Is It Nothing to You?

[Silverhair]

The entire Bible is ALL about CHRIST and His work of salvation as the Surety for God's elect given to Him before the world began.

Ancient Israel served two purposes - to show that fallen man cannot be keep the law perfectly and be saved in doing so, and to be the means whereby God brought His Son into the world in a flawless human body in which He would keep the law perfectly, establish a perfect righteousness to be imputed to God's elect, and die for all of the sins(which were imputed to Him) of those given to Him to be their Surety before the world began.

And after 40 years of transition, ancient Israel came to an end in 70 A.D. Period. That country called Israel that exists today is not the same as ancient Israel in the Bible, except in name only.

For further reading, an article entitled, "MOSES OR CHRIST? Paul’s Reply to Dispensational Error" By Charles D. Alexander, can be found here:

Microsoft Word - MOSES OR CHRIST _C. D. Alexander_.docx (wsimg.com)

You start of on the wrong foot what you make the claim that the "elect" were given to Christ before the world began. That idea is based on a poor understanding of Eph 1:4.

The text simply states {Eph_1:1} “the faithful in Christ” and {Eph_1:3-6} teaches that it was God’s plan from eternity past to adopt all who believe in Jesus as His heirs so that we "should be holy and without blame before"
Note that the text does not say that we were chosen “to be” in Him (Christ), but rather that we were chosen “in Him.” Jesus Christ is the primary elect one, {Isa_42:1} "My Elect One in whom My soul delights!" and believers are chosen, or elect, because of our connection with Jesus. If one is not in Christ through faith, which only happens in time, then they are not part of the "elect".

 

[JD731]

"This signifies the set time of love and life to every particular soul at conversion; which is a day for light, and a day of power; when the exceeding greatness of the power of God is put forth in the regeneration of them: and the people that were given to Christ by his Father, in the covenant of grace, and who, while in a state of nature, are rebellious and unwilling, are made willing to be saved by Christ, and him only; to serve him in every religious duty and ordinance; to part with their sins and sinful companions, and with their own righteousness; to suffer the loss of all things for him; to deny themselves, and take up the cross and follow him: and when they become freewill offerings to him, as the word signifies; not only willingly offer up their spiritual sacrifices of prayer and praise, but themselves, souls and bodies, to him; as well as enter volunteers into his service, and cheerfully fight his battles, under him, the Captain of their salvation; being assured of victory, and certain of the crown of life and glory, when they have fought the good fight, and finished their course."

- excerpt from John Gill's Bible commentary on Psalms 110:3


Numberless beauties appear, in this verse, like the constellations of the heavenly borders, to call upon our notice. First, the promise made concerning the people of Christ. Here we find that Christ had a people, a church, a seed, an offspring, before his incarnation: and hence, not only at his birth, but even before his conception, his name was called Jesus, because he should save his people from their sins. Matthew 1:21; Psalms 89:3-4; Isaiah 44:3; Isaiah 59:21. Secondly, God the Father promiseth that this people shall be a willing people; a people of willingness, as it might be rendered; volunteers, listing under Christ's banner. When Jesus is set up as an ensign to the nations, the Gentiles shall seek to it, and his rest shall be glorious, Isaiah 11:10. ... Thirdly, God's promise is, that all these blessings shall take place in the day of Christ's power. The sovereignty of grace, and the influence of his Spirit, which accompanieth his word, shall make it effectual; so that it shall not return void, but like the rain and the snow, which cometh down from heaven, shall give gracious influences; Isaiah 55:10-11. And it is beautiful to remark how variously this day of Christ's power is spoken of in scripture, so as to point out the blessed properties of it: A day of espousals of the soul to Christ, Song of Solomon 3:11. A day of salvation, 2 Corinthians 6:2; hence when Christ made the publican Zaccheus willing in the day of his power, he said, This day is salvation come to this house; Luke 19:9; and a day of the Lord's making and marvellous in our eyes, Psalms 118:24.

- excerpt from Robert Hawker's The Poor Man's Commentary on Psalms 110:3

These men are not Biblicists, they are philosophers and you are not wise to follow them. Much of what they say is manufactured, with the emphasis on man.

 

[JD731]

The entire Bible is ALL about CHRIST and His work of salvation as the Surety for God's elect given to Him before the world began.

Ancient Israel served two purposes - to show that fallen man cannot be keep the law perfectly and be saved in doing so, and to be the means whereby God brought His Son into the world in a flawless human body in which He would keep the law perfectly, establish a perfect righteousness to be imputed to God's elect, and die for all of the sins(which were imputed to Him) of those given to Him to be their Surety before the world began.

And after 40 years of transition, ancient Israel came to an end in 70 A.D. Period. That country called Israel that exists today is not the same as ancient Israel in the Bible, except in name only.

For further reading, an article entitled, "MOSES OR CHRIST? Paul’s Reply to Dispensational Error" By Charles D. Alexander, can be found here:

Microsoft Word - MOSES OR CHRIST _C. D. Alexander_.docx (wsimg.com)

That which I have underlined is a denial of the Abrahamic Covenant, which is eternal, and is THE explanation of all that God is doing in the world today. This is the reason Calvinism is so dangerous and Christians will be guilty for not calling them out.

 

[37818]

What point are you trying make with this list?

The NKJV translates the phrase various ways
Act_12:5 to G4314 God G2316
Act_24:16 toward G4314 God G2316
Rom_4:2 before G4314 God G2316
Heb_2:17 in things pertaining to G4314 God G2316

and even
Rev_13:6 against G4314 God G2316

The point. Is that short phrase is used with someone other than God in relation to God.

 

[KenH]

with the emphasis on man

Their emphasis is on Christ, which is the emphasis of the Bible from Genesis through Revelation.

 

[kyredneck]

the Abrahamic Covenant, which is eternal

Cite scripture please.

 

[KenH]

That which I have underlined is a denial of the Abrahamic Covenant

No, it is not.

Romans 2:28-29 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Galatians 3:7-9 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed. So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

Galatians 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

 

[Silverhair]

The point. Is that short phrase is used with someone other than God in relation to God.

OK but what is your point when you say this. Cryptic sentences do not advance a discussion. You made the list in rersponse to what MrW had posted

Are you saying what he posted in regard to hypostatic union is in error?

 

[Silverhair]

Cite scripture please.

Would this do KY?

Gen 15:18 On the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying: "To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates

Do you think God would break a covenant?

 

[Silverhair]

No, it is not.

Romans 2:28-29 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh: but he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

Galatians 3:7-9 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed. So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

Galatians 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

@KenH you wrote "That country called Israel that exists today is not the same as ancient Israel in the Bible, except in name only." So the question is what about the covenant that God made with Abram? Does God break His covenants?

Gen 15:18 On the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying: "To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates;

Do you think this refers to his physical or spiritual descendants and upon what do you base your view?

 

[JD731]

Cite scripture please.

Being honest, have you ever read the covenant promises God made to Abraham? If your answer is yes then would you be pleased if God showed the same degree of faithfulness to promises you think he has made to you as he has to Abraham?
I am going to assume that you believe in the resurrection of the redeemed and eternal life and can understand that any unfulfilled promises God made to Abraham were not nullified at his dying. How can you justify God making promises to Abraham that he never had intentions of keeping even after he declared in Hebrews 6 that his Abrahamic Covenant is immutable, meaning it cannot be changed?

Here are a couple of things that are recorded in the scriptures. Whether you choose to believe them is up to you.


Mark 12:26-27
26 And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.


Jeremiah 31:33-36
33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.
35 Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name:
36 If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.

Admit it, you do not believe this unambiguous prophecy from the pen of Jeremiah as it is written.

 

[kyredneck]

the Abrahamic Covenant, which is eternal

Cite scripture please.

Would this do KY?

Gen 15:18 On the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying: "To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates

Nope. Won't do.

 

[kyredneck]

Do you think God would break a covenant?

Nope. Never. My Bible says there are no unfulfilled promises to the physical descendants of Abraham.

25 And Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen, that he bestowed in the chariot cities, and with the king at Jerusalem.
26 And he ruled over all the kings from the River even unto the land of the Philistines, and to the border of Egypt. 2 Chron 9

43 So Jehovah gave unto Israel all the land which he sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein.
44 And Jehovah gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; Jehovah delivered all their enemies into their hand.
45 There failed not aught of any good thing which Jehovah had spoken unto the house of Israel; all came to pass. Josh 21

And, behold, this day I am going the way of all the earth: and ye know in all your hearts and in all your souls, that not one thing hath failed of all the good things which Jehovah your God spake concerning you; all are come to pass unto you, not one thing hath failed thereof. Josh 23:14

Blessed be Jehovah, that hath given rest unto his people Israel, according to all that he promised: there hath not failed one word of all his good promise, which he promised by Moses his servant. 1 Ki 8:56

For how many soever be the promises of God, in him is the yea: wherefore also through him is the Amen, unto the glory of God through us. 2 Cor 1:20

 

[kyredneck]

if God showed the same degree of faithfulness to promises

unfulfilled promises God made to Abraham

See post #73,

 

[kyredneck]

@KenH you wrote "That country called Israel that exists today is not the same as ancient Israel in the Bible, except in name only." So the question is what about the covenant that God made with Abram? Does God break His covenants?

Gen 15:18 On the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying: "To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates;

Do you think this refers to his physical or spiritual descendants and upon what do you base your view?

See post #73

 

[JD731]

See post #73,

I asked you if you have ever read the Abrahamic covenant and you did not answer the question. If you believe and are trying to persuade anyone that the verses you quoted is either the Abrahamic Covenant itself or the fulfillment thereof, then you are admitting you know nothing about the covenant. The Abrahamic Covenant is found in 3 passages in Genesis beginning in chapter 12 and is very specific and detailed concerning it's promises concerning a family, a nation and the land. It requires nothing of Abraham and is fully dependent upon the faithfulness of God to keep all that is promised. This makes it an unconditional covenant.

Everything that falls within the purview of the providence of God is his determination to keep this covenant with Abraham. If he does not keep this covenant in every point you can be sure that you will never be saved. He has sworn by himself to keep it and he could sware by no greater.

Many years after Solomon he said this;

He 6:13 For when God made promise to Abraham, because he could swear by no greater, he sware by himself,
14 Saying, Surely blessing I will bless thee, and multiplying I will multiply thee.
15 And so, after he had patiently endured, he obtained the promise.
16 For men verily swear by the greater: and an oath for confirmation is to them an end of all strife.
17 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath:
18 That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us:

The Abrahamic Covenant has 12 separate promises concerning Abraham and his family.

 

[kyredneck]

I asked you if you have ever read the Abrahamic covenant and you did not answer the question. If you believe and are trying to persuade anyone that the verses you quoted is either the Abrahamic Covenant itself or the fulfillment thereof, then you are admitting you know nothing about the covenant. The Abrahamic Covenant is found in 3 passages in Genesis beginning in chapter 12 and is very specific and detailed concerning it's promises concerning a family, a nation and the land. It requires nothing of Abraham and is fully dependent upon the faithfulness of God to keep all that is promised. This makes it an unconditional covenant.

Post #73 shows "the faithfulness of God to keep all that is promised".

 

[Silverhair]

Nope. Never. My Bible says there are no unfulfilled promises to the physical descendants of Abraham.

25 And Solomon had four thousand stalls for horses and chariots, and twelve thousand horsemen, that he bestowed in the chariot cities, and with the king at Jerusalem.
26 And he ruled over all the kings from the River even unto the land of the Philistines, and to the border of Egypt. 2 Chron 9

43 So Jehovah gave unto Israel all the land which he sware to give unto their fathers; and they possessed it, and dwelt therein.
44 And Jehovah gave them rest round about, according to all that he sware unto their fathers: and there stood not a man of all their enemies before them; Jehovah delivered all their enemies into their hand.
45 There failed not aught of any good thing which Jehovah had spoken unto the house of Israel; all came to pass. Josh 21

And, behold, this day I am going the way of all the earth: and ye know in all your hearts and in all your souls, that not one thing hath failed of all the good things which Jehovah your God spake concerning you; all are come to pass unto you, not one thing hath failed thereof. Josh 23:14

Blessed be Jehovah, that hath given rest unto his people Israel, according to all that he promised: there hath not failed one word of all his good promise, which he promised by Moses his servant. 1 Ki 8:56

For how many soever be the promises of God, in him is the yea: wherefore also through him is the Amen, unto the glory of God through us. 2 Cor 1:20

So do you believe that the church has replaced Israel?

 

[kyredneck]

The Abrahamic Covenant is found in 3 passages in Genesis beginning in chapter 12

Nothing new under the sun JD, you Dispies still worship the golden calf, Israel after the flesh. Why? I'm not sure. Probably for the 'sensationalism' of it I suppose.

 

[JD731]

Post #73 shows "the faithfulness of God to keep all that is promised".

What happened in post 73 is not his keeping what was promised if one understands the word “keeping.” The promise to Abraham was that his family would dwell in the boundaries given forever. Are they there now or is the promise been changed?