Understanding 2 Thessalonians 2:13

Van · 2026-01-06T10:47:40-0600

Brightfame52 said:
False, Sanctification by the Spirit describes the means the beloved chosen ones from the beginning, believe the Truth. Belief of the truth here is the Salvation contemplated. This is in opposition to the non elect in Vs 10-12

More 'taint so" nonsense. Sanctification by the Spirit describes the means by which the individual is chosen, they are set apart in Christ. And the basis for this choice of those individuals is their faith in the truth when credited by God as righteousness. Those that reject the gospel, reject the love of the Truth, in that He died for us while we were yet sinners.
This could not be more obvious.

Van · 2026-01-06T10:50:21-0600

2Th 2:10 CSB
and with every wicked deception among those who are perishing. They perish because they did not accept the love of the truth and so be saved.

Those chosen for salvation were chosen through or on the basis of their love of the truth, whereas those not chosen did not accept the love of the truth, the love of Christ, dying for them while they were yet sinners.

Everyone believing in Him will not perish but have everlasting life.

First you believe, then if God credits that belief as righteousness, you are saved.

Therefore election for salvation is conditional. Case closed!

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-06T10:54:51-0600

Van said:
More 'taint so" nonsense. Sanctification by the Spirit describes the means by which the individual is chosen,

False the work of the Spirit is in time, election is before the elect are born, its from the beginning Gen 1:1

In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-06T10:59:14-0600

Silverhair said:
The plain reading of the text describes our conditional election for salvation.

False, thats merit base election

Van · 2026-01-06T11:00:35-0600

From the beginning of the New Covenant, God has chosen individuals for salvation by setting them apart in Christ based on crediting their faith in the truth as righteousness.

Faith before individual election to salvation, grace before corporate election of believers to planned means of redemption.

Van · 2026-01-06T11:03:04-0600

Silverhair said:
The plain reading of the text describes our conditional election for salvation.
God has chosen you from the beginning to be saved
1] by the sanctification of the Spirit
and
2] through faith in the truth
to which
3] He called you by our {Paul's} gospel,
for
4] the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ

God’s salvation comes “through the sanctification by the Spirit.” Yet, sanctification by the Holy Spirit is itself a post-conversion, faith induced experience. For the scriptures know nothing of a sanctified unbeliever. Again we see that God’s election to salvation is conditional rather than unconditional.

Superb post, true and solidly based on scripture. Election by Faith is according to grace, not works, Romans 4:16. Note, salvation does not depend upon the person who wills to be saved by placing his or her faith in Christ, it depends upon God who may have mercy and credit that faith as righteousness. Romans 9:16.

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-06T11:38:15-0600

Van said:
From the beginning of the New Covenant

Lol you just make up your own bible

Van said:
God has chosen individuals for salvation by setting them apart in Christ

Yes He chose them in Christ b4 the foundation of the world Eph 1:4 thats their sanctification in election eternally Jude 1:1

Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

Notice this sanctification is by the Father first ἠγίασμένοις its a perfect passive participle, The Father loved and set apart these ones in Christ, to be preserved and then called

Now we see b4 they are called in 2 Thess 2:13 they are sanctified by the Spirit to believe, and then called by the Gospel Vs 14

14 Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.

So calling by the Gospel is directed to the Spiritually sanctified

Martin Marprelate · 2026-01-06T12:26:15-0600

Van said:
From the beginning of the New Covenant, God has chosen individuals for salvation by setting them apart in Christ based on crediting their faith in the truth as righteousness.

Acts 15:18. 'Known to God from eternity are all His works.' 'Folks' should note how, in addition to butchering the Greek language, @Van does not hesitate to add to God's word to uphold his ropey theology.
I have had cause to mention this text before. Proverbs 30:5-6. Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you and you be found a liar.'
We have had 'The natural man does not receive the things of God except sometimes,' and now we have '...God chose you from the beginning of the new covenant for salvation.'
It's actually quite worrying.

Silverhair · 2026-01-06T12:48:28-0600

Brightfame52 said:
False, thats merit base election

Well as I see it we have two options. We can believe your false theology or we can believe the word of God.

Joh 3:16 ... that everyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Rom 10:13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth, ... and believe in your heart

Act 16:31 T..., “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved,

Rom 3:22 ... the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ

Rom 5:1 Therefore, having been justified by faith...

The Holy Spirit does not agree with you BF. Faith is the condition of ones salvation.

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-06T15:00:39-0600

Silverhair said:
Well as I see it we have two options. We can believe your false theology or we can believe the word of God.

Thats merit base salvation, God elected you supposedly because He saw something good in you [faith] that He didnt see in another. Thats pride

Silverhair · 2026-01-06T15:55:49-0600

Brightfame52 said:
Thats merit base salvation, God elected you supposedly because He saw something good in you [faith] that He didnt see in another. Thats pride

BF you have gone of the rails on this.

You are denying the clear word of God. That's arrogance on your part BF.

How can you call yourself a Christian when you deny the word of God?

You seem to think your calvinism is superior to the word of God.

Show me the verse that clearly says you are saved without any faith.

These verses leave no doubt that faith is required prior to salvation.

Joh 3:16 ... that everyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.

Rom 10:13 for, “Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth, ... and believe in your heart ... you will be saved

Act 16:30 ..."Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"
Act 16:31 ..., “Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved,

Rom 3:22 ... the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe.

Rom 5:1 Therefore, having been justified by faith we have peace with God

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-06T17:21:28-0600

Silverhair said:
BF you have gone of the rails on this.

You promote a merit base election/salvation, God sees your precious faith 2 Pet 1 1

Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

Silverhair · 2026-01-06T18:28:34-0600

Brightfame52 said:
You promote a merit base election/salvation, God sees your precious faith 2 Pet 1 1

Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

You clearly deny the word of God BF.

Faith is not merit it is a God stated condition.

God does see our faith and saves us, why is that so hard for you to accept BF?

You so committed to your man-made philosophy that you will deny God' word.

Peter was telling those to whom he was writing that all who are saved by the grace of God enjoy equal acceptance before Him.

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-06T20:08:50-0600

Silverhair said:
You clearly deny the word of God BF

It's you who teach the false Gospel of Salvation condition on man

Silverhair · 2026-01-06T20:24:32-0600

Brightfame52 said:
It's you who teach the false Gospel of Salvation condition on man

So you continue to deny what the Holy Spirit has said BF.

Joh 3:14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,
Joh 3:15 that everyone who believes in Him may have eternal life.
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that everyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through Him.
Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe has already been condemned, because he has not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.

The fact you will deny these clear texts really does make me wonder about your ability to look past your man-made philosophy.

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-07T03:52:17-0600

Silverhair said:
So you continue to deny what the Holy Spirit has said BF.

That is pride you met the condition to get saved, congratulations

Silverhair · 2026-01-07T08:54:35-0600

Brightfame52 said:
That is pride you met the condition to get saved, congratulations

Have you not read what I posted BF?

When the Holy Spirit says we have to believe prior to being saved why do you not agree with that?

Now as a Christian you should follow what Christ said, are you going to disagree with Him also?

Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not condemned;
but
he who does not believe is condemned already,
because
he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Could Christ have said it any clearer BF?

We have to believe prior to being saved if we do not then we are lost.

Van · 2026-01-07T10:33:19-0600

Martin Marprelate said:
Acts 15:18. 'Known to God from eternity are all His works.' 'Folks' should note how, in addition to butchering the Greek language, @Van does not hesitate to add to God's word to uphold his ropey theology.
I have had cause to mention this text before. Proverbs 30:5-6. Every word of God is pure; He is a shield to those who put their trust in Him. Do not add to His words, lest He rebuke you and you be found a liar.'
We have had 'The natural man does not receive the things of God except sometimes,' and now we have '...God chose you from the beginning of the new covenant for salvation.'
It's actually quite worrying.

Yes, I believe Calvinism adds man-made doctrine to scripture, and therefore the advocates of the fiction are liars.

But it is not useful to direct our efforts at personal disparagement, that only indicates a lack of scriptural substance for our beliefs

I have shown my understanding of 2 Thessalonians 2:13 explicitly.

I have sought feedback in order to arrive at consensus.

But what have I received?

1) The claim we are chosen then given faith. But the verse says we were chosen through or based upon faith in the truth.

2) Another suggestion was sanctification gave us faith. I explained both sanctification by the Spirit and faith in the truth were indirect objects of the verb chosen.

3) Another claim was because salvation is all of the Lord, and none of the individual being saved, God could not utilize our faith, if credited as righteousness, as the basis for election. But that is nonsense for faith is according to grace not works.

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-07T12:12:04-0600

Silverhair said:
Have you not read what I posted BF?

I read where you posted about conditions men must meet to get saved

Brightfame52 · 2026-01-07T12:16:42-0600

Van said:
1) The claim we are chosen then given faith. But the verse says we were chosen through or based upon faith in the truth.

Thats Truth 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and

Van said:
2) Another suggestion was sanctification gave us faith

Its Trus "sanctification of the Spirit did"

Understanding 2 Thessalonians 2:13

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