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"God Saves Sinners Completely and Fully"

KenH

Well-Known Member
Romans 9:18-23
Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
and that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory?
...
Sovereign Grace is all about Christ. It is the way that God saves sinners completely and fully, in a way that God receives all the glory and credit for doing so. It is salvation conditioned on Christ alone. It is a salvation that no sinner can take credit for as to brag of any merit or righteousness in them but only by the righteousness the LORD Jesus Christ earned as He was obedient in His life and death to do a work that fully satisfied all the strict demands of God's Law and unbending justice.

One thing very offensive to the pride of a sinner is that in this exclusive way of salvation (there is no other way) God rules out all works or merit that sinners may try to use as a means to earn justification at Judgment and enter heaven. This would include any works of the Law or obedience in any form done by the sinner. Even actions that would credit the sinner's will or their sincerity. No prayer, no ceremony, no ritual, no system or formula, no matter how religious, pious, zealous, or done with good intentions will save, help save or add to salvation in any way. This means that salvation is by grace 100% or there is NO salvation at all.

Most people in "Evangelical" churches would credit the sinner for FAITH and REPENTANCE. They do this in such a way as to credit these to the exercise of the will, making the free action by the sinner of the will be the determining factor in heaven or hell. This shifts credit from the life and death of Christ and puts man's will in direct competition with the glorious, perfect, finished work of Jesus Christ. God, of course, will not have that. He will never share His glory with another (a sinner especially).

The word of God clearly teaches that both faith and repentance are gifts from God, which He works in the sinner by His Spirit, powerfully causing them to happen. Soon one begins to see that at every turn in describing how salvation is NOT by the works and will of the sinner, every possible cause or condition done by the sinner is eliminated. It is here that one will start to see that the remedy for sin MUST be totally in the hands of God alone and be done in a sovereign way, His way.

The doctrine of God's sovereign grace is that God Almighty alone is the determining factor in who will be saved and who will not be saved. It is just that simple. In the wickedness of the natural sinful heart and mind mankind will rebel against this truth saying that it is not fair and that God does NOT have the Divine right to decide. Feel free to take that up with the LORD when you face Him at judgment. He will destroy you with such an accusation. God's word is clear in many places that He is sovereign, not only in creation and providence but especially in salvation because of Redemptive Glory. That glory was magnified by the LORD Jesus Christ himself. Sovereign Grace is Christ-centered.

- excerpt from an article entitled, "Sovereign Grace: What Is It All About?", by Scott Price, pastor of Gospel of Grace Ministries, 25 miles north of downtown Cincinnati, Ohio( rest of article at Sovereign Grace: What Is It All About? by Scott Price | Grace Baptist Church | SermonAudio )
 
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Ben1445

Well-Known Member
Romans 9:18-23
Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?
What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction:
and that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory?
...
Sovereign Grace is all about Christ. It is the way that God saves sinners completely and fully, in a way that God receives all the glory and credit for doing so. It is salvation conditioned on Christ alone. It is a salvation that no sinner can take credit for as to brag of any merit or righteousness in them but only by the righteousness the LORD Jesus Christ earned as He was obedient in His life and death to do a work that fully satisfied all the strict demands of God's Law and unbending justice.

One thing very offensive to the pride of a sinner is that in this exclusive way of salvation (there is no other way) God rules out all works or merit that sinners may try to use as a means to earn justification at Judgment and enter heaven. This would include any works of the Law or obedience in any form done by the sinner. Even actions that would credit the sinner's will or their sincerity. No prayer, no ceremony, no ritual, no system or formula, no matter how religious, pious, zealous, or done with good intentions will save, help save or add to salvation in any way. This means that salvation is by grace 100% or there is NO salvation at all.

Most people in "Evangelical" churches would credit the sinner for FAITH and REPENTANCE. They do this in such a way as to credit these to the exercise of the will, making the free action by the sinner of the will be the determining factor in heaven or hell. This shifts credit from the life and death of Christ and puts man's will in direct competition with the glorious, perfect, finished work of Jesus Christ. God, of course, will not have that. He will never share His glory with another (a sinner especially).

The word of God clearly teaches that both faith and repentance are gifts from God, which He works in the sinner by His Spirit, powerfully causing them to happen. Soon one begins to see that at every turn in describing how salvation is NOT by the works and will of the sinner, every possible cause or condition done by the sinner is eliminated. It is here that one will start to see that the remedy for sin MUST be totally in the hands of God alone and be done in a sovereign way, His way.

The doctrine of God's sovereign grace is that God Almighty alone is the determining factor in who will be saved and who will not be saved. It is just that simple. In the wickedness of the natural sinful heart and mind mankind will rebel against this truth saying that it is not fair and that God does NOT have the Divine right to decide. Feel free to take that up with the LORD when you face Him at judgment. He will destroy you with such an accusation. God's word is clear in many places that He is sovereign, not only in creation and providence but especially in salvation because of Redemptive Glory. That glory was magnified by the LORD Jesus Christ himself. Sovereign Grace is Christ-centered.

- excerpt from an article entitled, "Sovereign Grace: What Is It All About?", by Scott Price, pastor of Gospel of Grace Ministries, 25 miles north of downtown Cincinnati, Ohio( rest of article at Sovereign Grace: What Is It All About? by Scott Price | Grace Baptist Church | SermonAudio )
It does make you wonder how people can read about Abraham reasoning with God, and Jacob wrestling with God and still say that we are going to be “destroyed with such an accusation.”
And there is always the copout- well they were preselected.
I think I remember Jesus rejecting someone who was not preselected too.

Mt. 15:24
But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

You are not of the house of Israel, I have nothing to do with you. I was not sent to you.

And again,
Mt. 15:26
But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.


You are not even a sheep who is not of the house of Israel. You are a dog, not a sheep.


But she continued to ignore the words of the Savior who sent her away.

And the final response,

Mr. 15:28
Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.


Amazing what some importunity can do!

Methinks I have read that that is how we are supposed to behave toward God, wrestling. Not wrestling against God, but with God about how His promises are sure, His mercies are everlasting, and His truth enduring to all generations. How God is not a respecter of persons, but that He deals with each according to how they deal with Him. He does not give equity as the fools of today’s world desire it. Rather, He judges justly. He judges based upon what we have instead of what we do not have.

The principle,
2 Corinthians 8:12
For if there be first a willing mind, it is accepted according to that a man hath, and not according to that he hath not.

The principle in action,
Acts 17:30
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

And yes, I do believe that everywhere is every place you can find and all men are all the people in every place you can find. I do not wrest Scripture.
Were there one man who was not called upon to repent but was left without knowledge to come to repentance, the word all would be the wrong word and God would be a liar.
Unless you believe that some of all men everywhere have sinned and come short of the glory of God, or that death passed upon some of all men out of every tribe and kindred and tongue and nation.

Let’s not use an unjust measure.
 

Ascetic X

Well-Known Member
How dare anyone say that Jesus gave a command that was impossible for unsaved people to obey.


Mark 1:14,15

Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God,

and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the Kingdom of God is at hand. Repent ye and believe the Gospel.”


This does not mean that repenting and believing are what saves you.

Repenting and believing are the conditions of obedience that are required for God to grant salvation.

Free will choosing is the foundation of God’s dealings with men. Nothing is forced on anyone. This enables God to righteously judge those who chose to reject Him. Their refusal to repent and believe is entirely their own fault.

They cannot say, “God you didn’t put repentance in me, so it’s not my fault that I’m unsaved.”



Joshua 24:15

And if it seem evil unto you to serve the Lord, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.
 
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