Question for Calvinists

[MB]

Please show us this verse that says "no one was individually chosen before creation because once we were not a people of God."

There is a reason why you have to make this corporate. What is it that scares you about individual election?

There is not one verse in the Bible that names Gentiles as Elect. Gentiles can never be Jews
What makes you think Van is scared? Certainly he isn't scared of you nor am I.
The Jews were elected corporately. This makes me wonder how Calvinist think they can be elect individually. Doesn't it scare you that you cannot prove your elect,?
MB

 

[Van]

Once again you are close but need to tweak your answer to make it biblical. What you should have said was: "God chooses individuals TO bring Him glory."

Straight up denial of scripture.

 

[Van]

And how exactly does that one isolated cherry-picked scripture say that individuals were not chosen?

All Calvinists claim any verse that demonstrates their doctrine is false has been taken out of context, cherry picked, misinterpreted, and so forth. And then of course they use the fallacy of person incredulity. And so it goes.

 

[Van]

It is due to an errant view of Gods sovereignty.

Like a house of cards, Calvinism is built on one fallacy supporting another fallacy. Limited atonement requires John 3:16 not to say God loved all mankind. His lack of love arose, according perhaps to one Calvinist leaning poster, due to His racism. On and on folks, on and on.

 

[Van]

And I have gone over the entire context with you.
SNIP

Calvinism has once again been shown to be bogus, and then claimed to have been refuted in the past. Pathetic defense of the indefensible.

 

[Van]

Utter deflection, addressing me and not the topic. Christ died for all whom the Father has given him. Those from the past, the present and the future whom God has chosen.

By your assertion, every human is saved by Jesus shed blood atoning for their sins. Yet, you insert a legalism (not grace) when you insist that faith must be activated, by the individual, in order for the atonement to be effective. Thus you insert the law as your means of salvation.

On and on folks, the Calvinists make the absurd claim if Christ died for someone, they are saved. 2 Peter 2:1 is ignored as if the thread readers do not know Christ "bought" those heading to destruction.

 

[Van]

No, Calvinists believe that if Christ laid down His life for all in the way you try to redefine it by taking that verse out of context, it would have failed. That's a HUGE distinction that you leave out.

On and on folks, claim after claim scripture does not mean what it says. 2 Peter 2:1 does not say Christ bought those heading to destruction. One copy and paste denial after another, because Calvinist's TULI are bogus views, shown by verse after verse they are unbiblical.

 

[Van]

There is not one verse in the Bible that names Gentiles as Elect. Gentiles can never be Jews
What makes you think Van is scared? Certainly he isn't scared of you nor am I.
The Jews were elected corporately. This makes me wonder how Calvinist think they can be elect individually. Doesn't it scare you that you cannot prove your elect,?
MB

The fiction that Gentiles being chosen for salvation does does not mean they are elect. Utter nonsense.

Was Titus a Jew or Gentile? Gentile - a Greek
Was Titus called "elect?" Yes Titus 1:4 says Paul and Titus held faith in common with each other, and in Titus 1:1 Paul refers to that faith as the faith of God's elect.

 

[AustinC]

There is not one verse in the Bible that names Gentiles as Elect. Gentiles can never be Jews
What makes you think Van is scared? Certainly he isn't scared of you nor am I.
The Jews were elected corporately. This makes me wonder how Calvinist think they can be elect individually. Doesn't it scare you that you cannot prove your elect,?
MB

MB, you are sticking your head in the sand, creating arbitrary boundaries, and then claiming you can't see that the Gentiles are chosen/elect. I cannot make you pull your head out of the sand.

 

[Reformed1689]

On and on folks, claim after claim scripture does not mean what it says. 2 Peter 2:1 does not say Christ bought those heading to destruction. One copy and paste denial after another, because Calvinist's TULI are bogus views, shown by verse after verse they are unbiblical.

On the other hand, we claim Scripture means EXACTLY what it says in CONTEXT. See the difference?

 

[Reformed1689]

All Calvinists claim any verse that demonstrates their doctrine is false has been taken out of context, cherry picked, misinterpreted, and so forth. And then of course they use the fallacy of person incredulity. And so it goes.

That is simply false Van. (I'm waiting for the taint so post) It has been cherry-picked. If you read the whole passage, and the whole Bible, it is clear that it is not speaking against individuals being chosen.

 

[Reformed1689]

Straight up denial of scripture.

How so? That is a pretty big accusation.

 

[Reformed1689]

The Jews were elected corporately.

So every Jew will be in Heaven?

 

[AustinC]

The fiction that Gentiles being chosen for salvation does does not mean they are elect. Utter nonsense.

Was Titus a Jew or Gentile? Gentile - a Greek
Was Titus called "elect?" Yes Titus 1:4 says Paul and Titus held faith in common with each other, and in Titus 1:1 Paul refers to that faith as the faith of God's elect.

Van, you are sticking your head in the sand, creating arbitrary boundaries, and then claiming you can't see that the Gentiles are chosen/elect. I cannot make you pull your head out of the sand.

 

[Reformed1689]

MB, you are sticking your head in the sand, creating arbitrary boundaries, and then claiming you can't see that the Gentiles are chosen/elect. I cannot make you pull your head out of the sand.

Or the problem of saying every Jew was elect....

 

[Van]

On the other hand, we claim Scripture means EXACTLY what it says in CONTEXT. See the difference?

Yet another appeal to falsehood. I say 2 Peter 2:1 says Christ bought those heading to destruction, thus not elect, and Calvinist say in the context of Calvinism, the verse does not say that. On and on folks...

 

[Van]

Van, you are sticking your head in the sand, creating arbitrary boundaries, and then claiming you can't see that the Gentiles are chosen/elect. I cannot make you pull your head out of the sand.

Are you really incapable of comprehension, because the post say Gentiles are elect. Duh

 

[Reformed1689]

You have no idea, and so you beg for someone to teach you scripture so you can deny it.

I don't deny Scripture Van.

 

[Van]

A Calvinist leaning poster claimed God and Christ were racists. I asked if Limited atonement, the false doctrine of Calvinism that Christ did not die for all mankind, was the basis. If I got an answer, I missed it.

 

[Reformed1689]

Yet another appeal to falsehood. I say 2 Peter 2:1 says Christ bought those heading to destruction, thus not elect, and Calvinist say in the context of Calvinism, the verse does not say that. On and on folks...

No, all this shows is that you do not understand or know Reformed doctrine. Calvinists agree that Christ bought those heading to destruction. The elect are included in that. Just because you are elect, does not mean you are saved before faith is placed in Christ.