False Religion of Arminianism 2

[AustinC]

Yes the Calvinists are not part of the ungodly

False.
All persons are ungodly since all sin and fall short of the glory of God.
All whom God has chosen are placed in Christ and we who are in Christ are godly purely because Christ is godly, not because we are godly in ourselves.

 

[atpollard]

My question for you is "what in this verse would make you think it was limited to just the so called elect"? That is something that you have to read into the text.

No. I would say that particular verse was silent on Limited vs General Atonement … it merely affirms “atonement” precedes any “merit” (God did not die for those that DESERVED it.)

 

[Reformed1689]

Romans might be addressed to the believers at the church, but no doubt as in every church there are many who are not really saved. These also hear the Words and can apply them to themselves. I see no problem with this as the Gospel Message is for the entire human race

Of course you don't because to interpret it properly would destroy your view.

 

[Reformed1689]

So you think some people are not ungodly? Once again I have to question your reading ability. Or should I say your unwillingness to accept what the text says.

Where did I say that? You are putting forth a strawman argument. Perhaps it is you that cannot read.

 

[Silverhair]

Where did I say that? You are putting forth a strawman argument. Perhaps it is you that cannot read.

Reformed1689 Are you saying that some people are not part of the ungodly? Where does that say ALL of the ungodly?

So now your changing your words and admitting that ALL are ungodly. That would mean that Christ Jesus came to save all people, that was Gods desire.
1Ti 2:3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

But we know that not all will be saved because each person has to make that choice as no one can make it for them.
Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

You have shown many times that you do not trust yourself to make any decision about your salvation. You trust that you are one of the so called elect but there is no way that you can really know is there. You just have to hope you did not get it wrong. Your determinism has locked you in a room that you have no way out of, well that is unless you actually start to trust what that scriptures say.

 

[Reformed1689]

Reformed1689 Are you saying that some people are not part of the ungodly? Where does that say ALL of the ungodly?

So now your changing your words and admitting that ALL are ungodly. That would mean that Christ Jesus came to save all people, that was Gods desire.
1Ti 2:3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
1Ti 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

But we know that not all will be saved because each person has to make that choice as no one can make it for them.
Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

You have shown many times that you do not trust yourself to make any decision about your salvation. You trust that you are one of the so called elect but there is no way that you can really know is there. You just have to hope you did not get it wrong. Your determinism has locked you in a room that you have no way out of, well that is unless you actually start to trust what that scriptures say.

I never said that there was anyone that was not ungodly. What I ACTUALLY said was, are the ungodly referred to in Romans 5 talking about every ungodly person or only the ungodly to which the letter is addressed, the now saved?

 

[AustinC]

Where did I say that? You are putting forth a strawman argument. Perhaps it is you that cannot read.

Indeed, he relies on strawmen and purposeful misunderstanding.

 

[Silverhair]

I never said that there was anyone that was not ungodly. What I ACTUALLY said was, are the ungodly referred to in Romans 5 talking about every ungodly person or only the ungodly to which the letter is addressed, the now saved?

I know why you would look at it as only for those saved at that time where as I see it as a statement that Christ Jesus did indeed die for all the ungodly. Why you would want to limit what God can do I really do not understand.

 

[Reformed1689]

I know why you would look at it as only for those saved at that time where as I see it as a statement that Christ Jesus did indeed die for all the ungodly. Why you would want to limit what God can do I really do not understand.

I don't limit what God CAN do. I just believe in what He said he ACTUALLY did and not what humans think is fair or unfair.

 

[Silverhair]

I don't limit what God CAN do. I just believe in what He said he ACTUALLY did and not what humans think is fair or unfair.

I have not said God has to be fair but He does have to be just would you not agree.

Rom_3:26 for the demonstration, I say, of His righteousness at the present time, so that He would be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

 

[Brightfame52]

Give one of your quotes which presents said evidence that Arminianism is a false religion. Just one.

I already gave them, thats how they came into existence, I posted them. If you want to know them, then go read the things I have posted, thats why I posted them in the first place.

 

[Brightfame52]

So you believe Jesus taught works salvation too, ". . . Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father . . . ."

No I dont believe Jesus taught works Salvation.

 

[37818]

MGNT vs TR.

LOL. John 6:47. F35GNT, MGNT, and TR vs CT.

 

[37818]

I already gave them, thats how they came into existence, I posted them. If you want to know them, then go read the things I have posted, thats why I posted them in the first place.

Vain rant.

 

[37818]

You can't affirm both....

The general redemption does not disallow the truth of particular redemption. Without the general redemption being true no one before faith in being redeemed has any rational basis to believe Christ died for one.

 

[37818]

Romans 5:8 in no way teaches general redemption.

How does one know Christ died for one if the general redemption was not true? No one can. But the general redemption is true. So the irrational who believe in limited atonement and that Christ died for them are safe in spite of their foolish denial in this case.

 

[Reformed1689]

How does one know Christ died for one if the general redemption was not true? No one can. But the general redemption is true. So the irrational who believe in limited atonement and that Christ died for them are safe in spite of their foolish denial in this case.

Yet you have yet to show one verse in its proper context and audience understanding that demonstrates a general redemption.

 

[Reformed1689]

The general redemption does not disallow the truth of particular redemption.

Of course it does. They are polar opposites. You have three options, 1. Everyone was redeemed, 2. Some were redeemed, 3. Nobody was redeemed. You want 1 and 2. It can't be that way.

 

[37818]

Yet you have yet to show one verse in its proper context and audience understanding that demonstrates a general redemption.

The audience is whoever reads or hears it. God knew and intended that.

 

[37818]

Of course it does. They are polar opposites. You have three options, 1. Everyone was redeemed, 2. Some were redeemed, 3. Nobody was redeemed. You want 1 and 2. It can't be that way.

You are being irrational about this. The redemption is provided for everyone. And the reason was to die for His sheep.