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Featured What is Christs true church from Gods Word

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Hobie, Apr 22, 2020.

  1. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Here is a article that really hit the nail on the head...Sometimes we can carry the name of Christ but not follow Him. That may be a sharp thing to read, but seriously, we should all check if we truly follow the Lord Jesus Christ. Why is that?

    It's because the Lord Jesus Christ Himself gave us a very stern warning in Matthew 7:21-23:

    "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'"

    Today a great many people identify as "Christian" without really knowing what it is to be a Christ-follower. Some think it's just about being loving, while some think it's just about the anointing. Well, all Christ-followers are given the same anointing in the Holy Spirit and are expected to love others, meaning we all need to have both.

    The one thing that distinguishes true followers from those who just carry the name, however, is the lifestyle - a lifestyle of obedience to Christ. Here are some ways we show that we are true followers of Christ. These all go together.

    1) Obedience to the Father's will

    Christ Jesus mentioned in Matthew 7:21 that only those who do the will of His Father in heaven can enter the Kingdom of Heaven. What's that will?

    "...that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life..." (see John 6:40)

    2) A love for fellow believers

    The Lord Jesus also said that one distinguishing mark is the love that Christians have for one another. We read Him saying in John 13:35,

    "By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.""

    3) A love that seeks the lost sheep

    Jesus said a shepherd will leave the ninety-nine sheep to look for that one lost sheep, and when he finds it his rejoicing will be so great that he'll call his friends and neighbors to rejoice with him...https://www.christiantoday.com/arti...stinguish-true-followers-of-christ/122092.htm

    Luke 15:1-7 King James Version (KJV)
    1 Then drew near unto him all the publicans and sinners for to hear him.
    2 And the Pharisees and scribes murmured, saying, This man receiveth sinners, and eateth with them.
    3 And he spake this parable unto them, saying,
    4 What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it?
    5 And when he hath found it, he layeth it on his shoulders, rejoicing.
    6 And when he cometh home, he calleth together his friends and neighbours, saying unto them, Rejoice with me; for I have found my sheep which was lost.
    7 I say unto you, that likewise joy shall be in heaven over one sinner that repenteth, more than over ninety and nine just persons, which need no repentance.
     
  2. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    It was never about persecuting the faithful, or torturing them to accept a certain view of God, or taking away His Word from His saints. And yet we clearly see that is what some consider the path to 'convert' Christians as we see in history.

    "The Inquisition, in historical ecclesiastical parlance also referred to as the "Holy Inquisition", was a group of institutions within the Catholic Church whose aim was to combat heresy. The Inquisition started in 12th-century France to combat religious dissent, in particular the Cathars and the Waldensians. Other groups investigated later included the Spiritual Franciscans, the Hussites and the Beguines....

    During the Late Middle Ages and the early Renaissance, the concept and scope of the Inquisition significantly expanded in response to the Protestant Reformation and the Catholic Counter-Reformation. It expanded to other European countries,[2] resulting in the Spanish Inquisition and Portuguese Inquisition.

    The Spanish and Portuguese operated inquisitorial courts throughout their empires in Africa, Asia, and the Americas (resulting in the Peruvian Inquisition and Mexican Inquisition)". ...Inquisition - Wikipedia

    Christianity, has never been a belief spread by coercion or force. Rather, it has been spread by the truth, which is in Gods Word. The whole point of spreading the gospel is for people to freely accept Christ. A forced conversion is no conversion at all.

    The phrase "A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still", comes to mind.
     
  3. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Now Jesus Christ is “Lord even of the Sabbath day” as the Creator. Jesus said,“For the Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath day.” Matthew 12:8. By identifying Himself as “Lord even of the Sabbath day,” Jesus of was showing that He was the One who originally created Earth in six days, and rested on the seventh day. And the New Testament makes clear that Jesus is the Creator...

    "All things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that has been made." John 1:3

    "He [Jesus] was in the world, and the world was made by Him, and the world knew Him not". John 1:10

    "God, who created all things by Jesus Christ." Eph. 3:9

    "For by Him [Jesus] all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him." Col. 1:16

    So scripture makes clear Jesus Christ is our Creator and also gave us the Sabbath for man not just the Jews.

    "And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:"Mark 2:27

    Not only did Jesus create the Sabbath but He makes clear it was the seventh day and Holy...
    "For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it." Exodus 20:11

    "And he said unto them, This is that which the LORD hath said, To morrow is the rest of the holy sabbath unto the LORD: bake that which ye will bake to day, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning." Exodus 16:23

    Now you can check the scriptures and it will make clear the Sabbath is on Saturday, while Sunday is "the first day of the week". Jesus Christ regularly kept the Sabbath, taught much about the Sabbath, and clearly stated that He is "Lord even of the Sabbath day" (Mat. 12:8). Jesus Christ never mentioned "the first day of the week" even one time. He taught nothing about it. The Sabbath continues after the cross (Luke 23:54-56) and was kept in the book of Acts by both Jews and Gentiles (Acts 13:42-44). There is no biblical authorization for the change of the Bible Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday.

    God made the Sabbath at the beginning of the world (Gen. 2:1-3) before any Jews existed, to be a blessing to all people. Most importantly, it is a special sign that Jesus Christ is the true Creator of heaven and earth ( John 1:1-3, 10).

    So who is Christ's true church, Peter said it well...
    "Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men."
    Acts 5:29
     
  4. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    The Sda is not a real Church of Christ, as you hold to teachings of a false prophetess over inspired scriptures!
     
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    NONE of those in your passage were ever saved!
     
  6. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    So you claim, but scripture shows who are the saved.
    Revelation 22:14
    Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    After the apostate church twisted and changed the truth of the early church from Christ and the apostles you can see how many didnt know. I am sure we will see the Reformers in the saved , Martin Luther, John Calvin, Ulrich Zwingli, John Wycliffe, John Knox, William Tyndale, Phillip Melanchthon, Jan Huss, John Wesley, and other leaders of the Reformation churches. But as you saw even Luther couldnt let go of some of the 'tradtions' that had been brought in by this antichrist power, and God in His mercy can wink and allows for this.

    Acts 17:30
    And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

    Jude 1:21
    Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

    But now, is the time to continue the unveiling of the fullness of truth of Sola Scriptura they were following, and let Gods Word be the standard again.
     
    #6 Hobie, Apr 22, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 22, 2020
  7. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Look at what is the definition of 'Sola Scriptura': "Bible Only"
    Latin: "Sola" = Alone
    Latin: "Scriptura" = Scriptures
    Latin: "Sola Scriptura" = Bible Only
    Sola scriptura (Latin ablative, "by scripture alone") is the assertion that the Bible as God's written word is self-authenticating, clear (perspicuous) to the rational reader, its own interpreter ("Scripture interprets Scripture"), and sufficient of itself to be the only source of Christian doctrine.

    Sola scriptura may be contrasted with Roman Catholic in which the Bible must be interpreted by church teaching, by considering the bible in the context of 'Tradition'. We find the Roman Catholic Church officially regards tradition and scripture as equal, as interpreted by the Roman magisterium. This is seen as the the church's authority or office to give authentic interpretation of the Word of God, and basically that means the Pope.

    Sola scriptura was a foundational doctrinal principle of the Protestant Reformation and was clearly held by Martin Luther and is claimed to be a definitive principle of Protestants today. But is you have to ask yourself, are they doing it, are Protestant following what scripture says, or do they follow many of the same traditions that Roman Catholic brought in which are contrary to the Bible.

    I came across the following which gives a example of how the Protestants fail follow the Bible.

    "“* That Protestants, who accept the Bible as the only rule of faith and religion, should by all means go back to the observance of the Sabbath. The fact that they do not, but on the contrary observe the Sunday, stultifies them in the eyes of every thinking man.

    “* We Catholics do not accept the Bible as the only rule of faith. Besides the Bible we have the living Church, the authority of the Church, as a rule to guide us. We say, this Church, instituted by Christ to teach and guide man through life, has the right to change the ceremonial laws of the Old Testament and hence, we accept her change of the Sabbath to Sunday. We frankly say, yes, the Church made this change, made this law, as she made many other laws, for instance, the Friday abstinence, the unmarried priesthood, the laws concerning mixed marriages, the regulation of Catholic marriages and a thousand other laws...

    “It is always somewhat laughable, to see the Protestant churches, in pulpit and legislation, demand the observance of Sunday, of which there is nothing in their Bible.” Peter R. Kraemer, Catholic Church Extension Magazine, USA (1975), Chicago, Illinois,“Under the blessing of the Pope Pius XI”...

    So nothing can be more plain and easy to understand what the Bible says on this, and no one can deny that it is in there. It is acknowledged by everybody that the day which God appointed to be kept holy was Saturday, not Sunday. And yet Protestant, who profess to go by the Bible and the Bible only in the most plain truth and important a manner as the observance of one day in seven as the holy day, Protestants go against the plain letter of the Bible, and put another day in the place of that day which the Bible has commanded. There is no denying that the command to keep holy the seventh day is one of the Ten Commandments, and Protestants still believe that the other nine are still binding. Who gave Protestants the authority to tamper with the fourth. If Protestants are consistent with their own principles, if they really follow the Bible, and the Bible only Protestants ought to be able to produce some portion of the New Testament in which this fourth commandment is expressly altered, otherwise they are not following the Bible....https://rcg.org/realtruth/articles/070831-005-wasw.html
     
  8. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Its time to leave the "traditions" of the Roman Catholic Church which clearly is 'Babylon' of scripture, and we see the warning of its end given in scripture.....

    Revelation 18 King James Version (KJV)
    1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.
    2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
    3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
    4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
    5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities.
    6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double.
    7 How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow.
    8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.
    9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,
    10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.
    11 And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more:
    12 The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble,
    13 And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men.
    14 And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all.
    15 The merchants of these things, which were made rich by her, shall stand afar off for the fear of her torment, weeping and wailing,
    16 And saying, Alas, alas that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls!
    17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,
    18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What city is like unto this great city!
    19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate.
    20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her.
    21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all.
    22 And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee;
    23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.
    24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.
     
  9. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Its time to come out of 'Babylon' and its 'traditions' and follow what God has in His Word, the original path of the Reformation and the Reformers, Sola Scriptura.
     
  10. Adonia

    Adonia Well-Known Member
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    All hail the prophetess Ellen White!
     
  11. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Deflection does not negate the truth on the matter, and history and Gods Word shows it.
     
  12. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    The Protestant Reformation was the beginning of the movement to come out of Babylon which we clearly see is the apostate church. It will continue until the end as more and more see the true origin of her false doctrines and 'traditions'...

    Rev 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,
    7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.
    8 And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.
    9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
    10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
    11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
    12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
    13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.
    14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.
    15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.
    16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.
    17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.
    18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.
    19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.
    20 And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.
     
  13. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    Sda is a cult, same as Mormons and JW!
     
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  14. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    Hobie, where in the Bible does the word “Saturday” appear?

    peace to you
     
  15. Walpole

    Walpole Well-Known Member

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    I've asked this before and you never answered...

    In light of Protestant soteriology, if you believe you are saved simply by faith alone, what difference does it make if you go to church on Saturday or Sunday?

    If you have already judged yourself to be saved and nothing can change that, how would going to your service on Sunday, Wednesday, Thursday or Saturday jeopardize that?

    Seems like much ado about nothing...
     
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  16. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1 Well-Known Member
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    They say saved by grace alone, but then add must keep Sabbath!
     
  17. Walpole

    Walpole Well-Known Member

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    Is that what he actually believes or are you just presuming?


    And what is it with you guys and the word alone? Do you folks even know what the word alone means?

    Alone = To the exclusion of all others; only ---> Definition of alone | Dictionary.com

    Only = without others or anything further; alone; solely; exclusively ---> Definition of only | Dictionary.com


    Thus, if it's grace ALONE, by definition that precludes any other conditions.


    (And I trust that name(s) of a bishop / elder / pastor from your sect in the 5th century and his or her writings opposing the Catholic bishops at Ephesus and Chalcedon is forthcoming in the other thread?)
     
    #17 Walpole, Apr 24, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 24, 2020
  18. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    What day of the week is it, then check the Ten Commandments.
     
  19. Hobie

    Hobie Well-Known Member

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    Look at history and clealy we see how the early church let pagan rites and rituals and even Gnostic doctrine into its text and manuscripts, and wholesale apostasy as the church in Rome let the leaders bring in the whole system of pagan worship take over the church. They banned the reading or possession of the Bible by the people and this went on during the Dark Ages until finally the Protestant Reformers brought back Gods Word and its truth to the people and the light was allowed to shine, and faith rebounded and understanding of Gods Word spread among the people. But then the Reformers passed on and the people chose to lock on to the men themselves instead of continue unveiling the truths contained in Gods Word and solidified their understanding into creeds. So it was until the Bible Society's again spread Gods Word in their mass printing of the Bible, and the Great Awakening stirred them to look deeper into Gods Word and see what further truths and prophecy would be unveiled. But even that evil tried to corrupt with Holt and Westcott text from the corrupted Minority Text of the Alexandrian manuscripts.

    So here we are....
     
  20. canadyjd

    canadyjd Well-Known Member

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    Historically, nations calculated time in different ways. Usually it dealt with when kings took the throne as a starting point, and measured movement of sun and moon as reference for days, weeks, years.

    Days of the week, months and years differed between nations. Even today, calendars are different in other countries.

    The calendar that we use today was developed about 1000 AD, or so (Gregorian Calendar) if I’m remember correctly.

    When God gave Moses the 10 Commandments, we can be certain He gave instructions on measuring the days, weeks, years so the many celebrations would be accurate.

    However, the Jewish people have been conquered many times and different ways of measuring time have been introduced.

    Even today, the Eastern Orthodox Church celebrates Easter on a different day than we do. They are using a different calendar.

    How can you be certain that the way you recognize the days of the week are the same Moses used three thousand years ago?

    peace to you
     
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