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Featured Historical usage of Words reveals the Contextual Meaning

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by Van, May 11, 2024.

  1. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Notice the effort to change the subject to my behavior. This is the calling card of those attempting to derail discussion of Bible Study and the results that identify false doctrine like the following:

    Historical meaning of "all" (pas) is referring to all of whatever is in view, not everything imaginable.

    Thus when "pas" is translated as "all things" we need to drop the red flag on the translators, and interpret the phrase as meaning "all these" such that we look for the contextual meaning.

    Matthew 11:27 (NASB)
    “All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son determines to reveal Him.

    Here "all things" actually refers to "all these revelations that lead to repentance" are in view.


    Matthew19:26 (NASB]
    And looking at them, Jesus said to them, “With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”

    Here "all things" refers to the salvation of people, thus "with God all salvations are possible."

    When we see the phrase, look for what is in view contextually.​
     
  2. Scripture More Accurately

    Scripture More Accurately Well-Known Member

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    Notice how Van makes himself to be wiser than the Spirt who chose the exact phrasing of what He inspired to be written--"the Lord opened her heart." Van claims that this is "a vague phrase," yet somehow, we are supposed to accept his biased explanation that he offers that denies that the phrase denotes a supernatural work of God.

    Try again to handle the text without distorting what the text says. The text says that God opened her heart. You do not get to explain away explicit revelation from the Spirit.
     
    #62 Scripture More Accurately, May 21, 2024
    Last edited: May 21, 2024
  3. Marooncat79

    Marooncat79 Well-Known Member
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    @Van. Here’s an “All” for you

    In II Thess 3:2, Paul writes “not all have faith”

    does that really mean all?
     
  4. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    This phrase is vague folks, as it does say whether God opened her heart by providing an understandable explanation, revelatory grace, or whether He altered her ability to understand using "irresistible grace." I am charged with making myself wiser than the Spirit, but those who go with a much more inventive explanation are not. Go figure.

    Now take a studied look at Acts 17:3:
    Act 17:3
    [fn]explaining and setting forth evidence that the]Christ had to suffer and rise from the dead, and saying, “This Jesus whom I am proclaiming to you is the Christ.”

    NASB Footnote: Literal "opening"​

    Here the same Greek word that was translated "opening" in Acts 16:14) is now translated as "explaining." So the bogus charge of SMA must also be applied to all who understand the word's meaning according to its historical and contextual meaning. No need to figure. :)
     
  5. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    LOL, all always means all. DUH

    The issue, if this is not too deep, is all of what? Here all refers to men (humans) and not all humans have faith. This is obvious.
     
  6. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    Lol...
     
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  7. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Opening = historical meaning - explaining, making clear.
    Opening = redefined meaning - irresistible grace.

    Those that use vague phrases and words to pour false doctrine into the text sometimes charge those posting an historical meaning based on context with their mendacity.

    All things = contextual meaning - all of the things in view.
    The things = contextual meaning - the things, whether all or part, of whatever is in view contextually.

    How many times does this need to be explained, the context of 1 Corinthians 2:14, teaches "the things" are not "all the things" but only the "spiritual solid food things" for Paul uses the "spiritual milk things" to speak to "men of flesh." ​
     
    #67 Van, May 24, 2024
    Last edited: May 24, 2024
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  8. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    How many times does this need to be explained? The context shows two kinds of men.

    One is born of the spirit and is able to know the things of God:

    12 But we received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is from God; that we might know the things that were freely given to us of God.

    The other is the natural man, void of the spirit, and is unable to discern the things of the spirit of God (John 3:3), in fact they're foolishness to him (1 Corinthians 1:18):

    14 Now the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

    The 'thing' most foolish to him is THE GOSPEL:

    18 For the word of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us who are saved it is the power of God. 1 Cor 1
     
  9. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    Once again this poster ignores the issue and fills his post with non-germane verbiage.

    1) Is that fact 1 Corinthians 2:14 addresses two kinds of people, those indwelt and those not indwelt is dispute? Nope

    2) Is the fact the one indwelt is able to know the things of God in dispute? Nope

    3) Is the fact the one indwelt was freely given the Spirit so that they could know the things of God in dispute? Nope

    4) What is the difference between those who are perishing and those who are being saved. Those who do not believe the gospel are perishing, and those who believe the gospel are being saved. Both of these two groups were "natural" (not indwelt) when they received or have not received the gospel message.

    5) Once again 1 Corinthians 2:14 does not say, "all the things" and based on 1 Corinthians 3:1, the things the non-indwelt person cannot receive are the spiritual solid food things, because Paul spoke "as to men of flesh" using the spiritual milk things.
     
  10. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    So, the gospel is foolishness to these 'babes in Christ'? That goes far beyond mere 'carnality'.

    18 For the word of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us who are saved it is the power of God. 1 Cor 1

    14 Now the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually discerned 1 Cor 2
     
  11. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    On and on, one bogus claim after another, with no quotes. Obviously no said the gospel was foolishness to babes in Christ!!!!!!
    Are babes in Christ perishing? Nope, they have received the gospel.

    Folks, do not become blinded by false doctrines from the dark ages.
    4) What is the difference between those who are perishing and those who are being saved. Those who do not believe the gospel are perishing, and those who believe the gospel are being saved. Both of these two groups were "natural" (not indwelt) when they received or have not received the gospel message.

    5) Once again 1 Corinthians 2:14 does not say, "all the things" and based on 1 Corinthians 3:1, the things the non-indwelt person cannot receive are the spiritual solid food things, because Paul spoke "as to men of flesh" using the spiritual milk things. The gospel is spiritual milk, not spiritual solid food.​
     
  12. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    No quotes? You're just as dishonest as another ranting anti-Cal I know. I provided TWO quotes from scripture.

    What prevents you from discerning that 1:18 and 2:14 are speaking of the same man?:

    18
    For the word of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us who are saved it is the power of God. 1 Cor 1

    14 Now the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually discerned 1 Cor 2

    ...and that 3:1 is in no way related?:

    1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, as unto babes in Christ. 1 Cor 3
     
  13. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    1) Note the post opens with an ad homenim, the calling card of falsehood.

    2) Note the effort at insinuating guilt by association, yet another calling card of falsehood.

    3) The quote in view was not referring to the non-germane verbiage, but to this false allegation:
    So, the gospel is foolishness to these 'babes in Christ'? ​

    Here is my actual quote:
    Once again 1 Corinthians 2:14 does not say, "all the things" and based on 1 Corinthians 3:1, the things the non-indwelt person cannot receive are the spiritual solid food things, because Paul spoke "as to men of flesh" using the spiritual milk things.​
     
  14. kyredneck

    kyredneck Well-Known Member
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    What prevents you from discerning that 1:18 and 2:14 are speaking of the same man?:

    18
    For the word of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us who are saved it is the power of God. 1 Cor 1

    14 Now the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him; and he cannot know them, because they are spiritually discerned 1 Cor 2

    ...and that 3:1 is in no way related?:

    1 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, as unto babes in Christ. 1 Cor 3
     
  15. Van

    Van Well-Known Member
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    What prevents you from addressing the issue, rather than making false claims about me?

    Are babes in Christ perishing? Nope, they have received the gospel.

    Folks, do not become blinded by false doctrines from the dark ages.
    4) What is the difference between those who are perishing and those who are being saved. Those who do not believe the gospel are perishing, and those who believe the gospel are being saved. Both of these two groups were "natural" (not indwelt) when they received or have not received the gospel message.

    5) Once again 1 Corinthians 2:14 does not say, "all the things" and based on 1 Corinthians 3:1, the things the non-indwelt person cannot receive are the spiritual solid food things, because Paul spoke "as to men of flesh" using the spiritual milk things. The gospel is spiritual milk, not spiritual solid food.

    Why did Paul speak to new Christians in the same why He spoke to non-Christians? Because both can understand and grow from God's revelation, the fundamentals of the Gospel, the Spiritual Milk for the lost.
     
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