Conditional election.

[37818]

I believe in conditional election. One of the conditions being the election cannot be merited by any kind of work. The election must be received as a gift through faith.
2 Peter 1:10, ". . . give diligence to make your calling and election sure: . . ."

 

[Reformed1689]

I believe in conditional election. One of the conditions being the election cannot be merited by any kind of work. The election must be received as a gift through faith.
2 Peter 1:10, ". . . give diligence to make your calling and election sure: . . ."

So election based on works...

 

[tyndale1946]

I believe in conditional election. One of the conditions being the election cannot be merited by any kind of work. The election must be received as a gift through faith.
2 Peter 1:10, ". . . give diligence to make your calling and election sure: . . ."

I believe in conditional election also but as far as eternal matters are concerned, God alone sets the condition... Election is a sub category, if you read the verse before that you would understand what they were talking about, it has to do with discipleship not sonship... Here is eternal election!... Brother Glen

Romans 8:28 And we know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose.

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

I know its talking about the elect by what follows

Romans 33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

The election must be received as a gift through faith?... I agree but it's but not by your faith!... Who did God give?... His Son Jesus Christ who came willingly... It is by his Faith and not yours, you are saved... Give glory to God and quit patting yourself on the back.

 

[tyndale1946]

So election based on works...

It is based on works but on whose works?... Jesus Christ does the work that others are taking credit for... Jesus Christ alone sits on that throne... Brother Glen

Acts 13:40 Beware therefore, lest that come upon you, which is spoken of in the prophets;

41 Behold, ye despisers, and wonder, and perish: for I work a work in your days, a work which ye shall in no wise believe, though a man declare it unto you.

The prophet was Habakkuk

Habakkuk 1:5 Behold ye among the heathen, and regard, and wonder marvellously: for I will work a work in your days, which ye will not believe, though it be told you.

 

[AustinC]

I believe in conditional election.

Are these conditions (laws) God has created or you have created? Perhaps you can provide the various Bible passages where God tells us these are the laws he has created before a person can be elect.

I also take it that you believe election comes after God makes a decision during that persons lifetime, not before the foundation of the world.

One of the conditions being the election cannot be merited by any kind of work.

I don't see this as a condition, since I see election as being before the foundation of the world. Since it is before creation there can be no condition to it. It is simply God writing down who gets the inheritance as his adopted child.

"And not only so, but also when Rebekah had conceived children by one man, our forefather Isaac, though they were not yet born and had done nothing either good or bad—in order that God’s purpose of election might continue, not because of works but because of him who calls—"
~ Romans 9:10-11

The election must be received as a gift through faith.

You may be mixing up salvation with election. They are not the same thing.
Salvation is a gift that is confidently confirmed through the gift of faith.

2 Peter 1:10, ". . . give diligence to make your calling and election sure: . . ."

Here you are not understanding Peter's point.

*2 Peter 1:3-12*

His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence, by which he has granted to us his precious and very great promises, so that through them you may become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped from the corruption that is in the world because of sinful desire. For this very reason, make every effort to supplement your faith with virtue, and virtue with knowledge, and knowledge with self-control, and self-control with steadfastness, and steadfastness with godliness, and godliness with brotherly affection, and brotherly affection with love. For if these qualities are yours and are increasing, they keep you from being ineffective or unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. For whoever lacks these qualities is so nearsighted that he is blind, having forgotten that he was cleansed from his former sins. Therefore, brothers, be all the more diligent to confirm your calling and election, for if you practice these qualities you will never fall. For in this way there will be richly provided for you an entrance into the eternal kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. Therefore I intend always to remind you of these qualities, though you know them and are established in the truth that you have.

Do you see what Peter is saying about supplementing what God has already given? It's similar to God giving us a body, but we take vitamin supplements and exercise along with a moderate diet to make our bodies as healthy as possible. Here Peter is giving practical advice regarding the supplements we should take to grow our faith and confirm the election that God already secured when God granted us all things and all the promises.

It seems you are missing Peter's point.

 

[37818]

So election based on works...

You are irrational.

One of the conditions being the election cannot be merited by any kind of work.

 

[37818]

Are these conditions (laws) God has created or you have created? Perhaps you can provide the various Bible passages where God tells us these are the laws he has created before a person can be elect.

1 Peter 1:2, ". . . Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, . . ." God sets His conditions. I think you are being irrational. A reason why people are lost is stated in 2 Corinthians 4:3, " . . . if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: . . ."

 

[kyredneck]

A reason why people are lost is stated in 2 Corinthians 4:3, " . . . if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: . . ."

As usual, you chop the scriptures up into bits and pieces in order to reach your humanistic conclusions. Let's look at more than the fragment you're pointing to:

3 And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled in them that perish:
4 in whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of the unbelieving, that the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, should not dawn upon them.
5 For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus as Lord, and ourselves as your servants for Jesus` sake.
6 Seeing it is God, that said, Light shall shine out of darkness, who shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ. 2 Cor 4

 

[Brightfame52]

I believe in conditional election. One of the conditions being the election cannot be merited by any kind of work. The election must be received as a gift through faith.
2 Peter 1:10, ". . . give diligence to make your calling and election sure: . . ."

So are you saying faith is the condition for election ? If yes, whose faith ?

 

[37818]

So are you saying faith is the condition for election ? If yes, whose faith ?

John 3:18, ". . . He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. . . ."

 

[Brightfame52]

Election is conditional, Its conditioned on God having to chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world. Thats the only condition, everything unto Salvation flows out of that choice God made. So election is conditioned on Gods choice, before anyone existed to do any good or evil ! Rom 9:11

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)

If we condition election to salvation for any individual, to something done in time, and on something they did, we have a false view of election, its not of God.

 

[Brightfame52]

John 3:18, ". . . He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. . . ."

You never give a clear yes or no answer. But if you say election is conditioned on your faith, thats error my friend.

 

[37818]

If yes, whose faith?

You never give a clear yes or no answer. But if you say election is conditioned on your faith, thats error my friend.

2 Peter 1:5-10, ". . . giving all diligence, add to your faith . . . diligence to make your calling and election sure: . . ."

 

[AustinC]

1 Peter 1:2, ". . . Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, . . ." God sets His conditions.

What condition? God elected because the names of the elect were already written down. It seems you are desperately trying to split a hair that isn't split.

*1 Peter 1:1-2*

Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who are elect exiles of the Dispersion in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, in the sanctification of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ and for sprinkling with his blood: May grace and peace be multiplied to you.

I think you are being irrational. A reason why people are lost is stated in 2 Corinthians 4:3, " . . . if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: . . ."

Perhaps you might read the full letter before making a conclusion.

*2 Corinthians 4:1-6*

Therefore, having this ministry by the mercy of God, we do not lose heart. But we have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways. We refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God’s word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to everyone’s conscience in the sight of God. And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. For what we proclaim is not ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, with ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake. For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

If I were to accept your position in this text, I would "rationally" have to say that Satan is equal with God and can thwart God's will.

That would be an utterly irrational and insane thing to believe and it is certainly not what Paul is saying in this verse.

It seems you only want God to have foreknowledge but not determine the salvation of humans. Why do you want to make God less than who He is when He tells us He elected before any good or bad thing ever happened?

 

[37818]

What condition? God elected because the names of the elect were already written down. It seems you are desperately trying to split a hair that isn't split.

*1 Peter 1:1-2*

Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who are elect exiles of the Dispersion in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, in the sanctification of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ and for sprinkling with his blood: May grace and peace be multiplied to you.



Perhaps you might read the full letter before making a conclusion.

*2 Corinthians 4:1-6*

Therefore, having this ministry by the mercy of God, we do not lose heart. But we have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways. We refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God’s word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to everyone’s conscience in the sight of God. And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. For what we proclaim is not ourselves, but Jesus Christ as Lord, with ourselves as your servants for Jesus’ sake. For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” has shone in our hearts to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

If I were to accept your position in this text, I would "rationally" have to say that Satan is equal with God and can thwart God's will.

That would be an utterly irrational and insane thing to believe and it is certainly not what Paul is saying in this verse.

It seems you only want God to have foreknowledge but not determine the salvation of humans. Why do you want to make God less than who He is when He tells us He elected before any good or bad thing ever happened?

None of those passages says anything about "God elected because the names of the elect were already written down."
All you have done is argue your interpertation. Without any exegesis. Not helpful, even assuming you are correct.

Psalms 69:27-28, ". . . Add iniquity unto their iniquity: and let them not come into thy righteousness. Let them be blotted out of the book of the living, and not be written with the righteous. . . ."

 

[37818]

I also take it that you believe election comes after God makes a decision during that persons lifetime, not before the foundation of the world.

FYI. Not the election, but God's choosing His who will become His elect has taken place before the foundation of the world. Mark 13:20, Ephesians 1:4, 1 Peter 1:2.

 

[AustinC]

None of those passages says anything about "God elected because the names of the elect were already written down."
All you have done is argue your interpertation. Without any exegesis. Not helpful, even assuming you are correct.

Psalms 69:27-28, ". . . Add iniquity unto their iniquity: and let them not come into thy righteousness. Let them be blotted out of the book of the living, and not be written with the righteous. . . ."

The scripture for the names being already written is here:
*Hebrews 9:15-17*

Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance, since a death has occurred that redeems them from the transgressions committed under the first covenant. For where a will is involved, the death of the one who made it must be established. For a will takes effect only at death, since it is not in force as long as the one who made it is alive.

The writer tells us that a will (covenant) was already created. When Jesus died, the inheritance was given and all who are written into that will receive their inheritance.

This means the election is indeed before the foundation of the world. It means God foreknew precisely because God has already elected and chosen.

There is the exegesis. It's in the text exactly as the speaker to the Hebrews expressed it.

 

[AustinC]

FYI. Not the election, but God's choosing His who will become His elect has taken place before the foundation of the world. Mark 13:20, Ephesians 1:4, 1 Peter 1:2.

You keep attempting to split a hair that is not and never was split.
Election and choosing are synonyms.

God wrote my name in as an inheritor and he made it so. He elected and chose me.

It seems you are trying to make this much more complicated than it is.

 

[37818]

Election and choosing are synonyms.

The elect are plural. God's choosing is that singular event.

 

[AustinC]

The elect are plural. God's choosing is that singular event.

Every elect was chosen before the foundation of the world. The election and choosing are individual and happened at the same time. I truly don't see how you create a distinction that isn't there.