Hundreds Of Questions About The Christian God

[Mike B]

What you have given me are beliefs. You haven't given me the evidence of your knowledge,

Contrary to my last comment, I will continue to discuss this with you......briefly.

Please address this question from my previous post:

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It seems that you have a wealth of knowledge, but are lacking in spiritual discernment.

Have to ask...have you ever earnestly prayed to God? Believing in your heart that He is there, and
hears your words? Do not fear, He is not going to smite you for asking for help and spiritual
understanding.

[edit in] Spiritual discernment comes from prayer and meditation.

1 Corinthians 2:13-14

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the
Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto
him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

[edit in] In short, you need to quit countermanding everything and start praying to God for wisdom.

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As for the "OSI Model", my trying to understand that would be akin to me trying to teach you how to
float your way through the gears on an 18 Speed Roadranger sitting behind a 3408 Cat. FWIW, I've had an
I-phone for over 10 years (couple of 'em) and have never gone so far as to add an "app". Don't even
know how to, and I'm good with that.

 

[Alan Dale Gross]

God knew this with express, explicit, infinite, foreknowledge, and He did it anyway!

From our perspective, as humans thinking in the flesh with our sin-cursed mind that has suffered the effects of the Fall of Adam, it may be the only way we can think about it is how God must have Actively Acted(?) in His having "ALLOWED CERTAIN THINGS" to happen, without our thinking being Enabled by the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit Makes it possible for us to be Able to place God's Passive Decrees in our heart and soul, as simply being for HIS ULTIMATE GLORY.

Then, that is still while He still Holds all of the Guilty sinners Responsible for their own personal sins, which they will Suffer in The Lake of Fire, unless the are Saved by THE SAVIOR, Who, died, was buried, and rose again the third day, as a Perfect Sacrifice, in Place of their State of Guilt before the Judge of the Universe, TO SAVE THEIR SOUL.

Why would a God who says He loves us, create beings he knew from infinity, would cause such staggering, living torture?

I'm not sure what you mean by "God Who Says He Loves us". Where does the Bible say God Loves everyone, if that is what you're saying?

Do you think God Loves you? He let's you enjoy the rain and the sunshine and your own personal grasping around at what you may sense as being a Mightier Being to Whom you feel Accountable.

God Uses His Word to Visit people in their own Conscience, but also He Reveals Himself through His Creation.

18; "For the Wrath of God is Revealed from Heaven
against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men,
who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19; "Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them;
because God hath Shewed it unto them.

20; "Because the Invisible things of Him from the Creation of the World
are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are Made,
even His Eternal Power and Godhead;
so that they are without excuse:

21; "Because that, when they knew God,
they glorified Him not as God, neither were thankful;
but became vain in their imaginations,
and their foolish heart was darkened.

22; "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23; "And changed the Glory of the Uncorruptible God
into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds,
and four-footed beasts, and creeping things."

Who put that 'Consense' their in our own head, to speak to us, a Warning?

Our Creator and we will meet with Him One Day, face-to Face, whether we are Prepared to Meet our Maker, or not.

Did Adam and Eve have free will? Could they have decided to obey God and thus we’d all still be kicking it in Eden to this day?

God Chose to Create a living entity, or 'being' apart from Himself, to Worship and Commune with God throughout Eternity.

However, the Extent of the Glory that would Please God would be less, for that Worship and Fellowship to come from a Created Being that had been Confirmed in their State of Innocents, like the Angles, or one simply like that of a robot, than from a Blood-Bought, Eternally, Saved soul, by the Blood of Jesus Christ.

In order for that Created being to Worship and Commune with God throughout Eternity to not be a Created Being that had been Confirmed in their State of Innocents, like the Angles, or one simply like a robot, with no ability to choose one way, or the other, that newly Created 'being' would have to be Made Mutable, that is to say that Adam was not only Given the "Free Will", as you say, but he actually had the choice Given to him of The Tree of Paradise, ot The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

Adam was Given the Ability to choose one thing over another and he did.

In the eventuality of his life in the Garden of Eden, Adam chose to Rebel against God's All-Powerful Command and sin.

And, it had been me or you there that Day, we would have eventually chosen to not remain in Perfect Innocence, therefore, wherein Adam sinned, we all sinned in Adam, as if he were us.

Then, whether it was Adam, or us, there has now been a Change to our State of Nature, where we are sinners against God in every heartbeat, or breath, and would have never had to be 'taught how to lie, or steal', etc. We are all Natural Born children of Adam and we have all Inherited our Nature to Naturally sin from our Greatest-Great Grandfather, Adam.

God is Holy and Perfect and NOTHING SINFUL will be Entering His Heaven. And God Runs Heaven.

That sin would have to be Atoned for in another Manner, IF ANY HUMAN BEING COULD EVER GO TO HEAVEN WHEN THEY DIE, and it was, FOR GOD'S CHOSEN CHILDREN.

God Provided a Lamb. A Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World.

Revelation 13:8;
"And all that dwell upon the Earth shall worship him,
whose names are not Written in the Book of Life
of the Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World."

Did Lucifer have free will? If he did, would God have had to make a Lucifer 2.0 to carry out the rest of the Biblical plan?

With the '2.0'. No, no 'plan 2.0'

Without the '2.0' being meant to have been put in there,

Did Lucifer have free will? If he did, would God have had to make a Lucifer--- to carry out the rest of the Biblical plan?

Apparently.

I hope you're not trying to exalt a Doomed enemy of God, as if God couldn't have done without him.

God has Infinite Choices, including to Make the Choice to NOT Do ANYTHING Against His Perfect, Sinless, Nature and Essence.

an infinite God without limitations

God has Infinite Choices, including to Make the Choice to NOT Do ANYTHING Against His Perfect, Sinless, Nature and Essence and EVERYTHING WILL COME TO PASS, in the same way that we saw Jesus,

"being Delivered by the Determinate Counsel and Foreknowledge of God," Acts 2:23, which explains it all.

You Must Be Born Again.

 

[irmadlad]

Contrary to my last comment, I will continue to discuss this with you......briefly.

Please address this question from my previous post:

******************************************************************************************

It seems that you have a wealth of knowledge, but are lacking in spiritual discernment.

Have to ask...have you ever earnestly prayed to God? Believing in your heart that He is there, and
hears your words? Do not fear, He is not going to smite you for asking for help and spiritual
understanding.

[edit in] Spiritual discernment comes from prayer and meditation.

1 Corinthians 2:13-14

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the
Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto
him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

[edit in] In short, you need to quit countermanding everything and start praying to God for wisdom.

***********************************************************************************************

As for the "OSI Model", my trying to understand that would be akin to me trying to teach you how to
float your way through the gears on an 18 Speed Roadranger sitting behind a 3408 Cat. FWIW, I've had an
I-phone for over 10 years (couple of 'em) and have never gone so far as to add an "app". Don't even
know how to, and I'm good with that.

RE: 18 Speed Roadranger sitting behind a 3408 Cat.

That was a pretty unique engine the 3408 CAT. If I remember correctly, one of the largest of the CAT line. I wouldn't know my way around one per se, but I am familiar with big diesel blocks. My expertise would lean more towards Cummins ISX / X15 family or John Deere PowerTech, but those are farm type equipment.

RE: It seems that you have a wealth of knowledge

I'm a mildly educated man tho, I do hold a degree in engineering. All that means is I can answer a lot of questions in a limited amount of time, and upon successfully doing that, I received a piece of paper. Most of what I know, I taught myself. From how to farm 22 acres, technology, science, you name it. I'm a hands on kind of guy.

RE: 14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto
him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

I was wondering when this would show up. I get it a lot from Christians, usually right from the gate. 'The ways of God are foolishness to man'. So let me clear that up. If I thought this was all foolishness, honestly, I wouldn't have wasted your time, nor gone through all of this to waste my time either. Foolishness, no. Vague, ambiguous, confusing? Absolutely. And I speak of all of it.

RE: Have to ask...have you ever earnestly prayed to God? Believing in your heart that He is there, and
hears your words? Do not fear, He is not going to smite you for asking for help and spiritual
understanding.

Mike, I've been on this planet some 25,900 days +/- if you throw in gestation and all of that. Well over 50% of those days have heard me screaming into the void at God, Allah, Ganesha, or whatever is out there to reveal themselves/itself. The void does not answer. There's not much more I could do in earnest. I fully admit something happened way back when. It's quite obvious. Now, whether that something was the Big Bang, the Hindu creation as described in their Puranas, or the creation story according to Judaeo-Christian beliefs, or the creation story according to Islam (which again, almost parallels the Judaeo-Christian creation story), that is still left to discovered.

Here is the common thread throughout all religions, even tribal belief systems:

"If you do not believe the way we do, the book we believe, and the God we believe in and so fervently worship, then you will not go to our eternal reward, but you will go to our eternal damnation."

That's it in a nutshell. That basically covers anything you could ever discuss about religion, God, theology, or any kind of spirituality of any ilk. There's got to be more to it than that. For there to be a truth trifecta, there can only be one truth trifecta. You can have many truths, but only one truth trifecta. We used to do this in engineering studies with orthographic projection. Each plane of the object is a truth. However, until you project each and every plane to show the object's every facet, you only know the truth of what you can see initially. Not the truth trifecta.

 

[Alan Dale Gross]

"If you do not believe the way we do, the book we believe, and the God we believe in and so fervently worship, then you will not go to our eternal reward, but you will go to our eternal damnation."

You Must Be Born Again, as a Hellbound enemy of God who hates God,

Try this:

"If you do not believe the Way, the Truth, and the Life that God has Provided
through Jesus Christ's death, burial, and resurrection,
and the Book God Wrote and Preserved for us to know His Words to Mankind,

we believe, and the God Who Wrote that Book and Made the Promise of Eternal Salvation in it,

Who we believe in and so fervently Worship by the dictates of our own saved heart and soul,
as His Spirit Bares Witness with our Spirit that we are the saved sons of God,

then you will not go, because You Must Be Born Again,

to the Triune Godhead's and our Eternal Home,

but you will go to the Hell which God Created for the Devil and his Angels in eternal damnation."

I will be there to watch as Satan is cast into the Lake of Fire, along with the Beast and the False Prophet, all the Fallen Angels, and all the lost souls of Mankind who die without Salvation that is Only through Jesus Christ, the Savior.

That's it in a nutshell. That basically covers anything you could ever discuss about religion, God, theology, or any kind of spirituality of any ilk.

Religion has sent more billions of lost souls to Hell than most anything else.

Worshipping Satan is a false 'religion'.

And ,"the Devils 'believe' and tremble", so they 'know' and 'believe' in God and know about Jesus, but they are not saved.

"Thou believest that there is One God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble," James 2:19.

And the devils know that they will be Judged and are Doomed to Hell with Satan.

Matthew 8:28; "And when He was come to the other side into the country of the Gergesenes,
there met him two possessed with devils, coming out of the tombs,
exceeding fierce, so that no man might pass by that way.

29; "And, behold, they cried out, saying,
What have we to do with thee, Jesus, Thou Son of God?
art Thou come hither to Torment us before the Time?"

The Demons knew Jesus as Jesus, the Son of God, and yet knew they were Condemned to Hell, Forever.

Religion, for the most part, is purely of sin-cursed men, BY SATAN'S SUPERNAURAL EVIL INFLUENCE.

"Theology is nothing more than a speaking of God, or a discoursing concerning Him;
His Nature, Names, Perfections, and Persons; His Purposes, Providences, Ways, Works, and Word:"
His By Grace--"John Gill: A Body of Doctrinal & Practical Divinity"-Doctrinal Book 1, Chapter 1

 

[irmadlad]

From our perspective, as humans thinking in the flesh with our sin-cursed mind that has suffered the effects of the Fall of Adam, it may be the only way we can think about it is how God must have Actively Acted(?) in His having "ALLOWED CERTAIN THINGS" to happen, without our thinking being Enabled by the Holy Spirit.

The Holy Spirit Makes it possible for us to be Able to place God's Passive Decrees in our heart and soul, as simply being for HIS ULTIMATE GLORY.

Then, that is still while He still Holds all of the Guilty sinners Responsible for their own personal sins, which they will Suffer in The Lake of Fire, unless the are Saved by THE SAVIOR, Who, died, was buried, and rose again the third day, as a Perfect Sacrifice, in Place of their State of Guilt before the Judge of the Universe, TO SAVE THEIR SOUL.



I'm not sure what you mean by "God Who Says He Loves us". Where does the Bible say God Loves everyone, if that is what you're saying?

Do you think God Loves you? He let's you enjoy the rain and the sunshine and your own personal grasping around at what you may sense as being a Mightier Being to Whom you feel Accountable.

God Uses His Word to Visit people in their own Conscience, but also He Reveals Himself through His Creation.

18; "For the Wrath of God is Revealed from Heaven
against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men,
who hold the truth in unrighteousness;

19; "Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them;
because God hath Shewed it unto them.

20; "Because the Invisible things of Him from the Creation of the World
are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are Made,
even His Eternal Power and Godhead;
so that they are without excuse:

21; "Because that, when they knew God,
they glorified Him not as God, neither were thankful;
but became vain in their imaginations,
and their foolish heart was darkened.

22; "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

23; "And changed the Glory of the Uncorruptible God
into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds,
and four-footed beasts, and creeping things."

Who put that 'Consense' their in our own head, to speak to us, a Warning?

Our Creator and we will meet with Him One Day, face-to Face, whether we are Prepared to Meet our Maker, or not.


God Chose to Create a living entity, or 'being' apart from Himself, to Worship and Commune with God throughout Eternity.

However, the Extent of the Glory that would Please God would be less, for that Worship and Fellowship to come from a Created Being that had been Confirmed in their State of Innocents, like the Angles, or one simply like that of a robot, than from a Blood-Bought, Eternally, Saved soul, by the Blood of Jesus Christ.

In order for that Created being to Worship and Commune with God throughout Eternity to not be a Created Being that had been Confirmed in their State of Innocents, like the Angles, or one simply like a robot, with no ability to choose one way, or the other, that newly Created 'being' would have to be Made Mutable, that is to say that Adam was not only Given the "Free Will", as you say, but he actually had the choice Given to him of The Tree of Paradise, ot The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil.

Adam was Given the Ability to choose one thing over another and he did.

In the eventuality of his life in the Garden of Eden, Adam chose to Rebel against God's All-Powerful Command and sin.

And, it had been me or you there that Day, we would have eventually chosen to not remain in Perfect Innocence, therefore, wherein Adam sinned, we all sinned in Adam, as if he were us.

Then, whether it was Adam, or us, there has now been a Change to our State of Nature, where we are sinners against God in every heartbeat, or breath, and would have never had to be 'taught how to lie, or steal', etc. We are all Natural Born children of Adam and we have all Inherited our Nature to Naturally sin from our Greatest-Great Grandfather, Adam.

God is Holy and Perfect and NOTHING SINFUL will be Entering His Heaven. And God Runs Heaven.

That sin would have to be Atoned for in another Manner, IF ANY HUMAN BEING COULD EVER GO TO HEAVEN WHEN THEY DIE, and it was, FOR GOD'S CHOSEN CHILDREN.

God Provided a Lamb. A Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World.

Revelation 13:8;
"And all that dwell upon the Earth shall worship him,
whose names are not Written in the Book of Life
of the Lamb Slain from the Foundation of the World."



With the '2.0'. No, no 'plan 2.0'

Without the '2.0' being meant to have been put in there,


Apparently.

I hope you're not trying to exalt a Doomed enemy of God, as if God couldn't have done without him.

God has Infinite Choices, including to Make the Choice to NOT Do ANYTHING Against His Perfect, Sinless, Nature and Essence.



God has Infinite Choices, including to Make the Choice to NOT Do ANYTHING Against His Perfect, Sinless, Nature and Essence and EVERYTHING WILL COME TO PASS, in the same way that we saw Jesus,

"being Delivered by the Determinate Counsel and Foreknowledge of God," Acts 2:23, which explains it all.

You Must Be Born Again.

RE: I'm not sure what you mean by "God Who Says He Loves us". Where does the Bible say God Loves everyone, if that is what you're saying?

Surely you are familiar with John 3:16: 'For God so loved the world'. There are probably hundreds of such references in the Christian Bible.

RE: Do you think God Loves you? He let's you enjoy the rain and the sunshine and your own personal grasping around at what you may sense as being a Mightier Being to Whom you feel Accountable.

Well, He says he does, but then again, love does not persecute, love protects. In the Christian Bible, one of the facets that is God is shown as is a violent being. In one instance He says, "I am an angry God." In another, "I am a jealous God." And in yet another instance, "You send forth Your burning anger, and it consumes them as chaff." What is God so angry and jealous at, regarding His very own creation? This is His own creation doing exactly as He knew from infinity they would do.

RE: Adam was Given the Ability to choose one thing over another and he did.

Once again, free will is incompatible with the structure of infallible knowledge. If He knows all, and all means all, and if he knows the beginning from the end, then He knows each and every thing that will happen.

For instance: the book of Revelation is not presented as a warning or a possibility tree. It's presented as what will happen. John isn't told, "here's what might occur if things continue." He's shown what must take place. The very structure of apocalyptic literature in the Biblical tradition is one of certainty, not contingency. "Write therefore what you have seen, what is now, and what will take place later."

No matter what transpires between Genesis 1:1 and whenever Revelations kicks off, Revelations happens. It's set in stone. Fixed by the very structure of infallible knowledge. You can't have it any other way. You cannot stick a 'but' in between 'without' and 'limitations'. You cannot say 'Well, he knows all, but...' As soon as you do, He ceases to be without limitations and therefore ceases to be God.

RE: I hope you're not trying to exalt a Doomed enemy of God, as if God couldn't have done without him. With the '2.0'. No, no 'plan 2.0' Without the '2.0' being meant to have been put in there, Apparently.

I'm not trying to be hypercritical here, and it's probably my inability to follow along with what you are saying, However, could you unpack some of this for me. I am sure it made sense when you typed it. Perhaps my Dick Tracy decoder ring is malfunctioning.

RE: God has Infinite Choices, including to Make the Choice to NOT Do ANYTHING

Well, yes. That would be the one of the options of 'without limitations'. Frankly speaking, if I had a choice whether to make me or not, I would have chosen not to make me in the first place, or anything for that matter.

RE: Who put that 'Consense' their in our own head, to speak to us, a Warning?

Well, I'm sure you would say God. However, I do not subscribe to the notion that all morality stems from a God. Even animals have codes of conduct and moral standards they live by if you'll take the time to observe them. This is innate in most every living creature. I have moral standards I have lived my life by. One is, we have a moral obligation to help our fellow man when he is in need, no matter who or what he is, or how he came to be in need. But I don't help my fellow man to gain favor with a deity, or that I may get some cosmic bump in karma. I do it because it's the right thing to do. No strings attached.