I do not believe in sacraments.

[37818]

The reason I do not believe in sacraments is very simple.
They, sacraments are no where in God's word.


.

 

[Wesley Briggman]

This subject would probably solicit more response if posted in the "Other Discussions" forum.

To my knowledge, all who identify as Baptist agree with your position. I'd like to know how the proponents of "sacraments" defend their beliefs.

 

[Ascetic X]

Whether you call them sacraments, ordinances, rites, commands, or duties, they are all over God’s Word and are essential elements of Christian life and worship.

Can include baptism, infant dedication, communion, tithing, prayer, evangelism, charity, listening to sermons, memorizing scripture, fasting, separation from worldliness, and foot washing.

 

[Salty]

Mr. Webster tells us:

: a Christian rite (such as baptism or the Eucharist) that is believed to have been ordained by Christ and that is held to be a means of divine grace or to be a sign or symbol of a spiritual reality
b
: a religious rite or observance comparable to a Christian sacrament

Since communion or baptism is NOT a means of grace - they are NOT sacraments!

But how many Baptists are NOT aware of this?

 

[Ascetic X]

Mr. Webster tells us:

: a Christian rite (such as baptism or the Eucharist) that is believed to have been ordained by Christ and that is held to be a means of divine grace or to be a sign or symbol of a spiritual reality
b
: a religious rite or observance comparable to a Christian sacrament

Since communion or baptism is NOT a means of grace - they are NOT sacraments!

But how many Baptists are NOT aware of this?

Communion and baptism are not a means of grace?

God does not show divine favor through communion and baptism?

We just engage in communion and baptism as an obligation with nothing resulting from it?

I do not see ordinances as conferring salvation, but I do see them as sources of blessings.

 

[Wesley Briggman]

What is the difference between ordinances and sacraments? | GotQuestions.org
"A sacrament is often thought of as being a means of God’s grace—as a worshiper performs a certain religious rite, he or she receives divine blessing, either for salvation or for sanctification. An ordinance is usually not considered a conduit of grace but simply a practice commanded to be performed by the Lord. In other words, a sacrament, at some level, involves a supernatural work of God. An ordinance is simply an act of man in obedience to God."

[Eph 2:8 KJV] 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God:

The grace of God CANNOT be earned or bestowed by our actions.

 

[Wesley Briggman]

We just engage in communion and baptism as an obligation with nothing resulting from it?

We receive God's blessings by obeying His commands - NOT His grace!

 

[Jerome]

Sacraments?!

Ordinances!

Southern Baptist theologian Nathan Finn (the Convention's 2023,2024,2025,2026 Recording Secretary) explains:

http://web.archive.org/web/20180712...assets/file/baptismasprerequisteforsupper.pdf

"most Baptist churches...call them 'ordinances'"

"Most Baptists have historically held a 'memorial view' of the Lord’s Supper, recalling Jesus’ command that the ordinance be observed 'in remembrance of me.'"

"In contrast to the memorial view, some Baptists hold to a view of the 'spiritual presence' of Christ in communionm following the Genevan reformer John Calvin."

"The 'spiritual presence' understanding of the Lord’s Supper is especially common among some moderate Southern Baptists and in the Reformed Baptist tradition"

 

[Jerome]

Reformed Baptist 'Sacraments'

Newsletter of the Association of Reformed Baptist Churches of America (which after a scandal has since renamed itself the Confessional Baptist Association)

"ARBCA General Assembly, held at Trinity Reformed Baptist Church in La Mirada, Calif. . . .Dr. Richard Barcellos of Heritage Baptist Church, Owensboro, Ky., spoke on 'The Lord’s Supper as Means of Grace', focusing on the benefits that communion conveys to believers – it’s not just a memorial meal. Those benefits include sanctifying grace indued to the soul, the benefits of Christ’s body and blood nourishes believers’ souls, the frequency of the supper, and its links with the past, 'do this in remembrance of Me', present 'the cup of blessing which we drink,' and future 'do this till I come,' as recorded by Christ’s directives. He noted that 'baptism is a sacrament of spiritual birth; the Lord’s Supper is a sacrament of spiritual feeding.'"

Moderate Baptist 'Sacraments'

As reported from the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship's annual meeting

"The General Assembly served itself what many participants called the 'sacrament of communion' as they were given their choice of breads from around the world. Instead of wine or grape juice, participants were each given a single grape, which they were told to 'take and eat'."

 

[37818]

Yes, Baptist typically call the observances, baptism and, the Lord's Supper, Ordinances.

Now, the observances, baptism and, the Lord's Supper, are not even called Ordinances in our written word of God.

 

[Craigbythesea]

Reformed Baptist 'Sacraments'

Newsletter of the Association of Reformed Baptist Churches of America (which after a scandal has since renamed itself the Confessional Baptist Association)

"ARBCA General Assembly, held at Trinity Reformed Baptist Church in La Mirada, Calif. . . .Dr. Richard Barcellos of Heritage Baptist Church, Owensboro, Ky., spoke on 'The Lord’s Supper as Means of Grace', focusing on the benefits that communion conveys to believers – it’s not just a memorial meal. Those benefits include sanctifying grace indued to the soul, the benefits of Christ’s body and blood nourishes believers’ souls, the frequency of the supper, and its links with the past, 'do this in remembrance of Me', present 'the cup of blessing which we drink,' and future 'do this till I come,' as recorded by Christ’s directives. He noted that 'baptism is a sacrament of spiritual birth; the Lord’s Supper is a sacrament of spiritual feeding.'"

Moderate Baptist 'Sacraments'

As reported from the Cooperative Baptist Fellowship's annual meeting

"The General Assembly served itself what many participants called the 'sacrament of communion' as they were given their choice of breads from around the world. Instead of wine or grape juice, participants were each given a single grape, which they were told to 'take and eat'."

Thank you for this post. I am not a Reformed Baptist, but I am a Baptist who agrees with the statement, “baptism is a sacrament of spiritual birth.”

1 Peter 3:21. And baptism, which this prefigured, now saves you—not as a removal of dirt from the body, but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
22. who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers made subject to him. (NRSV)

This is perhaps the clearest and easiest to understand statement in the New Testament. Indeed, it is so very clear and easy to understand that for more than 1,500 it was universally understood by Christians and it is still today clearly understood by the very large majority of Christians around the world. But somehow, many Baptists believe that it contradicts Ephesians2:8-9,

8. For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God—
9. not the result of works, so that no one may boast.

However, the grace of God for salvation is conferred upon believers in Christ through water baptism. It is not our doing; it is the gift of God.

 

[Jerome]

I am not a Reformed Baptist

What sort of Baptist are you?

 

[Craigbythesea]

What sort of Baptist are you?

I am a Wesleyan Baptist.

 

[Salty]

I am a Wesleyan Baptist.

Please explain

 

[David Lamb]

Please explain

I agree that an explanation would be good. I have never heard of "Wesleyan Baptists" so I looked the term up. The first "hit" was an AI overview which started:

""Wesleyan Baptists" is not a standard major Christian denomination, as Wesleyanism (rooted in John Wesley's Methodist theology) and Baptist tradition (rooted in credo-baptism and Calvinist or autonomous roots) historically arose from distinct theological streams."

 

[Craigbythesea]

Please explain

As a Wesleyan Baptist, I am a Baptist who leans more toward Arminian theology rather than Calvinist theology.

 

[Ascetic X]

We receive God's blessings by obeying His commands - NOT His grace!

How are blessings different from grace?

 

[Martin Marprelate]

The word 'sacrament' does not appear in the 1644/6 or 1689 confession, and I personally never use the word.
However, some of the compilers of the 1689 do speak of 'sacraments' in their other writings, but they do not at all mean the same thing that Roman Catholics do.
The same applies to the term 'means of grace.'
God's grace towards us does not stop when we are converted. 'Grace and peace be multiplied to you' (2 Peter 1:2). The primary means of grace is preaching. 'So now, brethren, I commend you to God and to the word of His grace, which is able to build you up and give you an inheritance among those who are sanctified' (Acts 20:32).
Likewise, Christians (no one else) feed on the Lord Jesus, not in some crass, carnal way, but spiritually - we contemplate His wonderful grace to us and grow in our faith. It goes without saying that the bread and wine do not change in any way, but I do believe that the Lord's Supper is not only a memorial, but a blessing provided for us by God.
I think the 1689 confession is very good when it speaks of baptism: XXIX: I. Baptism is an ordinance of the New Testament, ordained by Jesus Christ, to be unto the party baptized, a sign of his fellowship with him, in His death [Rom. 6:3-5; Col. 2:12; Gal. 3:27], and resurrection; of his being engrafted into Him; of remission of sins [Mark 1:4]; and of his giving up unto God through Jesus Christ to live and walk in newness of life [Rom. 6:2, 4]. Needless to say (I hope!) these blessings only apply to those genuinely converted. Others may get a warm, fuzzy feeling for a while, but no more.

 

[Wesley Briggman]

How are blessings different from grace?

Grace is God's undeserved favor. Example: One cannot work to earn salvation. Salvation results from God's grace.

[Rom 11:5-6 NLT] 5 It is the same today, for a few of the people of Israel have remained faithful because of God's grace--his undeserved kindness in choosing them. 6 And since it is through God's kindness, then it is not by their good works. For in that case, God's grace would not be what it really is--free and undeserved.

[Rom 11:5-6 KJV] 5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. 6 And if by grace, then [is it] no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if [it be] of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

By being obedient to God's revealed will, He can bless His child's efforts.

[Jas 5:16 KJV] 16 Confess [your] faults one to another, and pray one for another, that ye may be healed. The effectual fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much.

"availeth much" - blessing. Results of obedience.

[1Jo 1:9 KJV] 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us [our] sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Forgive and cleansing - blessings. Results of obedience.

 

[Craigbythesea]

Thank you for this post. I am not a Reformed Baptist, but I am a Baptist who agrees with the statement, “baptism is a sacrament of spiritual birth.”

1 Peter 3:21. And baptism, which this prefigured, now saves you—not as a removal of dirt from the body, but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
22. who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers made subject to him. (NRSV)

This is perhaps the clearest and easiest to understand statement in the New Testament. Indeed, it is so very clear and easy to understand that for more than 1,500 it was universally understood by Christians and it is still today clearly understood by the very large majority of Christians around the world. But somehow, many Baptists believe that it contradicts Ephesians2:8-9,

8. For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God—
9. not the result of works, so that no one may boast.

However, the grace of God for salvation is conferred upon believers in Christ through water baptism. It is not our doing; it is the gift of God.

Some Baptists may claim that they were saved before they were baptized in water and that, therefore, “the grace of God for salvation is not always conferred upon believers in Christ through water baptism.” Indeed, my experience was more like the experience of the Christians that we read about in Acts 10:44-48.

44. While Peter was still speaking, the Holy Spirit fell upon all who heard the word.
45. The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astounded that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on the Gentiles,
46. for they heard them speaking in tongues and extolling God. Then Peter said,
47. "Can anyone withhold the water for baptizing these people who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?"
48. So he ordered them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they invited him to stay for several days.

I was saved and filled with the Holy Spirit before I was baptized in water, and yet we read,

Acts 10:38. Peter said to them, “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins may be forgiven; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Mark 16:16. The one who believes and is baptized will be saved; but the one who does not believe will be condemned.

Acts 22:16. And now why do you delay? Get up, be baptized, and have your sins washed away, calling on his name.'

Titus 3:4. But when the goodness and loving kindness of God our Savior appeared,
5. he saved us, not because of any works of righteousness that we had done, but according to his mercy, through the water {Gk [washing]} of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit.

Ephesians 5:25. Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her,
26. in order to make her holy by cleansing her with the washing of water by the word,
27. so as to present the church to himself in splendor, without a spot or wrinkle or anything of the kind—yes, so that she may be holy and without blemish.

Colossians 2:11. In him also you were circumcised with a spiritual circumcision, by putting off the body of the flesh in the circumcision of Christ;
12. when you were buried with him in baptism, you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.

1 Peter 3:21. And baptism, which this prefigured, now saves you—not as a removal of dirt from the body, but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,
22. who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers made subject to him.