rome is taken away, the seat that falls away from God will succeed and hold its place, as the old writers, Tertullian, Chrysostom, and Jerome explain and interpret it... He who is now in authority and rules all, that is, the Roman Empire

2:7He will surely be revealed; for the mystery - The deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, already worketh. It began with the love of honour, and the desire of power; and is completed in the entire subversion of the gospel of Christ. This mystery of iniquity is not wholly confined to the Romish church, but extends itself to others also. It seems to consist of,

Human inventions added to the written word.

Mere outside performances put in the room of faith and love.

Other mediators besides the man Christ Jesus.

The two last branches, together with idolatry and bloodshed, are the direct consequences of the former; namely, the adding to the word of God. Already worketh - In the church. Only he that restraineth - That is, the potentate who successively has Rome in his power. The emperors, heathen or Christian; the kings, Goths or Lombards; the Carolingian or German emperors.

And when the Roman Empire had faded, the antichrist power was recognized. Here is Jerome...

Jerome "Says the apostle [Paul in the second epistle to the Thessalonians], 'Unless the Roman Empire should first be desolated, and antichrist proceed, Christ will not come'

Paul shows what was to come from Pagan Rome, and we see Papal Rome emerge.

Yeshua1 · Feb 21, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

Correct, the antichrist power was coming into the church, but Paul now begins to point it out and tells others.

2 Thessalonians 2:3
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"

So the man of sin, the son of perdition is being held back, but what is this exactly. In John 17:12 we see the same name:

John 17:12
"While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled."

Some say he was referring to Judas, but Paul is not talking about Judas as he is already gone from the scene, so it must be the evil which comes into men. That which seeks to be like God and fights against Christ, a antichrist power. The word Antichrist occurs only five times and only in the books of 1st and 2nd John.

1 John 2:18-22
"18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.21 I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son."

In John's time there were many antichrists and he says they went out from them (the Church) but were not of them or they would have continued with them. This tells us the Antichrist came from God's true Church but they went out on their own.

So lets take a look at what shows us the antichrist power with its mystery of iniquity:

2 Thessalonians 2:7 King James Version (KJV)
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New International Version)
7For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New Living Translation)
7 For this lawlessness is already at work secretly, and it will remain secret until the one who is holding it back steps out of the way

So what is this mystery of iniquity, this lawlessness already at work secretly, and what is holding it back. Well lets start with the power holding it back:

For more than 500 years, half a millennium, Rome was invincible. Its laws and legions stretched out from Rome and crushed those who would challenge it, but it too finally faded and it stopped holding back what prophecy had foretold.

Geneva Study Bible

(7) He foretells that when the empire of Rome is taken away, the seat that falls away from God will succeed and hold its place, as the old writers, Tertullian, Chrysostom, and Jerome explain and interpret it... He who is now in authority and rules all, that is, the Roman Empire

2:7He will surely be revealed; for the mystery - The deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, already worketh. It began with the love of honour, and the desire of power; and is completed in the entire subversion of the gospel of Christ. This mystery of iniquity is not wholly confined to the Romish church, but extends itself to others also. It seems to consist of,

Human inventions added to the written word.

Mere outside performances put in the room of faith and love.

Other mediators besides the man Christ Jesus.

The two last branches, together with idolatry and bloodshed, are the direct consequences of the former; namely, the adding to the word of God. Already worketh - In the church. Only he that restraineth - That is, the potentate who successively has Rome in his power. The emperors, heathen or Christian; the kings, Goths or Lombards; the Carolingian or German emperors.

And when the Roman Empire had faded, the antichrist power was recognized. Here is Jerome...

Jerome "Says the apostle [Paul in the second epistle to the Thessalonians], 'Unless the Roman Empire should first be desolated, and antichrist proceed, Christ will not come'

Paul shows what was to come from Pagan Rome, and we see Papal Rome emerge.
Click to expand...

That which holds him back is the Holy Spirit Himself!

Particular · Feb 21, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

Correct, the antichrist power was coming into the church, but Paul now begins to point it out and tells others.

2 Thessalonians 2:3
"Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"

So the man of sin, the son of perdition is being held back, but what is this exactly. In John 17:12 we see the same name:

John 17:12
"While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled."

Some say he was referring to Judas, but Paul is not talking about Judas as he is already gone from the scene, so it must be the evil which comes into men. That which seeks to be like God and fights against Christ, a antichrist power. The word Antichrist occurs only five times and only in the books of 1st and 2nd John.

1 John 2:18-22
"18 Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.21 I have not written unto you because ye know not the truth, but because ye know it, and that no lie is of the truth.22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son."

In John's time there were many antichrists and he says they went out from them (the Church) but were not of them or they would have continued with them. This tells us the Antichrist came from God's true Church but they went out on their own.

So lets take a look at what shows us the antichrist power with its mystery of iniquity:

2 Thessalonians 2:7 King James Version (KJV)
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New International Version)
7For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New Living Translation)
7 For this lawlessness is already at work secretly, and it will remain secret until the one who is holding it back steps out of the way

So what is this mystery of iniquity, this lawlessness already at work secretly, and what is holding it back. Well lets start with the power holding it back:

For more than 500 years, half a millennium, Rome was invincible. Its laws and legions stretched out from Rome and crushed those who would challenge it, but it too finally faded and it stopped holding back what prophecy had foretold.

Geneva Study Bible

(7) He foretells that when the empire of Rome is taken away, the seat that falls away from God will succeed and hold its place, as the old writers, Tertullian, Chrysostom, and Jerome explain and interpret it... He who is now in authority and rules all, that is, the Roman Empire

2:7He will surely be revealed; for the mystery - The deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, already worketh. It began with the love of honour, and the desire of power; and is completed in the entire subversion of the gospel of Christ. This mystery of iniquity is not wholly confined to the Romish church, but extends itself to others also. It seems to consist of,

Human inventions added to the written word.

Mere outside performances put in the room of faith and love.

Other mediators besides the man Christ Jesus.

The two last branches, together with idolatry and bloodshed, are the direct consequences of the former; namely, the adding to the word of God. Already worketh - In the church. Only he that restraineth - That is, the potentate who successively has Rome in his power. The emperors, heathen or Christian; the kings, Goths or Lombards; the Carolingian or German emperors.

And when the Roman Empire had faded, the antichrist power was recognized. Here is Jerome...

Jerome "Says the apostle [Paul in the second epistle to the Thessalonians], 'Unless the Roman Empire should first be desolated, and antichrist proceed, Christ will not come'

Paul shows what was to come from Pagan Rome, and we see Papal Rome emerge.
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Peter lets us know that life goes on until the Day of the Lord...and then God's judgment of fire falls upon the earth. Antichrist is always with us. A world leader will emerge before then, but God will hold his vengeance until the last elect child of God comes to believe. Then...the hammer falls.

2 Peter 3:1-15 This is now the second letter that I am writing to you, beloved. In both of them I am stirring up your sincere mind by way of reminder, that you should remember the predictions of the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and Savior through your apostles, knowing this first of all, that scoffers will come in the last days with scoffing, following their own sinful desires. They will say, “Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the beginning of creation.” For they deliberately overlook this fact, that the heavens existed long ago, and the earth was formed out of water and through water by the word of God, and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished. But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly. But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you,not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.

But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed. Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of people ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set on fire and dissolved, and the heavenly bodies will melt as they burn!

But according to his promise we are waiting for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.

Therefore, beloved, since you are waiting for these, be diligent to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him.

Hobie · Feb 22, 2020

Yeshua1 said: ↑

That which holds him back is the Holy Spirit Himself!
Click to expand...

No, as Paul writes that there is this mystery of iniquity, this lawlessness already at work secretly, and then gives us the key to what is holding it back. Paul mentions this 'mystery of iniquity' right after talking about a man, and warning
of the falling away from the deception and within the church, "so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God."

2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 King James Version (KJV)
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Paul is talking about someone whose secret agenda is to overthrow God’s law and set himself on God’s throne. We find that this what also happened in heaven:

Isaiah 14:12-14 King James Version (KJV)
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

John shares more light on this mystery of iniquity when he says,

Revelation 12:7 King James Version (KJV)
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

Here we see an outright war as Lucifer is secretly trying to overthrow God’s law and authority in order to set up his own kingdom of lawlessness and be worshipped "like the most High". This is his purpose, to undermine God’s law and authority and turn that which belongs only to God, to himself, just as he does now. Ezekiel has another clue in this mystery.

Ezekiel 28:15 King James Version (KJV)
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

So this is now brought into play on earth, and Paul foretells that when the empire of Rome is taken away, this 'mystery of inquity' will now come to deceive and it will be within the church. We find even the old writers, Tertullian, Chrysostom, and Jerome explain and interpret that the "until he be taken out of the way" who is now in authority and rules all, that is, the Roman Empire.

At that time it seemed that Rome was invincible. Its laws and legions stretched out from Rome and crushed those who would challenge it, but it too finally faded and it stopped holding back what prophecy had foretold.

So we see the deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, coming after the Roman Empire. The Patriarch of Alexandria and Alexandria itself became powerful centers of Christian influence and schools much sooner than the Christian center in Rome. But as soon as it was allowed by the declining Roman Empire the Bishop of Rome became even more powerful than the Patriarch of Alexandria and competed and surpassed Alexandria and the other centers of Christian influence. By the time of Emperor Constantine, the Christian religion received imperial sanction and the bishop of Rome became more than just another bishop.

At the time of the Council of Nicea (325), Rome was still seen as the capital of the empire, although the emperor rarely lived there. With the establishment of a new fixed capital in Constantinople , there arose a new center, which quickly grew in prominence, rivaling those in Rome, Alexandria and Antioch, which previously had been the most important centers of Christianity. But with the capital shifted to Constantinople the bisho of Rome was given much more freedom and power to rule and intervene in the affairs of other church centers and was seen as much more influential as there were much more manifestations of authority over other churches.

After the fall of Rome, the Bishop of Rome served as a source of authority and continuity at that center, so how did it fall into apostasy. Well Rome had also been the center of the pagan priests and their temples during the Roman Empire, and they did not go away. The Bishop of Rome, to bring in more converts brought what they were familiar with and allowed the traditional Roman mysteries and deities of solar monism such as Mithras and Sol Invictus and idol worship back into the church, along with its Pagan doctrines, graven images and ceremonies. It renamed the mother godess and others that were worshiped and brought them into the church at Rome, then with its influence it spread into the other centers of Christianity.

Yeshua1 · Feb 22, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

No, as Paul writes that there is this mystery of iniquity, this lawlessness already at work secretly, and then gives us the key to what is holding it back. Paul mentions this 'mystery of iniquity' right after talking about a man, and warning
of the falling away from the deception and within the church, "so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God."

2 Thessalonians 2:3-4 King James Version (KJV)
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

Paul is talking about someone whose secret agenda is to overthrow God’s law and set himself on God’s throne. We find that this what also happened in heaven:

Isaiah 14:12-14 King James Version (KJV)
12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

John shares more light on this mystery of iniquity when he says,

Revelation 12:7 King James Version (KJV)
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

Here we see an outright war as Lucifer is secretly trying to overthrow God’s law and authority in order to set up his own kingdom of lawlessness and be worshipped "like the most High". This is his purpose, to undermine God’s law and authority and turn that which belongs only to God, to himself, just as he does now. Ezekiel has another clue in this mystery.

Ezekiel 28:15 King James Version (KJV)
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.

So this is now brought into play on earth, and Paul foretells that when the empire of Rome is taken away, this 'mystery of inquity' will now come to deceive and it will be within the church. We find even the old writers, Tertullian, Chrysostom, and Jerome explain and interpret that the "until he be taken out of the way" who is now in authority and rules all, that is, the Roman Empire.

At that time it seemed that Rome was invincible. Its laws and legions stretched out from Rome and crushed those who would challenge it, but it too finally faded and it stopped holding back what prophecy had foretold.

So we see the deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, coming after the Roman Empire. The Patriarch of Alexandria and Alexandria itself became powerful centers of Christian influence and schools much sooner than the Christian center in Rome. But as soon as it was allowed by the declining Roman Empire the Bishop of Rome became even more powerful than the Patriarch of Alexandria and competed and surpassed Alexandria and the other centers of Christian influence. By the time of Emperor Constantine, the Christian religion received imperial sanction and the bishop of Rome became more than just another bishop.

At the time of the Council of Nicea (325), Rome was still seen as the capital of the empire, although the emperor rarely lived there. With the establishment of a new fixed capital in Constantinople , there arose a new center, which quickly grew in prominence, rivaling those in Rome, Alexandria and Antioch, which previously had been the most important centers of Christianity. But with the capital shifted to Constantinople the bisho of Rome was given much more freedom and power to rule and intervene in the affairs of other church centers and was seen as much more influential as there were much more manifestations of authority over other churches.

After the fall of Rome, the Bishop of Rome served as a source of authority and continuity at that center, so how did it fall into apostasy. Well Rome had also been the center of the pagan priests and their temples during the Roman Empire, and they did not go away. The Bishop of Rome, to bring in more converts brought what they were familiar with and allowed the traditional Roman mysteries and deities of solar monism such as Mithras and Sol Invictus and idol worship back into the church, along with its Pagan doctrines, graven images and ceremonies. It renamed the mother godess and others that were worshiped and brought them into the church at Rome, then with its influence it spread into the other centers of Christianity.
Click to expand...

Paul is talking to Antichrist of the end days, who shall be restrained from appearing until the Holy spirit permits him to be, right before Second coming of Christ!

Particular · Feb 22, 2020

Every human is in rebellion against God, with the purpose of setting up their own throne above all others.

Antichrist has always been at work and is at work today.

Yeshua1 · Feb 22, 2020

Particular said: ↑

Every human is in rebellion against God, with the purpose of setting up their own throne above all others.

Antichrist has always been at work and is at work today.
Click to expand...

Yes, as the very spirit of antichrist been at work giving heresies within the Church since NT times!

Hobie · Feb 27, 2020

Particular said: ↑

Peter lets us know that life goes on until the Day of the Lord...and then God's judgment of fire falls upon the earth. Antichrist is always with us. A world leader will emerge before then, but God will hold his vengeance until the last elect child of God comes to believe. Then...the hammer falls.

2 Peter 3:1-15 This is now the second letter that I am writing to you, beloved. In both of them I am stirring up your sincere mind by way of reminder, that you should remember the predictions of the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and Savior through your apostles, knowing this first of all, that scoffers will come in the last days with scoffing, following their own sinful desires. They will say, “Where is the promise of his coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all things are continuing as they were from the beginning of creation.” For they deliberately overlook this fact, that the heavens existed long ago, and the earth was formed out of water and through water by the word of God, and that by means of these the world that then existed was deluged with water and perished. But by the same word the heavens and earth that now exist are stored up for fire, being kept until the day of judgment and destruction of the ungodly. But do not overlook this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you,not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.

But the day of the Lord will come like a thief, and then the heavens will pass away with a roar, and the heavenly bodies will be burned up and dissolved, and the earth and the works that are done on it will be exposed. Since all these things are thus to be dissolved, what sort of people ought you to be in lives of holiness and godliness, waiting for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which the heavens will be set on fire and dissolved, and the heavenly bodies will melt as they burn!

But according to his promise we are waiting for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.

Therefore, beloved, since you are waiting for these, be diligent to be found by him without spot or blemish, and at peace. And count the patience of our Lord as salvation, just as our beloved brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him.
Click to expand...

So is the Pope seen as a world leader telling everyone what the world needs to do in political (i.e. Climate change, Social inequity, etc...) as well as religious. I think we know the answer...

Particular · Feb 27, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

So is the Pope seen as a world leader telling everyone what the world needs to do in political (i.e. Climate change, Social inequity, etc...) as well as religious. I think we know the answer...
Click to expand...

Sure. So is the Ayatollah and the Dalai Lama as well as the President of the United States.
Islam believes a Messiah is coming to setup a worldwide caliphate.

There are many antichrist types in the world. It seems that many American Christians just want to avoid persecution so they pine for a pre-trib rapture that will spare them any suffering. If that happens, fine, but I am not counting on it. I expect to face persecution and suffering in a nation that is trending toward antichrist.

Hobie · Feb 27, 2020

Particular said: ↑

Sure. So is the Ayatollah and the Dalai Lama as well as the President of the United States.
Islam believes a Messiah is coming to setup a worldwide caliphate.

There are many antichrist types in the world. It seems that many American Christians just want to avoid persecution so they pine for a pre-trib rapture that will spare them any suffering. If that happens, fine, but I am not counting on it. I expect to face persecution and suffering in a nation that is trending toward antichrist.
Click to expand...

Yes, but can they trace their line all the way back to the time of the emergence from the Roman Empire, hmm...

Yeshua1 · Feb 27, 2020

Particular said: ↑

Not everything that era of saints believed in is accurate.
In study of scripture it seems that the world will ultimately be ruled by agnostic/atheist socialists. Rome may, eventually, move that direction since the pope has decried any evangelism to humanity.
To imagine the Reformers were correct about everything is to put them on a higher pedestal than they deserve.
Click to expand...

They were right on Sotierology proper, but eschatology, not so much!

Yeshua1 · Feb 27, 2020

Hobie said: ↑

So is the Pope seen as a world leader telling everyone what the world needs to do in political (i.e. Climate change, Social inequity, etc...) as well as religious. I think we know the answer...
Click to expand...

The papacy fits the false prophet much better, as Antichrist will be a military/political leader!

Yeshua1 · Feb 27, 2020

Particular said: ↑

Sure. So is the Ayatollah and the Dalai Lama as well as the President of the United States.
Islam believes a Messiah is coming to setup a worldwide caliphate.

There are many antichrist types in the world. It seems that many American Christians just want to avoid persecution so they pine for a pre-trib rapture that will spare them any suffering. If that happens, fine, but I am not counting on it. I expect to face persecution and suffering in a nation that is trending toward antichrist.
Click to expand...

we know that final Antichrist will come, but real Christ is coming also!

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