Time and the Creation Account

[dad2]

I assume you agree God is not a liar. Titus 1:2
Psalms 90:2, ". . . from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God. . . ." When God created time the eternal now became everlasting without beginning and everlasting without end.

Ps 90:2 is talking about the creation of earth and God. That is not talking about time this solar system today by any stretch of the imagination! Titus 1:2 says this

In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;
That is talking about eternal life and God. It says nothing about some eternal 'now' or anything else you said. Nothing at all. If you want to talk Scripture then do not make things up. Sure we could try to visualize the future after this present world passes away and refer to it as the 'eternal now'. That really does not say anything that relates to the issue at hand here...what time itself is like now in this universe real far away from anywhere man has ever been.

And light also means truth. 1 John 1:5, John 1:9. So the distant past is really the distant past.

That is nonsense. Light is compared to truth, but that does not mean that physical light speed is the same in all this temporary universe!

Mass energy and time are inter related.

Great, so what? That does not mean anything in regards to what time itself in the unknown reaches of the universe is like compared to time here!

Energy divided by the square of the velocity of light in empty space equals the mass of matter.

That is theory. That is based on light velocity as measured here in this little solar system and area. No one has ever gone a light year, you do realize that? It is all conjecture. The furthest probe of man in space is not even one light DAY away yet! You cannot talk about any other point of observation in the whole universe because we have only had ONE point of observation. That nonsense about what 2 observers 'would' see in different parts of space is absolute bunk. Belief. Mental modelling based solely on what we see light do in our time and space here.

There is the written word of God and the natural word of God, Romans 10:17-18, Psalms 19:4. Matthew 4:4, Isaiah 55:11.

So what? Point? Just because God sent down a written Scripture for man does not mean time in this far universe is homogeneous!

 

[37818]

Ps 90:2 is talking about the creation of earth and God. That is not talking about time this solar system today by any stretch of the imagination! Titus 1:2 says this

We disagree. The first day the Sun was that light. The fourth day the lights God made became their distinct lights. Genesis 1:1 was the creation of the heavens and earth, earth before Genesis 1:2.

 

[dad2]

We disagree. The first day the Sun was that light. The fourth day the lights God made became their distinct lights. Genesis 1:1 was the creation of the heavens and earth, earth before Genesis 1:2.

The bible does not say light started to exist when the stars and sun were made. Nor does the bible say light will cease to exist if there were no sun. In fact we are told that light was here and created before the sun.

Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light
Gen 1:5 ...And the evening and the morning were the first day.

The first day the sun was here had nothing to do with that light according to the bible! When God made the sun and stars it does not say anything about them merely just becoming 'distinct'! As for the heavens and earth in verse 1, that does not mean that it was all finished before it started! Only after chapter one is over, and we are in the next chapter do we find out it was now finished.

 

[37818]

The bible does not say light started to exist when the stars and sun were made. . . .

Friend,
If I was not already a Bible believer.

This universe existed before Genesis and before God gave those words to Moses.

So here is what I would like to know from you:. How would you explain God to some one? And how one can know God

 

[dad2]

Friend,
If I was not already a Bible believer.

This universe existed before Genesis and before God gave those words to Moses.

If we did not have God's word, then of course we would have no way to challenge the fables of so called science, or realize they were a croc. Thankfully though, we do.

So here is what I would like to know from you:. How would you explain God to some one? And how one can know God

I would explain God like this...Jesus.

 

[37818]

If we did not have God's word, then of course we would have no way to challenge the fables of so called science, or realize they were a croc. Thankfully though, we do.o

. What real science do you believe that is not a croc?

I would explain God like this...Jesus.

Jesus is a man. 1 Timothy 2:5, which you did not provide. Also which Jesus? 2 Corinthians 11:4.

 

[dad2]

. What real science do you believe that is not a croc?

All knowledge that works and can be tested and observed etc. That doesn't mean I like it all. WOMD for example, or some aspects of the medical system etc. It is real and real bad. As for the absolute faith based, belief based origin science models of the far past and life etc, that is all a croc.

Jesus is a man. 1 Timothy 2:5, which you did not provide. Also which Jesus? 2 Corinthians 11:4.

God became man, yes. Jesus and the Father are One. But it is funny that you gave up trying to defend your claims about light and time etc in the unknown far universe.

 

[37818]

All knowledge that works and can be tested and observed etc. That doesn't mean I like it all. WOMD for example, or some aspects of the medical system etc. It is real and real bad. As for the absolute faith based, belief based origin science models of the far past and life etc, that is all a croc.

Real science that is not a croc. Give me an example.

God became man, yes. Jesus and the Father are One. But it is funny that you gave up trying to defend your claims about light and time etc in the unknown far universe.

Hosea 11:9, ". . . for I am God, and not man; . . ." And 1 Timothy 2:5, ". . . For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; . . ." Says your understanding is wrong in some way.

I did not give up on space-time and matter. The nearest star is about 8 light minutes away, the Sun. Andromada Galaxy is measured to be some 2.5 million light years a way. What evidence do you have that is a croc.

 

[dad2]

Real science that is not a croc. Give me an example.

Hosea 11:9, ". . . for I am God, and not man; . . ." And 1 Timothy 2:5, ". . . For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; . . ." Says your understanding is wrong in some way.

I did not give up on space-time and matter. The nearest star is about 8 light minutes away, the Sun. Andromada Galaxy is measured to be some 2.5 million light years a way. What evidence do you have that is a croc.

Obviously Jesus was not born a man yet in Hosea. He was prophesied to one day though, and fulfilled some 300 prophesies while here. So NOW God is a man as well as God! Jesus still had the marks in His body after He arose from the dead.

As for merely saying that stars are so many light years away, that is of no worth. As explained to you, unless time and space as we know it here and now existed all the way to the stars then there is NO possible way to claim even one light year. Man has only travelled about 1.3 light SECONDS!!! That is about how long it takes light from the moon to reach earth. The most distant probes are not even a light day away! You certainly may not talk about a light week or a light year! You have no idea what light would do out there as far a moving in the time that exists there! Your imaginary times and distances are all belief based and nothing else.

 

[37818]

viously Jesus was not born a man yet in Hosea. He was prophesied to one day though, and fulfilled some 300 prophesies while here. So NOW God is a man as well as God! Jesus still had the marks in His body after He arose from the dead.

John 4:23-24, ". . . ut the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. . . ."
John 20:17, ". . . Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. . . ."
Luke 24:36-39, ". . . And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit. And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. . . ."

 

[37818]

As for merely saying that stars are so many light years away, that is of no worth. As explained to you, unless time and space as we know it here and now existed all the way to the stars then there is NO possible way to claim even one light year. Man has only travelled about 1.3 light SECONDS!!! That is about how long it takes light from the moon to reach earth. The most distant probes are not even a light day away! You certainly may not talk about a light week or a light year! You have no idea what light would do out there as far a moving in the time that exists there! Your imaginary times and distances are all belief based and nothing else.

Your anti science ignorance is astounding. Besides this, God could have in an instant created the billions of years of real historical space-time. And it would be no lie, but really billions of years ago.

 

[dad2]

John 4:23-24, ". . . ut the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. . . ."
John 20:17, ". . . Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God. . . ."
Luke 24:36-39, ". . . And as they thus spake, Jesus himself stood in the midst of them, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you. But they were terrified and affrighted, and supposed that they had seen a spirit. And he said unto them, Why are ye troubled? and why do thoughts arise in your hearts? Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. . . ."

Not sure what point you think you have in the verses cited. It seems you do not believe in Jesus as God. If so, there is no use arguing the point.

 

[dad2]

Your anti science ignorance is astounding. Besides this, God could have in an instant created the billions of years of real historical space-time. And it would be no lie, but really billions of years ago.

Your blind faith in already exposed false science that you cannot begin to support or show to be anything other than 100% faith based is astounding. It makes no sense to claim God may have (coulda shoulda woulda) poofed deceptive time in the universe. If so why would it matter? We know the world and sun and stars and space were all made in six days. That makes about as much sense as claiming God poofed deceptive fossils into the ground at creation! There is no support for that trickster sort of claim at all.
It seems you take the imaginary billions of years that science preaches seriously. That is the root of the problem here. I have explained several times to you now that unless time and space were the same in all the universe the distances and times claimed by science are fantasy. You need to prove they are not if you want to keep offering them as fact or reality here. I think it is science, so called that invented the billions of years, and not God that had anything to do with it! He already explained how much time was involved in the creation of all things.

 

[37818]

Not sure what point you think you have in the verses cited. It seems you do not believe in Jesus as God. If so, there is no use arguing the point.

The Lord Jesus Christ is both the man and was always also God. He has always been the Creator on behalf of His Father - even while He as the man who died on the cross, Hebrews 1:3.

 

[37818]

Your blind faith in already exposed false science that you cannot begin to support or show to be anything other than 100% faith based is astounding. It makes no sense to claim God may have (coulda shoulda woulda) poofed deceptive time in the universe. If so why would it matter? We know the world and sun and stars and space were all made in six days. That makes about as much sense as claiming God poofed deceptive fossils into the ground at creation! There is no support for that trickster sort of claim at all.
It seems you take the imaginary billions of years that science preaches seriously. That is the root of the problem here. I have explained several times to you now that unless time and space were the same in all the universe the distances and times claimed by science are fantasy. You need to prove they are not if you want to keep offering them as fact or reality here. I think it is science, so called that invented the billions of years, and not God that had anything to do with it! He already explained how much time was involved in the creation of all things.

What caused day and night? The rotating Earth facing the Sun, Genesis 1:3-5. God caused the Sun to give light. Genesis 1:8, Genesis 1:13, Genesis 1:19, Genesis 1:23, Genesis 1:31. If that light was not the Sun where did that light go after the fourth day when the greater light appeared? Was that not the Sun?

 

[dad2]

The Lord Jesus Christ is both the man and was always also God. He has always been the Creator on behalf of His Father - even while He as the man who died on the cross, Hebrews 1:3.

Ok, great, so what does that have to do with time and the creation account or supporting the claims you toss out in the name of science?

 

[dad2]

What caused day and night? The rotating Earth facing the Sun, Genesis 1:3-5. God caused the Sun to give light. Genesis 1:8, Genesis 1:13, Genesis 1:19, Genesis 1:23, Genesis 1:31. If that light was not the Sun where did that light go after the fourth day when the greater light appeared? Was that not the Sun?

Why make stuff up? There was no sun whether the earth was rotating or still, or doing the Samba. Of course after the sun was created it gave us light, that was what God designed it to do.

 

[37818]

Why make stuff up? There was no sun whether the earth was rotating or still, or doing the Samba. Of course after the sun was created it gave us light, that was what God designed it to do.

You deny the plain meaning of the text because the word that translates as Sun is not even used in Genesis 1:1-31. You only want to allow your interpertation. I gave you my understanding. We do not agree. And what was that science that is not a croc?

 

[37818]

Ok, great, so what does that have to do with time and the creation account or supporting the claims you toss out in the name of science?

What science have you presented?

 

[SGO]

Hey!

Here is one for you who love science:

But from the beginning of the creation
God made them male and female.
Mark 10:6

He made them male and female at the beginning of creation.

Ooops!

That pesky bible is just a story and the One who said the above line does not understand science.

He was just illustrating His teaching and went out of bounds from what we really know.