1. Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Featured Why Are Calvinists So Mean? - JARED C. WILSON

Discussion in 'Calvinism & Arminianism Debate' started by Revmitchell, Apr 21, 2022.

  1. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
    Galatians 5:22-23

    The stereotype of the mean Calvinist exists for a reason. There’s a reason, after all, that clichés become clichés. If you spend any time in evangelical social media or have a more traveled experience in evangelical churches, you’ve been on the receiving end of a mean Calvinist before. If you’re like me, you’ve wondered at some point, “Why do those who subscribe to the doctrines of grace frequently seem so graceless? Is there something in particular about Calvinism that makes people mean?”

    To that latter question, many have said yes. They do believe the essential tenets of Reformed theology lend themselves to coldness and harshness. I don’t think that’s true. And of course you may say that’s because I’m a Calvinist! And I am, so you may be right. But I’ve known far too many gracious, kind, Spirit-filled Calvinists to think there’s something in the doctrines that necessitates meanness. But there may be something in the culture or the application that lends itself more readily to unkind treatment of others. Below some thoughts on why too many Calvinists seem so mean. But first, some caveats*:

    1. I know Calvinism refers to a broader system of historically Reformed theology, but I am using it here in the modern shorthand way of referring to anybody who subscribes to Reformed soteriology. And as I confirmed a moment ago, I put myself in that camp. So if you’re tempted to think I’m just into this for Calvinist bashing, please understand that these calls are coming from inside the house. In fact, I have been either guilty of or tempted to each of the problems listed below myself. All of us who own the label ought to own the baggage and watch ourselves.

    2. I am differentiating mean Calvinism from “cage stage” Calvinism. If you’re not familiar with that phrase, “cage stage” refers to those who are new to Calvinism and so zealous/passionate about their new knowledge they ought to be locked in a cage for a while until they settle down, lest they hurt somebody. A lot of people emerge from the cage stage. The mean Calvinists I’m referring to are the ones who’ve been Calvinist long enough to have outgrown the cage stage. (Also, I’m of the opinion that most people who are new subscribers to any theology tend to go through similar cage stages. I’ve met plenty of social justice cage-stagers and anti-social justice cage-stagers, “progressive evangelicalism” cage-stagers, and so on. You probably have too. In fact, some of the meanest people I’ve known in church life and online have been angry about my Calvinism.)

    With the hem and the haw out of the way, here are some theories on where mean Calvinism comes from:



    Why Are Calvinists So Mean?
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
  2. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Calvinism as Gnosis
    This has been my leading theory on the reason for mean Calvinism for a while. The doctrines of grace serve for so many as a kind of “special knowledge” of the Scriptures that others don’t have—or at least, that the Calvinist didn’t have before he was a Calvinist. Now truth has been unlocked. He sees something others don’t. He’s been enlightened. He understands more deeply. And those who’ve come to Calvinism from ignorance of it or even opposition to it, begin to see how much sense it makes of so much Scripture. It’s like putting corrective lenses on for the first time.

    Unfortunately, having this experience can be a huge temptation to pride, where the one now enlightened sees other Christians as un-enlightened. And that’s just a tiny half-step to seeing them as not as spiritual as we are or not as serious about their faith as we are. The “gnosis” of Calvinism leads to a behavioral heresy of arrogance and partiality. And in the end, those who’ve been “enlightened” start to see themselves as smarter than others or more diligent in the Bible than others, which means they inadvertently begin seeing the knowledge of grace as something they’ve earned or achieved, which is antithetical to grace itself.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Calvinism as Circumcision
    This is a common source of mean Calvinism among those who’ve grown up in historically Reformed traditions, but it is not uncommon among those who wear their Reformed bona fides as a central marker of their identity and community. We all use our theological and philosophical labels to help people know where we’re coming from and identify others with whom we may share affinity, but for too many Calvinists one’s viewpoint on or degree of adherence to Calvinism becomes the way they determine who’s “in” and who’s “out.”

    Some have so found their identity in Calvinist community that it begins to inform their sense of evangelical or covenantal inclusion. Calvinism becomes their “righteousness.” Which means of course that those who don’t share it—or who don’t share their seriousness about it—are treated like outsiders to or corrupters of the faith. I’ve known more than a few folks raised in Reformed traditions for whom a major identity marker of their upbringing was deeming Christians from non-Reformed traditions as less faithful, less intelligent, less serious, less whatever. Like the Judaizers of Paul’s day with circumcision, they have added something to the gospel to make grace-plus the sign of true salvation. In fact, it is dangerously possible that many of the worst revilers and repeat offenders online treat Calvinism as their (self-)righteousness precisely because they are not regenerate and do not have Christ’s imputed or imparted to them. Keep a close watch on your life, as well as your doctrine (1 Tim. 4:16); make sure you don’t treat Calvinism as the marks of who’s really a Christian. The biblical tests for salvation place greater emphasis on love and Christlike character than they do secondary or tertiary doctrines.
     
  4. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Calvinism as Crusade
    This is a common approach of those who did not grow up in Reformed traditions but came to Reformed theology later in their discipleship. For many of them, they have a newfound resentment of their upbringing to go along with their newfound doctrine. They may feel cheated by those in their church background, that Calvinism was hidden from them or stolen from their experience. This bitterness about what was lacking in their past then fuels a sense of injustice in wanting to right those wrongs. “Everyone must know!” So one’s Christian life becomes about wearing Calvinism on the shirt sleeves, preaching the “gospel” of Calvinistic freedom to those in bondage to their ignorance.

    The Calvinistic crusader tends to favor Calvinistic watchblogs and watchdogs, online “discernment ministries” of the Reformed persuasion, and other pugilistic types who picture themselves as walking in the steps of Martin Luther. They’ve come to fix the church. And that means treating those who don’t get with the Reformed program as impediments to the mission and even to the faith. The crusading Calvinist will bulldoze whoever’s necessary to “save” others from the ignorance he himself swam in for too long. He therefore becomes the Glengarry Glenn Ross of the Reformation, barking to himself and to his squad, “Always. Be. Calvinizing.” These guys are absolutely no fun at parties that involve people who aren’t like them.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Calvinism as Compartmentalization
    This is a more general theory of one thing inherent to Calvinism philosophically and historically that might lend itself to the temptation toward meanness with others. It basically goes like this: Because Reformed theology is an articulate theology long presented in a rich system of doctrine, the people who resonate with it and who are drawn to it tend to be more systematic-type thinkers, those who appreciate order, categories, and so on. This is, no doubt, a good thing. But sometimes when we love order, systems, and categories, we don’t know what to do with Christians and Christian experiences that don’t fit neatly into these compartments.

    If we generally like orderliness, we may struggle with so much of the inefficiency of the Christian life in general. Discipleship is a messy process because people are sinners, and besides that, people are also messy, and the world is broken. If we love our systems more than people or we only want to deal with people who see the world same as we do or who otherwise fit into our comfortable categories, we’ve turned our Calvinism into a way to compartmentalize our experience rather than as a window through which to see the glory of Christ in his purposes with all people and things.

    Calvinism, rightly adhered to, is meant to stir our affections for Christ, not our disdain for our brethren. And if we are frequently charged with treating others in uncharitable ways, the humility necessary to the doctrine ought to produce a humility in its doctrinaires to ask if our lives actually contradict the doctrine we preach with our mouths.

    Little children, let us not love in word or talk but in deed and in truth.
    1 John 3:18
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  6. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    21,242
    Likes Received:
    2,305
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    RM,
    Good post and article.
    He is offerng solid thoughts and a fair caution.
    Thanks for posting it.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    9,905
    Likes Received:
    1,820
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Why are anti-calvinists so mean? It's on both sides.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Winner Winner x 1
  8. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Ok start your own thread
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  9. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    It is not just cage stage Calvinists who act ungodly to other people. Some (even some who call themselves pastors) are perhaps even more unkind:

     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. Reformed1689

    Reformed1689 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2019
    Messages:
    9,905
    Likes Received:
    1,820
    Faith:
    Baptist
    No need, my point is that it's not unique to Calvinism so the article really doesn't have a point as far as that goes.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    21,242
    Likes Received:
    2,305
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    Revmitchell,

    Calvinism as Gnosis

    Here he is on the right track.
    Understanding grace and mercy and beginning to acquire knowledge of truth is quite special.


    The example of the corrective lenses is very helpful for most people.
    If you are only around lukewarm or doctrinally weak churches who never go beyond shallow teaching and sermonettes, you find it does not match what you are seeing in scripture so you get perplexed.
    If what you are reading is true and accurate, why is the church you are in, not seeming to live accordingly.


    Your church only offers sermonettes and holds back on solid teaching of any depth.
    I was in such a church for a couple of years.

    I heard a sermon on the radio that changed my outlook.
    I sent for a tape catalog,one sermon was stronger than the next.
    Eventually My wife and I went to week long family conferences.
    We heard some of the best preaching on the planet. Once you hear real preaching and teaching you can not really settle for anything less.

     
    • Winner Winner x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • Prayers Prayers x 1
  12. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    21,242
    Likes Received:
    2,305
    Faith:
    Non Baptist Christian
    what happened to posts 7 and 8?
     
  13. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2006
    Messages:
    52,030
    Likes Received:
    3,657
    Faith:
    Baptist
    well it was written by someone who is reformed and posted on the Gospel Coalition website which is a reformed source so based on its source it takes on a different value
     
  14. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    James White made similar observations. So did RC Sproul.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. 5 point Gillinist

    5 point Gillinist Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2022
    Messages:
    465
    Likes Received:
    130
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Unfortunately, it seems to be in every circle - a testament to our own sinful pride and need for the daily cleansing from sin that Christ provides us.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  16. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    20,518
    Likes Received:
    3,047
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Self-unaware of their own 'meanness', looking only at others.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Useful Useful x 1
  17. DaveXR650

    DaveXR650 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2021
    Messages:
    2,912
    Likes Received:
    344
    Faith:
    Baptist
    I notice that the Gospel Coalition, like them or not, tend to be on the edge of "what's happenin' now". When they sense a change coming they begin by systematically deconstructing what was previous and then explaining to all of us how we need to change - usually by buying some book. New Calvinism has been destroyed as a movement by the wokeness and the political mission that some of the leaders had - to split up the Christian conservative vote. Also, Tim Keller, one of the founders is old and gravely ill, and Piper is retired and old and his church is mixed up in a woke war of some kind. I say this in response to your post, Rev, not in any way to disagree but just to point out that there is indeed significance in the pattern of articles you see, but maybe from a different direction. I think the Gospel Coalition is ready to move on into something beyond a focus on Calvinism. Just my opinion.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  18. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Yes. We all have an appetite to be mean. We have to pick up that cross daily and crucify that "old man" in us.

    The OP just seems like the post calling the kettle black.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
    Site Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2014
    Messages:
    13,895
    Likes Received:
    2,498
    Faith:
    Baptist
    Good article. I think that Calvinists and Cage state Calvinists should be separated when judging "how mean" Calvinism is. I am good friends with several Calvinists. They despise Cage state Calvinists, (though I never heard that term until I saw it on here.). They refer to them as young or new Calvinists. They will not talk to them or engage them, unless it's to basically tell them to hush and quit stirring up stuff.
    I think maturity, not doctrine, is the major issue.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  20. JonC

    JonC Moderator
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2001
    Messages:
    35,198
    Likes Received:
    3,791
    Faith:
    Baptist
    This is the major issue.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
Loading...