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Featured The LORD: "HATES all workers of iniquity"??

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Paul from Antioch, Sep 17, 2024.

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  1. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    No. Immutability refers to God's being and nature (ontological). This means that God is relationally mutable.

    Because God is immutable and does not change He responds to sin and repentance in a manner consistent with His nature.

    God will never become unrighteousness. He will never become unholy. And His actions will always reflect His immutable nature.

    You simply do not understand the term.
     
  2. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    I think it is an emotion. How would you act on a hate you don't emotionalize? The emotion is the basis for the action.
     
    #42 Reynolds, Sep 26, 2024
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2024
  3. Scarlett O.

    Scarlett O. Moderator
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    MOD NOTE: Words like "idiot", "liar", "lunatic", and other rudeness will stop now.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I'm not sure (I can see it both ways).

    In John 3:16 love is an action. But perhaps it also conveys an emotion.

    When I entered seminary we were told the free-will debate was an undergrad topic. Our main topic as grad students? The love of God.

    I found the topic difficult. God is love. We can say a lot about this, but if we drill down it gets difficult (for me at least.....but you know me, I'm from SC ;)).
     
    #44 JonC, Sep 26, 2024
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2024
  5. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    It's odd that now many professors are bogged down in "free will" vs "predetermination or predestination".
     
  6. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Not the good ones. ;)
     
  7. 37818

    37818 Well-Known Member

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    I am not understanding the difficulty.

    God is immutable.

    The Son is both Himself and God. God is not His Son.
     
  8. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    I think the best ones.
    Mohler
    Macarthur
     
  9. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I don't think they are the best ones. But I like them.
     
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  10. Reynolds

    Reynolds Well-Known Member
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    They are about my speed. I have too much Adult A.D.D. to get much out of many of the others.
     
  11. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    At least your A.D.D. grew into adulthood. :Wink
     
  12. CJP69

    CJP69 Active Member

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    There are no passages that say that God does not change in any way whatsoever, as the doctrine of immutability asserts.

    I've proven otherwise. You have now proven that you are a lair.

    Saying it doesn't make it so.

    I've proven otherwise.

    The doctrine of immutability is not a tautology as this blatantly idiotic rendering of it clearly is.

    Define "nature".


    Prediction: Jon, in so far as he is even able, will be willing to do so.

    Define "God's being" as apposed to "God's nature".

    Again, Jon will not do so.

    Both of these aspects that Jon has now brought up violate the doctrine of divine simplicity which many prominent theologians, not the least of which is Aquinas, use as a premise to argue that God is absolutely (ontologically) immutable.

    Saying it doesn't make it so and repeating the same stupid claim doesn't make it so either.

    I have, in fact, proven otherwise, as you well know. Liar!

    If that we so, you would have responded direct to my rebuttal and demonstrated that this is the case. Instead, you simply restate your position and pretend like my rebuttal doesn't exist.

    Of course you do. Don't compound one lie on top of another.

    And it isn't an ad hominem. Please do at least try to look up multi-syllabic words before using them.

    It isn't even evidence against my argument, much less proof. Do you even know how to think properly or do you just go through life believing any random thing you decide to let fall out of your mouth?

    People who hold to the doctrine would never use the term "stagnant" but that is, in fact, what the doctrine means.

    The doctrine does, in fact, teach that God does not change AT ALL. Not accidentally nor essentially; not in mind nor mood; not in intent nor in practice. No part nor aspect of God changes in anyway whatsoever - period. That IS the doctrine of divine, as I have proven by providing multiple sources and can provide many more.
     
  13. CJP69

    CJP69 Active Member

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    Cite your source.

    No such source exists.

    There are countless Calvinists that would laugh in your face and tell you that God is not be effected at all, even by love.

    [W]e (correctly) deny that God has passions; The passion of love is something that happens to us, as "getting ' happes to a body: and God is exempt from the 'passion' in the same way the the water is exempt from 'getting wet'. He cannot be affected with love, because He is love." C. S. Lewis, Miracles (New York: HarperOne, 1996), page 148​

    The above citation related directly to the specific doctrines of Divine impassibility and divine simplicity, both of which are derivatives of divine immutability.

    This, in three nearly synonymous sentences, is the biblical teaching about God not changing. IT IS NOT what the doctrine of immutability teaches. It's not even 1% of what it teaches.

    "The immutability of God is that perfection of God by which He is devoid of all change, not only in His Being, but also in His perfections, and in His purposes and promises... there is no change possible in God in any respect; God is free from all variation, not only in His essence and attributes, but also in His knowledge and will. This excludes not only all quantitative and qualitative change, but also all change of place, and all succession of time in God." (Systematic Theology, pp. 58-59, emphasis added).​

    Saying doesn't make it so.
     
  14. Scarlett O.

    Scarlett O. Moderator
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    MOD NOTE: I said yesteday for the name-calling to stop. It has not. And in another thread - claiming someone is not saved.

    My banning hammer is coming out. Member has already received warnings for the past year.

    And thread closed.
     
  15. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    I did cite my source.

    I'm not a Calvinist. I'm used to them laughing in my face. I'm just glad I make them smile.
     
  16. JonC

    JonC Moderator
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    Immutability does not mean God does not change in any way.

    The term means God does not change (like the verses I posted state).

    God, if immutable, changes to show wrath against wickedness, mercy to those who repent. If God was not immutable these things would not happen.

    God became flesh. Jesus is God.

    Immutability refers to God's being, His nature.

    You add "in any way" to the passage where Hod says "I do not change".

    You have confused immutability with impassibility.
     
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