Sermons On Sovereignty CHS

[Rippon]

Continuing with Particular Redemption ...

I must now return to that controverted point again . We are told ( I mean those of us who are commonly nicknamed by the title of Calvinists -- and we are not very much ashamed of that ; we think Calvin , after all , knew more about the Gospel than almost any man who has ever lived , uninspired ). We are often told that we limit the atonement of christ , because we say that Christ has not made a satisfaction for all men , or all would be saved . Now , our reply to this is , that , on the other hand , our opponents limit it : we do not . The Arminians say , Christ died for all men . Ask them what they mean by it . Did Christ die so as to secure the salvation of all men ? They say , " No, certainly not . " We ask them the next question -- Did Christ die so as to secure the salvation of any man in particular ? They answer " No ." They are obliged to admit this , if they are consistent . They say , " No; Christ has died that any man may be saved if " -- and then follow certain conditions of salvation .
We say, then , we will go back to the old statement -- Christ did not die so as beyond a doubt to secure the salvation of anybody , did He ? You must say " No;" you are obliged to say so , for you believe that even after a man has been pardoned , he may yet fall from grace , and perish . Now , who is it that limits the death of Christ ? Why , you . You say that Christ did not die so as to infallibly secure the salvation of anybody . We beg your pardon , when you say we limit Christ's death ; we say , " No , my dear sir , it is you that do it ." We say Christ so died that He infallibly secured the salvation of a multitude that no man can number , who must be saved , and cannot by any possibility run the hazard of being anything but saved . You are welcome to your atonement ; you may keep it . We will never renounce ours for the sake of it .

Yes, ole' CHS most certainly taught definite atonement.

 

[Rippon]

R.P.

Now, beloved, when you hear any one laughing or jeering at a limited atonement , you may tell him this . General atonement is like a great wide bridge with only half an arch ; it does not go across the stream : it only professes to go half way ; it does not secure the salvation of anybody . Now , I had rather put my foot upon a bridge as narrow as Hungerford , which went all the way across , than on a bridge that was as wide as the world , if it did not go all the way across the stream .

Agreed, CHS preached most forcefully on definite redeption.

 

[Rippon]

A long time ago I bought this book which was a collection of sermons Charles Spurgeon made between 1856-1883 . These are not the only messages he delivered on this expansive subject and doctrines akin to it . But as it has been expressed on other threads , Charles Spurgeon was indeed a strong Calvinist . He did not hide the fact . He didn't mention God's sovereignty only occasionally . He did not view it as a minor matter . He was not an Arminian by any stretch . I personally do not see how anyone who claims to be honest and yet a Spurgeon admirer , can claim that the Prince of Preachers was anything but a proclaimer of free grace and against free will .

I will cite selections from some of these sermons for your edification .The first is from : A Defense Of Calvinism .

...there is no such as preaching Christ and Him crucified , unless we preach what nowadays is called Calvinism . It is a nickname to call it Calvinism ; Calvinism is the gospel , and nothing else . I do not believe we can preach the gospel , if we do not preach justification by faith , without works ; nor unless we exalt the electing , unchangeable , eternal , immutable , conquering love of Jehovah ; nor do I think we can preach the gospel , unless we base it upon the special and particular redemption of His elect and chosen people which Christ wrought out upon the cross ...

This thread is rebuke to a confused poster who wrongly thinks "Spurgeon was conflicted over Calvinism." The poster, more than likely has been deluded by David Cloud and others of the same mindset.

 

[Rippon]

Particular Redemption ( 2/28/1858 )

We hold -- we are not afraid to say that we believe -- that Christ came into this world with the intention of saving " a multitude which no man can number ," and we believe that as a result of this , every person for whom He died must , beyond the shadow of a doubt , be cleansed from sin , and stand , washed in blood , before the Father's throne . We do not believe that Christ made any effectual atonement for those who are for ever damned ; we dare not think that the blood of Christ was ever shed with the intention of saving those whom God foreknew never could be saved , and some of whom were even in Hell when Christ , according to some men's account , died to save them .

This is to disabuse the assertions of a poster who claims that Spurgeon did not believe in Limited Atonement, which more correctly can be called Particular Redemption.

 

[Rippon]

Continuing with Particular Redemption ...

I must now return to that controverted point again . We are told ( I mean those of us who are commonly nicknamed by the title of Calvinists -- and we are not very much ashamed of that ; we think Calvin , after all , knew more about the Gospel than almost any man who has ever lived , uninspired ). We are often told that we limit the atonement of Christ , because we say that Christ has not made a satisfaction for all men , or all would be saved . Now , our reply to this is , that , on the other hand , our opponents limit it : we do not . The Arminians say , Christ died for all men . Ask them what they mean by it . Did Christ die so as to secure the salvation of all men ? They say , " No, certainly not . " We ask them the next question -- Did Christ die so as to secure the salvation of any man in particular ? They answer " No ." They are obliged to admit this , if they are consistent . They say , " No; Christ has died that any man may be saved if " -- and then follow certain conditions of salvation .
We say, then , we will go back to the old statement -- Christ did not die so as beyond a doubt to secure the salvation of anybody , did He ? You must say " No;" you are obliged to say so , for you believe that even after a man has been pardoned , he may yet fall from grace , and perish . Now , who is it that limits the death of Christ ? Why , you . You say that Christ did not die so as to infallibly secure the salvation of anybody . We beg your pardon , when you say we limit Christ's death ; we say , " No , my dear sir , it is you that do it ." We say Christ so died that He infallibly secured the salvation of a multitude that no man can number , who must be saved , and cannot by any possibility run the hazard of being anything but saved . You are welcome to your atonement ; you may keep it . We will never renounce ours for the sake of it .

Wise words from Spurgeon the Calvinist who obviously believed in Particular Redemption.

 

[Rippon]

R.P.

Now, beloved, when you hear any one laughing or jeering at a limited atonement , you may tell him this . General atonement is like a great wide bridge with only half an arch ; it does not go across the stream : it only professes to go half way ; it does not secure the salvation of anybody . Now , I had rather put my foot upon a bridge as narrow as Hungerford , which went all the way across , than on a bridge that was as wide as the world , if it did not go all the way across the stream .

The above are not the words of a "conflicted Calvinist" whatsoever.

 

[OldRegular]

Wise words from Spurgeon the Calvinist who obviously believed in Particular Redemption.

I expect that most Baptists, if not all, on this BB are one point Calvinists!

 

[Rippon]

I expect that most Baptists, if not all, on this BB are one point Calvinists!

Please expand your thoughts on this. I am not following you.

 

[Iconoclast]

Yes, ole' CHS most certainly taught definite atonement.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

[Iconoclast]

This thread is rebuke to a confused poster who wrongly thinks "Spurgeon was conflicted over Calvinism." The poster, more than likely has been deluded by David Cloud and others of the same mindset.

I saw one person who said he documented it

 

[Iconoclast]

The above are not the words of a "conflicted Calvinist" whatsoever.

There was a person who was going to lecture everyone on C.H.Spurgeon and how he was not really a cal:laugh:

 

[Rippon]

There was a person who was going to lecture everyone on C.H.Spurgeon and how he was not really a cal:laugh:

DHK likes to try his hand at revisionist history. He vainly attempts to characterize Erasmus and Tyndale as Baptistic, for example.

 

[OldRegular]

Please expand your thoughts on this. I am not following you.

Point #5, Perseverance of the Saints, Security of the Believer, or Once Saved Always Saved. This latter is preferred by the One Point Baptists!

 

[DHK]

The following is not from the book . It is taken from Spurgeon's sermon called : " A Bad Excuse Is Worse Than None . " Off-hand I don't know when he preached this .

" Well," says another , " I would believe in Christ , but I do not know whether I am one of God's elect or not . Sir, that doctrine of election troubles and staggers me . If I knew I was one of the elect , I would trust Christ . " That is -- if God will show you His secrets , then you will do God's will , and so the Almighty is to bend to your conditions , and then you will do as He bids you ! You will come to feast at the man's table , if he will take you into his secret closet , and show you all his treasure ! He will do nothing of the kind . How foolish this talk is about election ! The doctrine of election is a great and precious truth , but it never can be a valid reason for a man's not believing in Christ ... I will tell you this , if you will not believe in Jesus Christ , you will be damned , be you who you may , but you will not be able to lay it at predestination's door ; it will lie at your own ... When men are hard-up for an excuse , they are glad to run to the mysteries of God to use them as a veil to cover their faces . O my dear friends , you must know that though God has a chosen people , yet when He commands you to believe in Christ , His having a chosen people , or not having a chosen people cannot excuse you from obedience to the divine command : " Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ , and thou shalt be saved . "

When men are hard-up for an excuse , they are glad to run to the mysteries of God to use them as a veil to cover their faces . O my dear friends , you must know that though God has a chosen people , yet when He commands you to believe in Christ , His having a chosen people , or not having a chosen people cannot excuse you from obedience to the divine command : " Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ , and thou shalt be saved .

Not very Calvinistic is it?
Don't make excuses. Simply "believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved."

 

[DHK]

Yes, ole' CHS most certainly taught definite atonement.

You don't read well. His position was not TULIP. He did not believe in a limited atonement. Didn't you read what he said??

[FONT=&quot]). We are often told that we limit the atonement of christ , because we say that Christ has not made a satisfaction for all men , or all would be saved . Now , our reply to this is , that , on the other hand , our opponents limit it : we do not . ..

[/FONT][FONT=&quot]We say Christ so died that He infallibly secured the salvation of a multitude that no man can number , who must be saved , and cannot by any possibility run the hazard of being anything but saved .

In this post he was simply opposing the doctrine of "falling from grace" that the Arminians believed. If they lost their salvation then "they" were limiting the power of Christ.

You will find, as in other posts, that "the multitude" that are saved, are not a select group that the Calvinist of today calls the elect, but rather those who have come and believed on Christ. [/FONT]

 

[Rippon]

When men are hard-up for an excuse , they are glad to run to the mysteries of God to use them as a veil to cover their faces . O my dear friends , you must know that though God has a chosen people , yet when He commands you to believe in Christ , His having a chosen people , or not having a chosen people cannot excuse you from obedience to the divine command : " Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ , and thou shalt be saved .

Not very Calvinistic is it?

Only to one such as yourself with a warped understanding despite more than a decade of corrections that have come your way. You are too hard-headed to accept reproof.

 

[Rippon]

His position was not TULIP.

"We believe in the five great points commonly known as Calvinistic; but we do not regard these points as being barbed shafts which we are to thrust between the ribs of our fellow Christians. We look upon them as being five great lamps which irradiate the cross; or, rather, five bright emanations springing from the glorious covenant of our Triune God, and illustrating the great doctrine of Jesus crucified."

He did not believe in a limited atonement.

"...nor do I think we can preach the gospel, unless we base it upon the special and particular redemption of His elect and chosen people which Christ wrought out upon the cross..."

In this post he was simply opposing the doctrine of "falling from grace" that the Arminians believed. If they lost their salvation then "they" were limiting the power of Christ.

No, Christ has not made a satisfaction for all or then all would be saved.

You will find, as in other posts, that "the multitude" that are saved, are not a select group that the Calvinist of today calls the elect, but rather those who have come and believed on Christ.

You are one bundle of confusion. What Spurgeon regarded as the elect, is what Calvinists today believe. The elect are His chosen ones --chosen before the foundation of the world. It is this group alone for whom Christ died and made satisfaction for. The scope, design and intent of His cross-work was for them alone. Christ died for the sheep --not the goats. He laid down His life for them alone. He purchased the Chruch with His own blood.

 

[Yeshua1]

"We believe in the five great points commonly known as Calvinistic; but we do not regard these points as being barbed shafts which we are to thrust between the ribs of our fellow Christians. We look upon them as being five great lamps which irradiate the cross; or, rather, five bright emanations springing from the glorious covenant of our Triune God, and illustrating the great doctrine of Jesus crucified."

"...nor do I think we can preach the gospel, unless we base it upon the special and particular redemption of His elect and chosen people which Christ wrought out upon the cross..."



No, Christ has not made a satisfaction for all or then all would be saved.

You are one bundle of confusion. What Spurgeon regarded as the elect, is what Calvinists today believe. The elect are His chosen ones --chosen before the foundation of the world. It is this group alone for whom Christ died and made satisfaction for. The scope, design and intent of His cross-work was for them alone. Christ died for the sheep --not the goats. He laid down His life for them alone. He purchased the Chruch with His own blood.

The contex in which Calvin stated those beliefs of his are everything!

 

[Rippon]

The Blood Of The Everlasting Covenant was preached by Charles Spurgeon on 9/4/1859. Extracts will follow.

"But why were certain men the objects of it [the everlasting covenant] and why not others?...It was not the merit of man, it was nothing which God foresaw in us that made him choose many and leave others to go on in their sins. It was nothing in them, it was sovereignty and grace combined that made the divine choice."

"His sovereignty elected, and his grace distinguished, and immutabiliity decreed. No motive dictated the election of individuals, except a motive in himself of love and of divine sovereignty."

"The decree is limited, but the good news is as wide as the world."

"The secret of God, which is to deal with the application, that is restricted to God's chosen ones, but not the message, for that is to be proclaimed to all nations."

 

[Rippon]

His position was not TULIP. He did not believe in a limited atonement.

You are facing a barrage of truth DHK. You need to do the right thing and admit the truth. Man-up.

In the inaugural ceremonies of the Metropolitan Tabernacle Spurgeon personally chose five men to expound the doctrines of Calvinism.

Human Depravity -- Evan Probert
Election -- John Bloomfield
Particular Redemption -- J. A. Spurgeon
Effectual Calling -- James Smith
The Final Perseverance of Believers in Christ Jesus -- William O'Neil