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No person can come to Christ by their own freewill ! 3

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Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
Charlie24 said:
BF, it's the hearing of the Gospel of Jesus Christ that draws man to Christ.

But drawing does not mean accepting, it's an invitation that most in this world will reject.
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If one cant believe by his self without divine intervention, how can they hear in order to believe ? That would be a contradiction
 
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Brightfame52

Well-Known Member
Charlie24 said:
The contradiction you see and escapes you is the free will God has given us to choose our own destiny.

The same free will given to Adam and Eve in the Garden from the very beginning.
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How can one hear the word of God if they not of God ? Jesus says this as to who hears Jn 8:47

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.


John 8:47 (KJB)He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God. Heareth and hear - Hearing with spiritual understanding Words (rhema) - Discourse, declaration, command, or promise Here Jesus tells them plainly that the reason that the Jews will not hear the words of God is because they do not possess the spiritual ears which accompanies a person who is saved. The only way we can hear and truly understand the Gospel is by being saved and when a person is saved, they belong to God. These Jews were unsaved and did not belong to God because three verses back Jesus told them plainly that they were of their father the devil. Those who are in Satan’s camp cannot hear the word of God, one must be qualified to hear them and that qualification comes through salvation in Christ alone. This also brings up another point that those who think they can work their way to Heaven will not be able to. The ones who work are hearing the word of God physically but they are not understanding it spiritually which opens up the true meanings of Scripture. John 8:46-50
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Charlie24

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
How can one hear the word of God if they not of God ? Jesus says this as to who hears Jn 8:47

47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
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In the discourse of John 8, Christ is teaching the Jews, the Pharisees come on the scene and begin asking questions to mock Him.

John 8:47 is directed toward the Pharisees. They could not hear the truth because they had no heart for God, they had perverted the Law to be what they wanted it to be. They had no desire for the will of God, but only their will of who God should be.

Many of the Jews in the crowd did desire the will of God and they could hear and believe.
 
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Charlie24

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
In doing so, He is stating a Truth, a fact as who hears the word of God. The saved. Did you read the commentary I provided ?
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No, my friend, you are completely missing the point and it's not your fault you have missed this point.

John 8 is showing us who has the desire in their hearts for God's truth.

The Pharisees certainly did not have this desire and therefore they could not hear the truth, their minds and hearts were in desire of their own way and not God's way.

The Jews in the crowd whose hearts were desiring God's truth and His will immediately accepted the words of Christ.
 
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Ben1445

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
You have missed the point. Jesus states who hears the word of God Jn 8:47 the word He covers all ethnicities lol
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Ethnicity. A sound biblical word!
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Silverhair

Silverhair

Well-Known Member
Brightfame52 said:
I didnt say anything close to that, this is twisting
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BF were you a lost sinner before you trusted in Christ Jesus?

Or to use words you may understand better, were you a "vessel of wrath prior to your trusting in Christ"?

When we look at Mat 25:32-34 we see that the sheep represent those that have trusted in Christ and been saved and the goats Mat 25:41 are those that have not trusted in Christ and are lost.

Since we are all lost prior to our trusting in Christ then logically we would all be classified as goats prior to our trusting in Him.

But since I have freely trusted in Christ Jesus I have no doubt that I am one of His sheep.
Now for the calvinist it is different as you have to hope that the faith that you think was given to you is real and not just a false faith or as calvin called it Evanescent, fleeting faith.
According to Calvin, God gave such people a delusion that made them think they were saved, and even feel like they were saved, only to eventually remove this fleeting grace and reveal that they were just deluded hypocrites that God had never regenerated and whose faith, while it seemed very real to them, was not real faith at all.

That is the burden that all calvinist's must struggle under as according to their own religion they had to be given faith.
 
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