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Where is this other Jewish Calendar?
- Thread starter 37818
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No. There is a reason most New Testament scholars side with 33 AD. These are Christians who are experts in the field and 1st Century Jewish practices. 33 AD is the only date that has no problems except relying on the calculated calendar.
If Mark was referring to 14 Nisan as observed by Galilean Jews then:
1. Jesus was on the way to Jerusalm at twilight beginning 14 Nissan. Jesus arrived when evening had come and ate.
2. The arrest woukd have been 14 Nisan. The trial would have been in the morning on 14 Nisan.
3. The crucifixion would have been around 3pm on 14 Nisan (about the time the Passover would be killed in the Temple courtyard).
4. The next day woukd be a Sabbath as well as a high day (15 Nisan) so they would need a nearby tomb.
5. Jesus would rise on the 3rd day (16 Nisan).
6. Jesus would have appeared to the Disciples on the road to Emmaus on 16 Nisan, three days since the crucifixion.
33 AD fits perfectly with the Biblical narrative, Jesus baptism, historical events, and the calculated Hebrew Calendar.
We just cannot know as a fact that the calculated calendar reflects the events because, as you noted, we cannot calculate observation.
37818
Well-Known Member
No it doesn't.
Not if Mark 14:12, And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, . . . . is understood to be the 14th of Nisan.
This understanding makes the 33 AD crucifixion impossible.
???
You are confused.
The Passover was killed on Nissan 14.
This is why most New Testanent scholars choose the 33 AD date.
If anything the fact that you decided that the majority of experts in the topic choose a date that is impossible and reject your theory so easily proved a short sightedness on your part.
Mark 14:12 occurred on 14 Nisan.
This is why 33 AD fits without the problems of 30 AD.
What we have to remember is 33 AD is the only choice IF the calculated calendar reflects 1st century observation. Other dates could work since we are assuming whatever cannot calculate. But the best we have is this calculated calendar so we have to live with the assumption.
Biblically the earliest possible date is 31 AD. This would allow for Jesus to have had a 1 year earthly ministry meeting the miminim number of Passovers mentioned in Scripture.
But if we assume the calculated calendar, 33 AD is the only possibility.
It allows Mark 14:12 to have occurred on 14 Nisan as the Passover was being killed while still allowing John to be correct that the day following the crucifixion was the Sabbath and a "high day" and Passover. It affirms Luke that the Jews were to kill Jesus before the feast. It places the crucifixion in 1st century Jerusalem (in the practices and customs of 1st century Jews, not the smaller and unified pre-Iarael of Exodus).
There are no Biblical or historical issues with 33 AD. 33 AD fits the Biblical narrative within actual historical events. It treats the crucifixion as a true event occurring at a time in real history.
37818's date in 30 AD has many problems (as @37818 admitted on the last thread).
Biblically the earliest possible date is 31 AD. This would allow for Jesus to have had a 1 year earthly ministry meeting the miminim number of Passovers mentioned in Scripture.
But if we assume the calculated calendar, 33 AD is the only possibility.
It allows Mark 14:12 to have occurred on 14 Nisan as the Passover was being killed while still allowing John to be correct that the day following the crucifixion was the Sabbath and a "high day" and Passover. It affirms Luke that the Jews were to kill Jesus before the feast. It places the crucifixion in 1st century Jerusalem (in the practices and customs of 1st century Jews, not the smaller and unified pre-Iarael of Exodus).
There are no Biblical or historical issues with 33 AD. 33 AD fits the Biblical narrative within actual historical events. It treats the crucifixion as a true event occurring at a time in real history.
37818's date in 30 AD has many problems (as @37818 admitted on the last thread).
37818
Well-Known Member
If the calculated calendar is correct then 33 AD is the only date that is not problematic.
30 AD has too many issues.
37818
Well-Known Member
With Mark 14:12 being the 14th of Nisan, 33 AD is an impossible crucifixion date.
37818
Well-Known Member
Cite one.
37818
Well-Known Member
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Jesus' baptism could not have occurred in the 15th year of Tiberius' reign.
Jesus could not have risen on the 3rd day.
The Sabbath which was also a "high day" abd the Passover couldn't have been the day after Jesus died.
37818
Well-Known Member
Jesus was in the tomb April 6th Thursday after sundown
All day Friday April 7th.
All day Saturday April 8th.
Was risen Sunday the third day. Per Luke 24:13-21.
Hebrew Calendar
The problem with that is it denies John reasoning for the need to find a nearby tomb.
If Thursday then Jesus would have had to died and been laid in the tomb before sundown. He would have died Thursday afternoon around 3 pm and risen on the 4th day (the 1st day of the week).
Since Jews didn't bury after sundown you have a 4th day resurrection.
Another issue is 30 AD denies the number of recorded passovers during Jesus' ministry. There could be more that were not recorded but there cannot be less. A 6 month earthly ministry only allows for 1 Passover - including the one John says was the day after His death.
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33 AD timeline (assumption is calculated calendar):
Jesus is baptized in the 15th year of Tiberius' reign. This is officially Sep 28 AD to Sep 29 AD, but in reality Aug 28 AD to Aug 29 AD.
The assumption, given John's (John the Baptist) ministry , is this would have been in the summer of 29 AD.
Jesus fulfilled His earthly ministry.
On 14 Nisan (twilight starting the day) Jesus was traveling to Jerusalem. This is the time the Disciples would have observed the killing of the Passover outside of Jerusalem.
On 14 Nisan when evening came Jesus ate rhe Supper, was arrested, and in that morning was tried.
Luke tells us why the need for haste - the Sanhedrin determined to kill Jesus before the feast started in order to avoid a riot.
On 14 Nisan Jesus was crucified. This is the time the Oassover would be killed in the Temple courtyard.
The Sabbath, which was also a "high day" (Nisan 15) and Passover was approaching. Jesus died around 3pm on 14 Nisan (a Friday).
Jews bury before sunset. If unable the body is held until the next day. BUT here they have a problem. The next day is a Sabbath. Not only this nut it is a "high day", it is Passover.
So they must find a nearby tomb. On 14 Nisan before sundown Jesus is laid in a tomb.
Jesus rises 3 days later on the 1st day of the week. This could be anytime from night on Saturday until prior to light on Sunday (Mary went to the tomb Sunday morning before it was light).
This same Sunday, three days after Jesus' crucifixion, Jesus appeared to His disciples on the road to Emmaus.
Jesus is baptized in the 15th year of Tiberius' reign. This is officially Sep 28 AD to Sep 29 AD, but in reality Aug 28 AD to Aug 29 AD.
The assumption, given John's (John the Baptist) ministry , is this would have been in the summer of 29 AD.
Jesus fulfilled His earthly ministry.
On 14 Nisan (twilight starting the day) Jesus was traveling to Jerusalem. This is the time the Disciples would have observed the killing of the Passover outside of Jerusalem.
On 14 Nisan when evening came Jesus ate rhe Supper, was arrested, and in that morning was tried.
Luke tells us why the need for haste - the Sanhedrin determined to kill Jesus before the feast started in order to avoid a riot.
On 14 Nisan Jesus was crucified. This is the time the Oassover would be killed in the Temple courtyard.
The Sabbath, which was also a "high day" (Nisan 15) and Passover was approaching. Jesus died around 3pm on 14 Nisan (a Friday).
Jews bury before sunset. If unable the body is held until the next day. BUT here they have a problem. The next day is a Sabbath. Not only this nut it is a "high day", it is Passover.
So they must find a nearby tomb. On 14 Nisan before sundown Jesus is laid in a tomb.
Jesus rises 3 days later on the 1st day of the week. This could be anytime from night on Saturday until prior to light on Sunday (Mary went to the tomb Sunday morning before it was light).
This same Sunday, three days after Jesus' crucifixion, Jesus appeared to His disciples on the road to Emmaus.
33 AD timeline (assumption is calculated calendar):
Jesus is baptized in the 15th year of Tiberius' reign. This is officially Sep 28 AD to Sep 29 AD, but in reality Aug 28 AD to Aug 29 AD.
The assumption, given John's (John the Baptist) ministry , is this would have been in the summer of 29 AD.
Jesus fulfilled His earthly ministry.
On 14 Nisan (twilight starting the day) Jesus was traveling to Jerusalem. This is the time the Disciples would have observed the killing of the Passover outside of Jerusalem.
On 14 Nisan when evening came Jesus ate rhe Supper, was arrested, and in that morning was tried.
Luke tells us why the need for haste - the Sanhedrin determined to kill Jesus before the feast started in order to avoid a riot.
On 14 Nisan Jesus was crucified. This is the time the Oassover would be killed in the Temple courtyard.
The Sabbath, which was also a "high day" (Nisan 15) and Passover was approaching. Jesus died around 3pm on 14 Nisan (a Friday).
Since Jesus would have to be buried before sundown we at least know He was crucified on a Friday.
Jesus is baptized in the 15th year of Tiberius' reign. This is officially Sep 28 AD to Sep 29 AD, but in reality Aug 28 AD to Aug 29 AD.
The assumption, given John's (John the Baptist) ministry , is this would have been in the summer of 29 AD.
Jesus fulfilled His earthly ministry.
On 14 Nisan (twilight starting the day) Jesus was traveling to Jerusalem. This is the time the Disciples would have observed the killing of the Passover outside of Jerusalem.
On 14 Nisan when evening came Jesus ate rhe Supper, was arrested, and in that morning was tried.
Luke tells us why the need for haste - the Sanhedrin determined to kill Jesus before the feast started in order to avoid a riot.
On 14 Nisan Jesus was crucified. This is the time the Oassover would be killed in the Temple courtyard.
The Sabbath, which was also a "high day" (Nisan 15) and Passover was approaching. Jesus died around 3pm on 14 Nisan (a Friday).
Since Jesus would have to be buried before sundown we at least know He was crucified on a Friday.
37818
Well-Known Member
The Sep 27 AD to 28 AD as being "in the fifteenth year of the reign of Tiberius Caesar" view I am persuaded to hold. @JonC is not able to understand it's math. To him it is not valid math. It is the difference between Sep 14 AD being year 1 versus Sep 14 AD being year 0 were Sep 14 AD to Sep 15 AD being in year 1.
37818
Well-Known Member
Scripture does no such thing.
Mark 15:42-43, And now when the even* was come, because it was the preparation, that is, the day before the sabbath, Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
*Geneva, . . . now when the night was come . . . .
Scripture doesn’t, but you do.
Mark says “When evening had already come, because it was the preparation day, that is, the day before the Sabbath”.
John says “then the Jews, because it was the day of perpetration, so that the bodies would not remain on the cross on the Sabbath, for that Sabbath was a high day, asked Pilate that their legs might be broken and that they might be taken away.
Matthew calls the day after the Crucifixion “the day after preparation”.
This would be the evening on Friday (evening, the day before the Sabbath….the Sabbath was approaching.
How do we know that this was Friday, late afternoon? Because the Bible states that it was the day before the Sabbath, the preparation day (Nisan 14).
So we have to have a day of the crucifixion that places Nisan 14 on the day before the Sabbath, that is on a Friday.
And the bodies have to be removed before sundown or they will remain up on the Sabbath.
Burials, of course, had to occur before sundown on any day. If the next day wasn’t a Sabbath the bodies could have remained until morning.
Your year is at least a year too early. Your day is a day off. You have Jesus rising on the 4th day after a 6 month earthly ministry.
It does not matter what you are persuaded to hold because you are clinging to error.
Those who hold a 30 AD date do so by claiming a co-rulership that is proven incorrect by the 15th anniversary Roman coin from 13 AD.
But at least they avoid the mathametical error you are making.
MEMBERS - While we cannot know the exact date as a fact, this series of threads should demonstrate the problem associated with new "discoveries" of old debates.
Some have suggested 30 AD, but not by the miscalculation we see here.
Lev 23:24 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall ye have a sabbath, a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.
Do you think the sabbath above on the first day of the seventh month had a preparation day preceding it?
IMHO preparation day does not necessarily mean the day before the seventh day of the week?
I believe it was the preparation day preceding the holy convocation day of the fifteenth of the month Nisan a high sabbath.
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