none shall be saved unless they call upon the name of the Lord Jesus
Romans 10:13
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Justification
- Thread starter KenH
- Start date
Romans 10:13
red, who of us perfectly do the law?
Answer: no one.
Therefore, justification is by grace alone.
You have this Roman Catholic, Council of Trent, theology that is simply wrong.
Post #2:
13 …the doers of the law shall be justified...Ro 2
20 ..by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified...Ro 3
K. No prob.
True, for if any could get right with God themselves, why would Jesus have to suffer and die for our sake?
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
I find it to be interesting that the
Amplified Bible
Berean Study Bible
English Standard Version
New American Standard Bible
New International Version 2002
New King James Version
New Living Translation
New Revised Standard Version
translate that last phrase as "by the faith in Jesus Christ" (emphasis mine).
Wycliffe Bible translation and the Tyndale Bible translation and the King James Version translate that last phrase as "by the faith of Jesus Christ" (emphasis mine).
These bibles that I have also use “of” in the translation.
Apostolic Bible Polyglot; New English Translation; Stephanus Textus Receptus
The use of "faith of Jesus Christ" or "faith in Jesus Christ." A decision is difficult here. Though traditionally translated "faith in Jesus Christ," an increasing number of NT scholars are arguing that πίστις Χριστοῦ (pisti Christou) and similar phrases in Paul (here and in Gal_2:20; Rom_3:22; Rom_3:26; Gal_3:22; Eph_3:12; Php_3:9) involve a subjective genitive and mean "Christ’s faith" or "Christ’s faithfulness"
As you can see there are various views as to how this should be translated. It is quite subjective.
Alford πίστεως G4102 Ἰησοῦ G2424 χριστοῦ, G5547
BSB faith πίστεως in Jesus Ἰησοῦ, Christ.
Tri Faith G4102 N-GSF Ἰησοῦ Of Jesus G2424 N-GSM Χριστοῦ Christ, G5547
NKJV faith G4102 in Jesus G2424 Christ G5547
Note that there is no Greek word for “IN or OF” in the sentence. It is just a choice of the translator as to which they will use.
Yes indeed, good quote, good point.
It's in the very same vein as Ro 2:13-15, but you 'faith-aloners' just can't bring yourselves to see it, let alone accept it.
Romans2 is not against the Phil.2 quote kyred.
It is a faith that works
While Justification 'by grace' is thus identified with Justification 'by faith,' both are frequently opposed to Justification 'by works.' 'Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness. Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law.' 'Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.'2 'By grace are ye saved, through faith, … not of works, lest any man should boast.' 'Who hath saved us, and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace.'4 'After that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward men appeared,—not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, … that being justified by His grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.' As it is certain, therefore, that Justification 'by grace' is identified in Scripture with Justification 'by faith,' it is equally certain from these testimonies, that both are placed in contrast and opposition to Justification 'by works.' What relation subsists between Justification and 'works,' on the one hand, and between Justification and 'faith,' on the other, will fall to be considered in separate propositions; in the meantime, we speak only of its relation to 'grace.'
TheDoctrineofJustificationJamesBuchanan.pdf
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ibid;
The first of these is the reality and necessity of Good Works in the case of every true believer.
In Scripture, they are not only required of all believers, but recognised also as being truly acceptable to God, and even rewarded by Him.
They are acceptable to Him for three distinct reasons:
first, because they are acts of dutiful obedience, on the part of those who have been 'accepted in the Beloved,' and whom He has adopted as His own children;
secondly, because they are agreeable to His revealed will;
and thirdly, because they are the 'fruits of His Spirit,' and, as such, very precious in themselves, and very pleasing to Him.
No one with the Bible in his hands can possibly believe, that faith is not more acceptable to Him than unbelief,—or 'a broken and a contrite spirit' than 'a hard and impenitent heart,'—or integrity and truth than fraud and falsehood,—or purity in thought, word, and deed, than a prurient fancy and a profligate life,—or that infused and inherent holiness which, however imperfect, is the incipient restoration of His own image, than that habitual sinfulness, which is the image of the wicked one. For both the graces and the good works of believers are expressly declared to be acceptable to Him. 'The ornament of a meek and quiet spirit' is said to be 'in the sight of God of great price;'—believers are commanded, not only to 'offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually,' but also 'to do good and to communicate; for with such sacrifices God is well pleased;' their 'prayers and their alms' are said 'to come up for a memorial before God;
'2 their contributions to the cause of Christ are described as 'an odour of a sweet smell, a sacrifice acceptable, well pleasing to God;'—all believers are represented 'as a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ,'
4—and they are exhorted 'by the mercies of God, that they present their bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is their reasonable service.' Their good works are even said to be rewarded, and that, too, in a measure proportioned to their number and excellence. 'For God is not unrighteous, to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have showed toward His name, in that ye have ministered to the saints.' 'He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet, shall receive a prophet's reward; and he that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a righteous man, shall receive a righteous man's reward. And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.' 'Whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.… And let us not be weary in well-doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.' 'But he which soweth sparingly, shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully, shall reap also bountifully.'
'And every man shall receive his own reward, according to his own labour.' 'The fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon' (the only 'foundation that is laid, which is Jesus Christ'), 'he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved, yet so as by fire.'
From these testimonies it clearly appears,—that 'good works' d an important place in the scheme of Grace and Redemption,—that they are, in their own nature, intrinsically good, as contradistinguished from those which are morally evil,—that they are acceptable to God, both as being in accordance with His revealed will, and also as being the fruits of His Spirit,—and that they are connected with the promise of a divine reward. These truths are so clearly revealed, that could they be proved to be necessarily exclusive of Justification by grace through faith alone, we should be obliged either to abandon that doctrine altogether, or to modify it, so as to bring it into accordance with the express teaching of Scripture on the subject of good works. But there will be no difficulty in reconciling the two doctrines if we take a sufficiently comprehensive view of the whole 'revealed counsel of God.' Let us bear in mind,—that the 'good works,' which are said to be acceptable, and even rewarded, are those of true believers, who have already been justified and 'accepted in the Beloved,'—that while believers are not now 'under the law' as a covenant of works, because it has been fulfilled by Christ as their substitute and surety, they are still 'under the law to Christ' as a rule of life,—that they are, and ever must be, the subjects of a moral government, even after they have been brought into His kingdom,— that while He promises to reward their obedience, and to relieve them entirely from the punishment due to them on account of sin, He still says even to His redeemed people, 'As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous, therefore, and repent,'—that the 'rewards of grace,' which are peculiar to the Gospel, are expressly contrasted with the 'rewards of debt,' which belong only to the Law, —and that the same afflictions which, in the case of the unbelieving and impenitent, are properly penal inflictions, embittered by the wrath of God, are converted, in the case of His children, into paternal chastisements, and even classed among their chartered privileges, while they are sweetened by a Father's love;—let us give due weight to these considerations, and we shall see at once, that their free Justification by grace through faith only is not inconsistent, either with their being governed now according to law, or with their being judged hereafter according to works. (5) This will become more evident if we her consider, how Good Works stand related to Faith, and to Justification, respectively. They are the effects of faith, and, as such, the evidences both of faith, and of justification. That they are the effects of faith is clear; for 'whatsoever is not of faith is sin;' and 'without faith it is impossible to please God;' and 'the end of the commandment is charity, out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned.'
The first of these is the reality and necessity of Good Works in the case of every true believer.
In Scripture, they are not only required of all believers, but recognised also as being truly acceptable to God, and even rewarded by Him.
They are acceptable to Him for three distinct reasons:
first, because they are acts of dutiful obedience, on the part of those who have been 'accepted in the Beloved,' and whom He has adopted as His own children;
secondly, because they are agreeable to His revealed will;
and thirdly, because they are the 'fruits of His Spirit,' and, as such, very precious in themselves, and very pleasing to Him.
No one with the Bible in his hands can possibly believe, that faith is not more acceptable to Him than unbelief,—or 'a broken and a contrite spirit' than 'a hard and impenitent heart,'—or integrity and truth than fraud and falsehood,—or purity in thought, word, and deed, than a prurient fancy and a profligate life,—or that infused and inherent holiness which, however imperfect, is the incipient restoration of His own image, than that habitual sinfulness, which is the image of the wicked one. For both the graces and the good works of believers are expressly declared to be acceptable to Him. 'The ornament of a meek and quiet spirit' is said to be 'in the sight of God of great price;'—believers are commanded, not only to 'offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually,' but also 'to do good and to communicate; for with such sacrifices God is well pleased;' their 'prayers and their alms' are said 'to come up for a memorial before God;
'2 their contributions to the cause of Christ are described as 'an odour of a sweet smell, a sacrifice acceptable, well pleasing to God;'—all believers are represented 'as a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ,'
4—and they are exhorted 'by the mercies of God, that they present their bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is their reasonable service.' Their good works are even said to be rewarded, and that, too, in a measure proportioned to their number and excellence. 'For God is not unrighteous, to forget your work and labour of love, which ye have showed toward His name, in that ye have ministered to the saints.' 'He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet, shall receive a prophet's reward; and he that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a righteous man, shall receive a righteous man's reward. And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.' 'Whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap.… And let us not be weary in well-doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not.' 'But he which soweth sparingly, shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully, shall reap also bountifully.'
'And every man shall receive his own reward, according to his own labour.' 'The fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon' (the only 'foundation that is laid, which is Jesus Christ'), 'he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved, yet so as by fire.'
From these testimonies it clearly appears,—that 'good works' d an important place in the scheme of Grace and Redemption,—that they are, in their own nature, intrinsically good, as contradistinguished from those which are morally evil,—that they are acceptable to God, both as being in accordance with His revealed will, and also as being the fruits of His Spirit,—and that they are connected with the promise of a divine reward. These truths are so clearly revealed, that could they be proved to be necessarily exclusive of Justification by grace through faith alone, we should be obliged either to abandon that doctrine altogether, or to modify it, so as to bring it into accordance with the express teaching of Scripture on the subject of good works. But there will be no difficulty in reconciling the two doctrines if we take a sufficiently comprehensive view of the whole 'revealed counsel of God.' Let us bear in mind,—that the 'good works,' which are said to be acceptable, and even rewarded, are those of true believers, who have already been justified and 'accepted in the Beloved,'—that while believers are not now 'under the law' as a covenant of works, because it has been fulfilled by Christ as their substitute and surety, they are still 'under the law to Christ' as a rule of life,—that they are, and ever must be, the subjects of a moral government, even after they have been brought into His kingdom,— that while He promises to reward their obedience, and to relieve them entirely from the punishment due to them on account of sin, He still says even to His redeemed people, 'As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous, therefore, and repent,'—that the 'rewards of grace,' which are peculiar to the Gospel, are expressly contrasted with the 'rewards of debt,' which belong only to the Law, —and that the same afflictions which, in the case of the unbelieving and impenitent, are properly penal inflictions, embittered by the wrath of God, are converted, in the case of His children, into paternal chastisements, and even classed among their chartered privileges, while they are sweetened by a Father's love;—let us give due weight to these considerations, and we shall see at once, that their free Justification by grace through faith only is not inconsistent, either with their being governed now according to law, or with their being judged hereafter according to works. (5) This will become more evident if we her consider, how Good Works stand related to Faith, and to Justification, respectively. They are the effects of faith, and, as such, the evidences both of faith, and of justification. That they are the effects of faith is clear; for 'whatsoever is not of faith is sin;' and 'without faith it is impossible to please God;' and 'the end of the commandment is charity, out of a pure heart, and of a good conscience, and of faith unfeigned.'
You 'faith-aloners err greatly when you make our faith the source of our works. It is the heart born of the Spirit that is the source of both our faith and our works. It is by grace alone that God equips His children with such a heart that has the law written upon it, that hungers after righteousness.
No one denies that.
KenH
Well-Known Member
The faith of the elect is not the source of their good works. It is not the new heart of the elect that is the source of good works. The source of the good works of the elect is God who ordains all things.
Ephesians 2:10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.
Philippians 2:3 for it is God who works in you both to will and to do for His good pleasure.
(emphasis mine)
KenH
Well-Known Member
Reprobates will be judged. The elect have already been judged and cleared of guilt in Christ Jesus.
Furthermore, to those who pant after rewards - what more of a reward should a Christian desire than Christ Himself? Is Christ not enough for you? If not, why not? What more do you want? This obsesssion with working for rewards is a merit-based system. It is a form of neonomianism. Forget such nonsense. You can never make God a debtor to you, to owe you something because of something you do. The Israelites couldn't accomplish that feat through the Law, the Gentiles couldn't accomplish that feat without the Law, and no one is going accomplish that feat through some new, easier to keep Law, regardless of what people such as Robert Baxter taught.
Yes, with many of the good things Richard Baxter did teach,he had a tendancy to set up a bit of a legal standard for sanctification which people caution about.
That being said, i personally benefit from him in that he suggests many areas to examine, some that might not have crossed my mind.
Thinking of the table of contents of The Christian Directory.lol.
KenH
Well-Known Member
People tend to not be satisfied with Christ as the sanctification of His people.
1 Corinthians 1:30-31 But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God—and righteousness and sanctification and redemption—that, as it is written, “He who glories, let him glory in the Lord.”
Legalists, who insist on some form of law keeping even after Christ fulfilled the Law for His people, are like the Jews that the apostle Paul wrote about:
Romans 10:3 For they being ignorant of God’s righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God.
DaveXR650
Well-Known Member
This statement is true. While salvation is all of grace the fact is that most people will live on this earth for a time after becoming Christians. For them, it is an absolute truth that good works will inevitably follow. It is also true that there is a "justification" of believers before men, not to be confused with the justification of our salvation, where men can see a changed life in Christians and observe our good works. If that is not observed, there is every reason to doubt a person's salvation. I heard that Baxter noticed while in the army as a chaplain that many of the soldiers claimed to be Christians yet showed no tendency to act like Christians. He was concerned about this and went off in a wrong direction trying to help these folks.
KenH
Well-Known Member
Where does that kind of thinking leave those of us who, before God regenerated us, were not living an immoral life, or a life of violence, or a life of drug addiction, or a life of porn addiction, etc., etc., etc.? Some of us, even before being saved by God's sovereign grace, were already spending time in the Bible(even though God had not opened our eyes to the gospel), already spending time in prayer, etc. None of that was salvific or had any merit in it. And there is nothing after being saved that makes God a debtor to any of the elect or earns anything that the elect can require at God's hand.
False religion starts with I, continues with I, and finishes with I.
The gospel starts with Christ, continues with Christ, and finishes with Christ.
Begone with these ideas of human "proofs" of salvation. Christ is "The LORD my Righteousness". Period. I have nothing to point to as "proof" that I am saved, as even my very "best" actions are nothing but filthy rags. God gets all of the glory, there is none due to such a worm as me. Whatever "work" that God has ordained for me to do to His glory is still tainted by this dirty, rotten flesh that my soul still inhabits.
Isaiah 64:6 But we are all like an unclean thing, And all our righteousnesses are like filthy rags; We all fade as a leaf, And our iniquities, like the wind, Have taken us away.
The standard is not "sincere effort" but "perfect righteousness".
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DaveXR650
Well-Known Member
Ken I realize there is a difference here among Calvinists even. I'm sure you've heard the saying of the reformers that although you are saved by faith alone it is never a faith that is alone. The idea that works will always accompany true faith is sound teaching and there are calls also to examine yourself and look for works and Christian virtues in your life - and if they are not found in some measure you are not a Christian. That is not to say that there is anything after being saved that makes God your debtor - that is something you brought in, not me. A lot of confusion I think occurs when we forget that although God elects who will be saved and is sovereign He still interacts with us as rational beings in real time. We are allowed to listen, evaluate scripture warnings, examine ourselves and actively believe. Don't ever be afraid to actively follow Christ, attempt to do good to those around us, pursue holiness, and love God's law. That is not legalistic.
While we are not to set up a legal standard for a form of self righteousness...as believers we are not lawless.romans13:8-10