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What Doctrine could keep us from Heaven?

Salty

Salty

20,000 Posts Club
Administrator
On another thread it was asked about doctrine : (post # 19)

I said this:
Charlie -
As I look at my answer - it might appear I disagree with you .
Quite the opposite - I do agree with you.
Looks like I was playing "Devils advocate"

So what doctrines would actually keep us from true salvation.
how about if a person did not believe in Lake of Fire or the Devil?
A person believes baptism is necessary to complete salvation
A person believes you are not truly saved until you speak in tongues?
 
JonC

JonC

Moderator
Moderator
Doctrines that deny the gospel of Jesus Christ.

I will say that sometimes it may not be actual doctrines that keep us from being saved but how these doctrines are held.

We are commanded not to lean on our own understanding but on every word that comes forth from God.
We are warned that philosophies can carry us away.

Doctrine itself does not save. When we trust in our own understanding then we are trusting in ourselves (men may have told us that the Bible really teaches this or that, but these men are a dime a dozen and people are the ones who pick which ones to believe). It is literally not repenting from the flesh.

So many doctrines that may be wrong but not indicate a person is lost may also indicate the person is lost by how they are held. We see dimly as through a glass, sp we all lack perfect understanding.
 
Reformed

Reformed

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The only "doctrine" that can keep a person from heaven is not actually a doctrine. It is unbelief. Unbelief manifests itself in heresies like Arianism and Gnosticism. When you hear of notable preachers abandoning orthodoxy for falsehood it is not those false teachings that are leading them astray. It is an unbelieving heart.

Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God.

New American Standard Bible: 1995 update (Heb 3:12). (1995). The Lockman Foundation.
 
C

Charlie24

Well-Known Member
Salty said:
On another thread it was asked about doctrine : (post # 19)

I said this:
Charlie -
As I look at my answer - it might appear I disagree with you .
Quite the opposite - I do agree with you.
Looks like I was playing "Devils advocate"

So what doctrines would actually keep us from true salvation.
how about if a person did not believe in Lake of Fire or the Devil?
A person believes baptism is necessary to complete salvation
A person believes you are not truly saved until you speak in tongues?
Click to expand...

It's all the ones we add to faith in Christ as mandatory for salvation. Whatever that may be.

Rom. 11:6

"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."

Anything and everything we add to faith for salvation is works.
 
JonC

JonC

Moderator
Moderator
atpollard said:
I would say doctrines that deny the PERSON of Jesus Christ. (That which places faith in a man-made version of Christ that substitutes a “Jesus shaped idol” for the real thing).
Click to expand...
I agree.

I am not sure how @Salty means the OP to go. I have said before, for example, that there is a difference between not believing Jesus and the Father are One but different in persons and denying that truth.
 
atpollard

atpollard

Well-Known Member
JonC said:
I agree.

I am not sure how @Salty means the OP to go. I have said before, for example, that there is a difference between not believing Jesus and the Father are One but different in persons and denying that truth.
Click to expand...
Absolutely. One can embrace “modalism” and be SAVED but WRONG, yet if one embraces “Jesus was a great man, but not God“ (like Islam, for example), one is both WRONG and WITHOUT A SAVIOR.

Romans 10:9-10 [CSB] If you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. One believes with the heart, resulting in righteousness, and one confesses with the mouth, resulting in salvation.
 
atpollard

atpollard

Well-Known Member
Charlie24 said:
It's all the ones we add to faith in Christ as mandatory for salvation. Whatever that may be.

Rom. 11:6

"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."

Anything and everything we add to faith for salvation is works.
Click to expand...
I must respectfully disagree.
The question is what would keep us from heaven, and I find it incredulous that one could confess their sins and place the trust in their eternal salvation in Jesus Christ and the Cross, yet be turned away at the gates of heaven and cast into eternal damnation because they believed “Baptism is a Sacrament” (part of the effective means that God uses to accomplish His salvific work).

As a die-hard monergist, the issue seems far more binary to me … the Father chose you and you have been transformed by the encounter with the Son; or not.
 
C

Charlie24

Well-Known Member
atpollard said:
I must respectfully disagree.
The question is what would keep us from heaven, and I find it incredulous that one could confess their sins and place the trust in their eternal salvation in Jesus Christ and the Cross, yet be turned away at the gates of heaven and cast into eternal damnation because they believed “Baptism is a Sacrament” (part of the effective means that God uses to accomplish His salvific work).

As a die-hard monergist, the issue seems far more binary to me … the Father chose you and you have been transformed by the encounter with the Son; or not.
Click to expand...

Well, I guess we disagree, but that's nothing new around here.

Another reason I believe what I believe is found in Rom. 4:14,

"For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:"

Some say the Law here only applies to the exact Law of Moses, I disagree.

The Law was a system of works, and here Paul includes all works, anything that is not Grace.

So I see water baptism, or anything else made mandatory for salvation along with Grace through faith, cancels out the Grace.
 
S

Scripture More Accurately

Well-Known Member
The Gospels reveal that Jesus spoke many times about the devil. In view of that biblical evidence, a professing Christian who denies the existence of the devil is not a true believer because he would have to believe that Jesus was wrong when He made all those statements.

Jesus would not be and could not be God if He were ever wrong about anything that He said. A professing Christian who holds that Jesus was wrong when He spoke about the devil is someone who believes in another Jesus and not in the One that the Bible reveals to be incarnate Deity.
 
atpollard

atpollard

Well-Known Member
Charlie24 said:
So I see water baptism, or anything else made mandatory for salvation along with Grace through faith, cancels out the Grace.
Click to expand...
So, for the record, you view all who embrace the concept of “Sacraments” as damned because of a salvation by works, right?

All Catholics are damned.
All Lutherans are damned.
All Anglicans are damned.

However much faith they place in Christ, irrespective of God’s grace … they are disqualified from the possibility of salvation by their belief in effectual works as a means of grace.

Yup, we disagree.
 
C

Charlie24

Well-Known Member
atpollard said:
So, for the record, you view all who embrace the concept of “Sacraments” as damned because of a salvation by works, right?

All Catholics are damned.
All Lutherans are damned.
All Anglicans are damned.

However much faith they place in Christ, irrespective of God’s grace … they are disqualified from the possibility of salvation by their belief in effectual works as a means of grace.

Yup, we disagree.
Click to expand...

Yes, we disagree.

I remember Paul telling the Galatians "you have fallen from Grace" when the Judaists came and convinced them they couldn't be saved unless they were circumcised.

Of course I seriously doubt we agree on what this means.
 
atpollard

atpollard

Well-Known Member
Charlie24 said:
Yes, we disagree.

I remember Paul telling the Galatians "you have fallen from Grace" when the Judaists came and convinced them they couldn't be saved unless they were circumcised.

Of course I seriously doubt we agree on what this means.
Click to expand...
Thank you for the exchange … vigorous without being “unchristian” (for either of us). Knowing what we DO NOT believe, helps us clarify what it is that we DO believe. :)
 
C

Charlie24

Well-Known Member
atpollard said:
Thank you for the exchange … vigorous without being “unchristian” (for either of us). Knowing what we DO NOT believe, helps us clarify what it is that we DO believe. :)
Click to expand...

Yes, I agree, it's good to have an exchange the way it should be.

I know we all have our differences on what gets us into heaven or keeps us out, that is sad above all that I can imagine.

We can't be passive when it comes to salvation, this is eternity we're talking about.

God expects us to get it right, and that gate is narrow in many ways.

This is a subject that's quick to strike a nerve, don't want to take it to far, but we need to be absolutely sure we have it right.
 
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