Revelation

[KenH]

Would you elaborate on verses 16 and 17 Acts 15? Who are these residue of men?

Acts 13:47-48 For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying,

I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles,
That thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.

48And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

 

[David Kent]

Can either you or Kyredneck answer my question?

Sorry. What was the question?

 

[percho]

Acts 13:47-48 For so hath the Lord commanded us, saying,

I have set thee to be a light of the Gentiles,
That thou shouldest be for salvation unto the ends of the earth.

48And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

Is Verse 8 describing the regeneration of, "the sheep," from both Jews and Gentiles? Is Verse 14 a re-statement of God taking from among the Gentiles, "the sheep" for regeneration?

Will there come a moment, "in time," when the last sheep is of, the first-fruit of the Spirit?

 

[kyredneck]

It's very simple-the prophesied events after the destruction of the temple simply haven't yet happened !

It's very simple, you're carnal. Just because it can't been seen with the mortal eye or touched with the hand doesn't mean it's not real or didn't happen.

Tell us who the beast & the false prophet were.

Can either you or Kyredneck answer my question?

Tell me the highways that John the Baptist straightened, or the valleys that he raised, or the mountains that he made level, and I'll give you my best shot.

 

[KenH]

Is Verse 8 describing the regeneration of, "the sheep," from both Jews and Gentiles? Is Verse 14 a re-statement of God taking from among the Gentiles, "the sheep" for regeneration?

Will there come a moment, "in time," when the last sheep is of, the first-fruit of the Spirit?

Throughout history and continuing to the second coming of Christ when He ushers in the new heavens and earth wherein dwells righteousness, God has been and is saving His elect among every kindred, tongue, people, and nation.

 

[David Kent]

Newp ! JW is a cult. I use the NKJV, NASV, & ESV. Now, please tell us when Jesus returned in the Manner He Himself said. Tell us who the beast & the false prophet were.
Preterism is phony as a Ponzi scheme.

I was watching a YouTube video recently where a number of Atheists were interviewed on their beliefs. At the end of the video they were each asked who the most famous atheist was? One woman said Sir Isaac Newton.

Sir Isaac Newton was a scientist, a mathematician, holding the chair of Mathematics at an English university, but an Atheist?

Let us see what this "Famous Atheist" wrote: He linked the little horn of Daniel 7 with the papacy, rising out of the ten kingdoms into which the Roman Empire fell. "But it was a kingdom of a different kind from the other 10 kingdoms.......Byits eyes it was a seer: and by its mouth speaking great things a d cha going laws, it was a prophet as well as a king, is the church of Rome." I

So I say, the Pope is the beast and his bishops are everyone his false prophet. The are seers in the "Holy See."

 

[percho]

Acts 15:8 and the heart-knowing God did bare them testimony, having given to them [Gentiles] the Holy Spirit, even as also to us [Jews},
Eph 1:13,14 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth -- the good news of your salvation -- in whom also having believed, ye [Jews and Gentiles] were sealed with the Holy Spirit of the promise, which is an earnest of our inheritance, to the redemption of the acquired possession, to the praise of His glory.

Is that inclusive of all sheep whether dead or alive whom God has called? What will having the Holy Spirit do for them?

Romans 8:11 and if the Spirit of Him who did raise up Jesus out of the dead doth dwell in you, He who did raise up the Christ out of the dead shall quicken also your dying bodies, through His Spirit dwelling in you.

When does that take place? Does the following speak of the same?

Does, shall quicken also your dying bodies, = And not only so, but also we ourselves, having the first-fruit of the Spirit, we also ourselves in ourselves do groan, adoption expecting -- the redemption of our body;

Luke 19:11-17 Now as they heard these things, He spoke another parable, because He was near Jerusalem and because they thought the kingdom of God would appear immediately. Therefore He said: “A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom and to return. “So he called ten of his servants, delivered to them ten minas,[fn] and said to them, ‘Do business till I come.’ “But his citizens hated him, and sent a delegation after him, saying, ‘We will not have this man to reign over us.’ “And so it was that when he returned, having received the kingdom, he then commanded these servants, to whom he had given the money, to be called to him, [From where?] [ But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope.
For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.[fn]
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.] that he might know how much every man had gained by trading. “Then came the first, saying, ‘Master, your mina has earned ten minas.’ “And he said to him, ‘Well done, good servant; because you were faithful in a very little, have authority over ten cities.’

Rule with him?

 

[David Kent]

Acts 15:8 and the heart-knowing God did bare them testimony, having given to them [Gentiles] the Holy Spirit, even as also to us [Jews},
Eph 1:13,14 in whom ye also, having heard the word of the truth -- the good news of your salvation -- in whom also having believed, ye [Jews and Gentiles] were sealed with the Holy Spirit of the promise, which is an earnest of our inheritance, to the redemption of the acquired possession, to the praise of His glory.

Is that inclusive of all sheep whether dead or alive whom God has called? What will having the Holy Spirit do for them?

Romans 8:11 and if the Spirit of Him who did raise up Jesus out of the dead doth dwell in you, He who did raise up the Christ out of the dead shall quicken also your dying bodies, through His Spirit dwelling in you.

When does that take place? Does the following speak of the same?

Does, shall quicken also your dying bodies, = And not only so, but also we ourselves, having the first-fruit of the Spirit, we also ourselves in ourselves do groan, adoption expecting -- the redemption of our body;

Luke 19:11-17 Now as they heard these things, He spoke another parable, because He was near Jerusalem and because they thought the kingdom of God would appear immediately. Therefore He said: “A certain nobleman went into a far country to receive for himself a kingdom and to return. “So he called ten of his servants, delivered to them ten minas,[fn] and said to them, ‘Do business till I come.’ “But his citizens hated him, and sent a delegation after him, saying, ‘We will not have this man to reign over us.’ “And so it was that when he returned, having received the kingdom, he then commanded these servants, to whom he had given the money, to be called to him, [From where?] [ But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope.
For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.[fn]
For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.] that he might know how much every man had gained by trading. “Then came the first, saying, ‘Master, your mina has earned ten minas.’ “And he said to him, ‘Well done, good servant; because you were faithful in a very little, have authority over ten cities.’

Rule with him?

The kingdom was taken from the Jews and given to another, believers in Christ as their Saviour. Their house was left desolate, Matthew 23:38, not one stone was left on another , Matthew 24:2, the armies did surround Jerusalem and its desolation came, Luke 21:20 and 21. Believers did flee the city when they saw those armies.

Jesus claimed his kingdom under Pilate, "My kingdom is not of this world." Jesus is king of his people, those who the father gave to him.

On a fundamentalist forum, I asked one person who had a great opinion on everything, if he was in Christ's Kingdom? He was like a politician evading a question saying a lot but not saying yes or no. I just responded each time by asking the same question, so in the end I said to him "I must take it then that you are not."

 

[robycop3]

Sorry. What was the question?

"Now, please tell us when Jesus returned in the Manner He Himself said."

 

[robycop3]

It's very simple, you're carnal. Just because it can't been seen with the mortal eye or touched with the hand doesn't mean it's not real or didn't happen.

Jesus said, "
23 “Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.

26 “Therefore if they say to you, ‘Look, He is in the desert!’ do not go out; or ‘Look, He is in the inner rooms!’ do not believe it. 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. 28 For wherever the carcass is, there the eagles will be gathered together.

29 “Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 Then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And He will send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. Matt. 24

Most of the things Jesus said before that literally came to pass, such as the destruction of J & the temple. Now, please explain why the event I cited isn't literal.



Tell me the highways that John the Baptist straightened, or the valleys that he raised, or the mountains that he made level, and I'll give you my best shot.

Sure ! He removed obstacles to believing Jesus is Messiah by proclaiming He was wherever he went, and by baptizing Him in front of many people. Use some common sense.Some biblical statements are plainly methphorical, while most are not. And the metaphorical one always stand for something physical.

 

[kyredneck]

Sure !

Please, straighten this gommed up mess you've made of this post so we can carry on. Back up and get it right.

 

[robycop3]

I was watching a YouTube video recently where a number of Atheists were interviewed on their beliefs. At the end of the video they were each asked who the most famous atheist was? One woman said Sir Isaac Newton.

Sir Isaac Newton was a scientist, a mathematician, holding the chair of Mathematics at an English university, but an Atheist?

Let us see what this "Famous Atheist" wrote: He linked the little horn of Daniel 7 with the papacy, rising out of the ten kingdoms into which the Roman Empire fell. "But it was a kingdom of a different kind from the other 10 kingdoms.......Byits eyes it was a seer: and by its mouth speaking great things a d cha going laws, it was a prophet as well as a king, is the church of Rome." I

So I say, the Pope is the beast and his bishops are everyone his false prophet. The are seers in the "Holy See."

MMRRPP ! WRONG !

Newton was certainly not an atheist, altho he had several wrong religious doctrines, such as denying the Holy trinity & that the pope is the beast.

Why is that view wrong ? First, Scripture says he will be A MAN, not "men". Second , he will rule the world & no one can overthrow him. Third, Scripture mentions "THE" false prophet, not bishops or plural prophets. While there are, have been, & will be many FPs, this one will be the beast's second-in-command, & will institute the mark of the beast at his boss' command. The popes were at their modt powerful just prior to the reign of Henry VIII. A later pope was conquered & imprisoned by Napoleon, while the REAL beast will be overthrown by Jesus at His return.

 

[robycop3]

Please, straightened this gommed up mess you've made of this post so we can carry on. Back up and get it right.

Nothing's more-right than SCRIPTURE.

 

[percho]

The kingdom was taken from the Jews and given to another, believers in Christ as their Saviour. Their house was left desolate, Matthew 23:38, not one stone was left on another , Matthew 24:2, the armies did surround Jerusalem and its desolation came, Luke 21:20 and 21. Believers did flee the city when they saw those armies.

Jesus claimed his kingdom under Pilate, "My kingdom is not of this world." Jesus is king of his people, those who the father gave to him.

On a fundamentalist forum, I asked one person who had a great opinion on everything, if he was in Christ's Kingdom? He was like a politician evading a question saying a lot but not saying yes or no. I just responded each time by asking the same question, so in the end I said to him "I must take it then that you are not."

IMHO We have not yet inherited the kingdom of God and his Christ.

Matt 25:31-34 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy[fn] angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. “All the nations will be gathered [?Nations where?] before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. “And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. “Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

What are your thoughts as to the difference of being, "in," as to, "inheriting"?

Is it relative to the following?
For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly wait for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform [Future Active Indicative - 3rd Person Singular] our lowly body that it may be conformed to His glorious body, according to the working by which He is able even to subdue all things to Himself.

 

[tyndale1946]

Please, straighten this gommed up mess you've made of this post so we can carry on. Back up and get it right.

I doubt if that is going to happen because we know how robycop is, and sorry to say to the OP his post has been derailed... I suggest that we have a private conversation on the subject of Revelation and invite who we want, and if you would like to join the conversation, without you know who, tells us you would like to be invited... This is nothing new there are private conversations going on all the time... Just a suggestion, I will keep watching but for now... I'm out... Brother Glen

 

[percho]

IMHO We have not yet inherited the kingdom of God and his Christ.

Matt 25:31-34 “When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy[fn] angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. “All the nations will be gathered [?Nations where?] before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. “And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. “Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

What are your thoughts as to the difference of being, "in," as to, "inheriting"?

Is it relative to the following?
For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly wait for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform [Future Active Indicative - 3rd Person Singular] our lowly body that it may be conformed to His glorious body, according to the working by which He is able even to subdue all things to Himself.

A couple of thoughts relative to the above.

Is the following the same concept?
1 John 3:1-3 Behold what manner of love the Father has bestowed on us, that we should be called children of God![fn] Therefore the world does not know us,[fn] because it did not know Him. Beloved, now we are children of God; and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure.

Now a question relative to the follow word in bold.
V 3 And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure.

Here is what Romans 8 says relative to, "hope," we were saved unto.
V's 24,25 YLT for in [to, dative] hope we were saved, and hope beheld is not hope; for what any one doth behold, why also doth he hope for it? and if what we do not behold we hope for, through continuance we expect it.

I assume that, to hope, is relative to the redemption of the body of V 23.

Is that the same hope of 1 John 3:3?

 

[kyredneck]

we know how robycop is, and sorry to say to the OP his post has been derailed...

As usual, he's here to stir the pot, and to show his bigotry and contempt for the views that reject the narrow-minded fantastical sensationalism that he's addicted to.

 

[tyndale1946]

As usual, he's here to stir the pot, and to show his bigotry and contempt for the views that reject the fantastical sensationalism that he's addicted to.

I agree and what do you think of my suggestion?.... We can have a civil discussion there and not one person trying to bring down the curtain... The conversation is not dead... In imho It just needs to be moved... Brother Glen

 

[David Kent]

MMRRPP ! WRONG !

Newton was certainly not an atheist, altho he had several wrong religious doctrines, such as denying the Holy trinity & that the pope is the beast.

Why is that view wrong ? First, Scripture says he will be A MAN, not "men". Second , he will rule the world & no one can overthrow him. Third, Scripture mentions "THE" false prophet, not bishops or plural prophets. While there are, have been, & will be many FPs, this one will be the beast's second-in-command, & will institute the mark of the beast at his boss' command. The popes were at their modt powerful just prior to the reign of Henry VIII. A later pope was conquered & imprisoned by Napoleon, while the REAL beast will be overthrown by Jesus at His return.

Wrong, Newton was a much wiser man than you or I. Believing in the trinity or not is not a Salvtion issue. If it was no one for 300 years or so would be saved, before a council introduced it. The historian Mosheim said they probably did the church a disservice as before that there was nothing to argue about.

If we go back to the early church, we see they taught that in 2 Thessalonians 2, the let and Hindrance to be taken out ov the way was the Emperor and the Empire, it would be succeeded by 10 kings , and from these 10 Antichrist will come. Paul said "Remember when I was with you I told you these things. Fulfilled.
They thought that the man of sin would then come for 3½ years then the end of all things. But they couldn't see the long ages of ther Antichrist rule. We see that the diadems are on the heads at one time signifying the the 7th head, and another time on the horns, the divided state.

The man of sin, the beast, was the 8th. Head. The beast that was and is not but is to come. For a short time after Constantine took the Let away, there was no emperor in Rome. Then the Empire was divided after Justinian abdicated in favour of the Gothic kings, and gave their allegiance to the bishop of Rome. The beast that was and is not and yet is. The seventh head were the Emperors who wore diadems rather than crowns.

The seven heads were the seven types of rulers beginning with Kings such as Romulus. The eighth, is a dynasty, we talk of a king, an emperor, a pope. They are all dynasties. The beast that was and is not now is. It is continuation of the empire. If you look at Daniel 2 and Daniel 7 you will see that the 4th king(dom) and the 4th terrible beast last till the Lord comes. It has just changed . The Pope has more power than the Emperors ever had. He rules over more than a million who worship him. All Catholics are subjects of Rome first and their nation second.

The Pope was recognised by various people as Antichrist from about 1160 when the Waldensians published their Treatise on Antichrist. Non Catholics followed that historic teaching from that time till Edward Irving adopted the Jesuit futurist view which had been confined to Catholics for just over 200 years.

The reason they did that was because the true teaching was doing so much harm go the RCC. 1825 in fact. Why did the Jesuits do that, when the pope had banned and burnt bibles until they became widely available then he banned Catholics from reading Revelation.

 

[kyredneck]

I suggest that we have a private conversation on the subject of Revelation and invite who we want

I'm game! Do it!

Suggest we take requests from those interested to be included (except for the bigots).