Jesus Christ Shed His Blood for Judas

[SavedByGrace]

Yes the gospel goes to all men not just those of Israel not just Jewish people not just common people ,those in Authority, all men. but not all men are going to be saved

if the Gospel of salvation is to be preached to the entire human race, then it must mean that Jesus' death is also "available" to the entire human race, even though the majority will not accept. Otherwise the Gospel preached to entire human race, is insincere!

 

[SavedByGrace]

I have answered that question time and time again. Why not start thinking for yourself, and see what scripture says the fallen must do to be chosen for salvation.

because I do NOT believe in the age old heresy of "election to salvation", which is NOT in the Bible!

 

[Van]

because I do NOT believe in the age old heresy of "election to salvation", which is NOT in the Bible!

Falsehood after falsehood are posted by some to divert discussion from the fact Christ died for all humankind.
Many are called but few are chosen.
Thessalonians chosen for salvation.
The called and chosen and faithful...

 

[SavedByGrace]

Falsehood after falsehood are posted by some to divert discussion from the fact Christ died for all humankind.
Many are called but few are chosen.
Thessalonians chosen for salvation.
The called and chosen and faithful...

it looks like you don't understand what you write? If, as you say that Jesus died for all humankind, and then say that only some are "elected to salvation", then what is the purpose of dying for "all humankind", if His death does not really relate to those who are not elected? this is nonsense!

 

[Van]

it looks like you don't understand what you write? If, as you say that Jesus died for all humankind, and then say that only some are "elected to salvation", then what is the purpose of dying for "all humankind", if His death does not really relate to those who are not elected? this is nonsense!

Calling God's revealed plan of redemption nonsense indicates perhaps you do not understand scripture.
Providing the means of salvation for all humankind, is a logical necessity, if God desires all people to be saved in accordance with His redemption plan, with everyone who God puts into Christ based on crediting their faith as righteousness being saved.

 

[Iconoclast]

if the Gospel of salvation is to be preached to the entire human race, then it must mean that Jesus' death is also "available" to the entire human race, even though the majority will not accept. Otherwise the Gospel preached to entire human race, is insincere!

The free offer of the gospel is not the issue in question.
What is at issue is the accomplished work of Redemption,that was actual. not potential.
You deny the Covenant nature of the atonement everytime you suggest an unfinished work, as Jesus declared in Jn 17.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Calling God's revealed plan of redemption nonsense indicates perhaps you do not understand scripture.
Providing the means of salvation for all humankind, is a logical necessity, if God desires all people to be saved in accordance with His redemption plan, with everyone who God puts into Christ based on crediting their faith as righteousness being saved.

 

[SavedByGrace]

What is at issue is the accomplished work of Redemption,that was actual. not potential.

this makes the "free offer" a farce!. the fact that the Gospel is offered to the entire human race, means that it cannot be "actual", because only those who potentially were to accept this offer, will get saved! only then does it become "actual". you write in riddles!

 

[Dr. Bob]

why don't you deal with the passage from Luke's Gospel? It is very clear that Judas did take the Lord's Supper. read the words that Luke uses, "“This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you" (verse 20), which is NOT the Passover Meal! AFTER this Jesus says, "But behold, the hand of My betrayer is with Me on the table." Interesting that both Matthew Henry and John Gill, both Reformed theologians, accept that Judas did take the bread and wine. And yet you think that you somehow know better? There is NO contradiction between any of the Goepels, Luke is more detailed on what happened, and is clear to those tho are not biased, that Judas was there and did eat the bread, and drink the wine that represents Jesus' body and blood, and Jesus also told Judas, "which is shed for YOU"!.

You can't accept this because it goes against your "theology", rather than what the Bible actually says!

Strange argument, bro. These words come AFTER the supper is over (already ate the meal/lamb sop had concluded). Judas was there for the meal (obviously, Jesus handed the lamb sop to him) but is he there AFTER supper? Casual reading acts like he IS there because the statement includes "IS" (present tense). But, not one Greek document has the word "is" in the verse. The KJV accurately uses italics to show that "is" is a man-made addition to God's Word. When they were eating earlier, "is" would be correct. Now? All the other eyewitnesses (not Luke, second-hand information) say Judas LEFT.

If Jesus atoned for Judas' sin (atone = paid the penalty, covered, once-for-all deal), then Judas will be in heaven. A just God cannot demand payment twice if Jesus paid it all. Of course, that is absurd.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Strange argument, bro. These words come AFTER the supper is over (already ate the meal/lamb sop had concluded). Judas was there for the meal (obviously, Jesus handed the lamb sop to him) but is he there AFTER supper? Casual reading acts like he IS there because the statement includes "IS" (present tense). But, not one Greek document has the word "is" in the verse. The KJV accurately uses italics to show that "is" is a man-made addition to God's Word. When they were eating earlier, "is" would be correct. Now? All the other eyewitnesses (not Luke, second-hand information) say Judas LEFT.

If Jesus atoned for Judas' sin (atone = paid the penalty, covered, once-for-all deal), then Judas will be in heaven. A just God cannot demand payment twice if Jesus paid it all. Of course, that is absurd.

how about checking the Greek? the words, "of him that betrayeth", is from the Greek, παραδιδόντος, the verb is in the present tense, showing that Judas was WITH Jesus when He was speaking! Literal translation is, "the hand of he who is betraying me, is still with me at the table". That is why the KJV added "is", because it is what the Greek text says!

ESV, But behold, the hand of him who betrays me is with me on the table.
NASB, "But behold, the hand of the one betraying Me is with Mine on the table.
HCSB, But look, the hand of the one betraying Me is at the table with Me!
CEV, The one who will betray me is here at the table with me!
NIV, But the hand of him who is going to betray me is with mine on the table.
NLT, “But here at this table, sitting among us as a friend, is the man who will betray me.
NET, "But look, the hand of the one who betrays me is with me on the table.
NAS, “But behold, the hand of the one betraying Me is with Me on the table.
ASV, But behold, the hand of him that betrayeth me is with me on the table.
ERV, But behold, the hand of him that betrayeth me is with me on the table.
Weymouth, Yet the hand of him who is betraying me is at the table with me.
Webster, But behold, the hand of him that betrayeth me is with me on the table
Young, But, lo, the hand of him delivering me up is with me on the table
WEb, But behold, the hand of him who betrays me is with me on the table.

 

[Iconoclast]

this makes the "free offer" a farce!. the fact that the Gospel is offered to the entire human race, means that it cannot be "actual", because only those who potentially were to accept this offer, will get saved! only then does it become "actual". you write in riddles!

The gospel when preached is freely offered.
It is a sincere offer, and not as you contend. a farce.
It seems that way to you because you and others do not seem to understand the fallen condition of man. If not for irresistible grace not one would come savingly to Jesus.
The problem is not the offer, it is the total inability to process the offer.

 

[AustinC]

you should try more Bible and less theology, as Paul was told, "it is making you mad"!

There is a difference between remorse and repentance.
Remorse is being sorry you did something wrong (mainly because you got caught and you don't have the power to win the fight).

Repentance is turning away from one thing and turning to another thing.

We read in 1 Thessalonians 1 how the Christians there were repenting, turning to God away from idols. That repentance was causing a revival in Thessaloniki. You will never see a rebel turning away from sin and turning toward God...before God saves them by grace. The teaching that repentance is "required" before salvation can take place is completely false.

1 Thessalonians 1:4-10
For we know, brothers loved by God, that he has chosen you, because our gospel came to you not only in word, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction. You know what kind of men we proved to be among you for your sake. And you became imitators of us and of the Lord, for you received the word in much affliction, with the joy of the Holy Spirit, so that you became an example to all the believers in Macedonia and in Achaia. For not only has the word of the Lord sounded forth from you in Macedonia and Achaia, but your faith in God has gone forth everywhere, so that we need not say anything. For they themselves report concerning us the kind of reception we had among you, and how you turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God, and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come.

 

[AustinC]

I wish people should not make such dumb remarks when they themselves don't understand the Bible's teachings!

" and that repentance for the forgiveness of sins" (Luke 24:47)

"And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins" (Acts 2:38)

" Repent therefore, and turn back, that your sins may be blotted out" (Acts 2:19)

THIS is what the Bible actually teaches, it is up to you to accept or fight it!

Where in any of these verses does God say "You are saved by your repentance."???

I have quoted Ephesians 2:4-9 to you. What do you reject about what God tells you?

But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

John tells Christians that God forgives our sin when we repent.

1 John 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

That is written to the saved, not to the unsaved.

Let's look at your verses:

Luke 24:44-48 Then he said to them, “These are my words that I spoke to you while I was still with you, that everything written about me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.” Then he opened their minds to understand the Scriptures, and said to them, “Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer and on the third day rise from the dead, and that repentance and forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem. You are witnesses of these things.

Where does Jesus say "People are saved by their repentance."?

Acts 2:36-41 Let all the house of Israel therefore know for certain that God has made him both Lord and Christ, this Jesus whom you crucified.” Now when they heard this they were cut to the heart, and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?” And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is for you and for your children and for all who are far off, everyone whom the Lord our God calls to himself.” And with many other words he bore witness and continued to exhort them, saying, “Save yourselves from this crooked generation.” So those who received his word were baptized, and there were added that day about three thousand souls.

Where does Peter say "You are saved by your repentance."???

These are the words of God. These are the verses you are doing a poor job of understanding. In the verses you quote, your teaching is proved wrong by God's word.

You may struggle with your pride so that you cannot admit you are wrong, but if you will covenant to study God's word, you will change your mind (repent) regarding your assertion that repentance saves you.

 

[SavedByGrace]

The gospel when preached is freely offered.
It is a sincere offer, and not as you contend. a farce.
It seems that way to you because you and others do not seem to understand the fallen condition of man. If not for irresistible grace not one would come savingly to Jesus.
The problem is not the offer, it is the total inability to process the offer.

what exactly is the Gospel to you? I understand this as Great News, that the Lord Jesus Christ came into the world to save sinners from a certain eternal punishment! So, in your theology, God wants this Great News about salvation in Jesus proclaimed to the entire world, but, there is a sting in this for those who are not "elect", they cannot ever be saved, because Jesus did not die for their sins! This then is a insincere Gospel as it is meant for all, but not intented for all! There is no Good News in telling the lost that they cannot repent and believe, and are on their way to eternal punishment, because, even though you may hear this wonderful news of free salvation, yet sorry, it is no for you! This is very cruel and not the way of the Lord! If the Gospel of salvation from eternal punishment, si to be preached to the human race, then the only way it can be sincere, is that Jesus Christ has made "provision" for the sins on the human race in His death, so that "whosoever will, let them freely come and drink"! This, my friend, is GREAT NEWS for ALL the human race

 

[37818]

without involving sorrow for sins?

Sorrow is a work. It can be a motive to hear the gospel.

 

[Alan Gross]

I have answered that question time and time again. Why not start thinking for yourself, and see what scripture says the fallen must do to be chosen for salvation.

The fallen must show evidence of having been Granted Repentance and Faith, by God, knowing what they are repenting of, which is their Total inability, in response to The Gospel Message and knowing what they are Trusting in, which is Jesus The Savior.

The fallen who do not have the testimony and evidence of having been Granted Repentance and Faith, by God, knowing what they are repenting of, which is their Total inability in response to The Gospel Message and knowing what they are Trusting in, which is Jesus The Savior are never candidates for Scriptural Baptism, as entrance into one of The Churches Jesus Built.

The fallen who have given a Profession of Faith and do not show evidence of having been Granted Repentance and Faith, by God, knowing what they are repenting of, which is their Total inability in response to The Gospel Message and knowing what they are Trusting in, which is Jesus The Savior, after they have been Scripturally Baptised, as entrance into one of The Churches Jesus Built, are, then, candidates for Church Discipline.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Where in any of these verses does God say "You are saved by your repentance."???

so glad you asked, but are you willing to listen and change? read very carefully:

"Now there were some present at that time who told Jesus about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. 2 Jesus answered, “Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? 3 I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. 4 Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them—do you think they were more guilty than all the others living in Jerusalem? 5 I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish.” (Luke 13)

can you see here that REPENTANCE is for SALVATION?

 

[SavedByGrace]

Total inability

UNBIBLICAL!

Read chapter 5 of John, where Jesus is speaking to the Jews who wanted to murder Him (verses 17-18). He tells these SAME Jews, "24 “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life. 25 Very truly I tell you, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live"

Here thes Jews were able to HEAR the voice of the Lord for their salvation!

 

[AustinC]

so glad you asked, but are you willing to listen and change? read very carefully:

"Now there were some present at that time who told Jesus about the Galileans whose blood Pilate had mixed with their sacrifices. 2 Jesus answered, “Do you think that these Galileans were worse sinners than all the other Galileans because they suffered this way? 3 I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish. 4 Or those eighteen who died when the tower in Siloam fell on them—do you think they were more guilty than all the others living in Jerusalem? 5 I tell you, no! But unless you repent, you too will all perish.” (Luke 13)

can you see here that REPENTANCE is for SALVATION?

Read what you quoted. Where in that passage do you read, "Repent in order to save your soul."???

Could you possibly admit that you are reading your theological bias into the passage you have quoted?

I note that you have not responded to the Ephesians 2:4-9 passage that tells you exactly how a person is saved. Why is it you refuse that passage?

Ephesians 2:4-9 But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

SBG, God's word does not support your assertion. The verses you quote do not state what you assert. At this point anyone reading can see you are in error, but your stubbornness won't allow you to change your mind. I can only ask you to read God's word and set aside your prejudice while reading.

 

[SavedByGrace]

Read what you quoted. Where in that passage do you read, "Repent in order to save your soul."???

Jesus says very clearly, "unless you REPENT you will PERISH (LOST)". So, when you do REPENT you do not PERISH and are therefore SAVED! Is this so hard for you to grasp? looks like you like to argue for the sake of it!