Silverhair
Well-Known Member
God can do as He likes and it would seem that He chose to have her preach the gospel message at that place and time.
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- Thread starter Salty
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God can do as He likes and it would seem that He chose to have her preach the gospel message at that place and time.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
Free speech is just that free speech.
But sometimes, it is how you say it. AKA using tact!
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
I agree tack is required but I have yet to see where she was not tactful.
But as you know no matter how tactful we are some will take offense at our comments.
canadyjd
Well-Known Member
canadyjd
Well-Known Member
You are not looking at it from the tribal people point of view. The smoking of the pipe is significant to them, whatever the meaning.
Very true, but nevertheless, let them be offended by the presentation of the gospel. This was viewed as an attack on their customs. That is not a presentation of the gospel.
So, the debate is now not about the truth of Jesus Christ and Him crucified for sins, is it?
It’s about an attack on their customs.
Peace to you
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
Don't they have free speech laws where you live?
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
By your logic we should never say anything as we are sure to offend someone.
What did you expect her to do, say that what they were doing was actually just another means of salvation.
Various groups have any number of things they believe or do that are significant to them but from a Christian perspective we have to ask will those things lead to their salvation or keep them lost.
From what I read in the article she made a comparison of what they were doing and the gospel. With one you remain lost and with the other you can be saved.
Here are some quotes from the article
“But I am a Christian preacher. I am a pastor and I preach the full counsel of God’s word,” she said.
Lucas said she’s not against the sun dance altogether: she supports fasting and praying as a whole concept. But she understands the ceremony also involves “the worship of the pipe,” she said, adding that’s idolatry, and irreconcilable with the teaching that “Jesus is the only way.”
She voiced mild surprise at the current outrage, saying community members have maligned Jesus and biblical teaching to her for years and she hasn’t retaliated.
Regarding the tribal community, Lucas said she loves them and wants to maintain a forgiving posture. She referenced the high suicide, poverty, and addiction rates of the reservation. And she reiterated part of the same message that sparked this clash.
“Only Jesus can turn a life around, can deliver somebody, can set somebody free,”
She should be commended for staying in a environment that is hostile to her and her message. She is a missionary to a lost people and she is getting pushback just as all missionaries have.
canadyjd
Well-Known Member
Really? That’s your take away?
To be clear, by my logic, don’t say anything that will distract from the gospel of Jesus Christ.
For the record, YOU are the one that has repeatedly stated the gospel of Jesus Christ is not necessary for salvation.
I expect preachers to not unnecessarily offend people by publicly mocking their traditions. Stick to the gospel.
Preach the gospel. That should clear up the misunderstandings.
Paul made a similar effort on Mars Hill, referencing their “unknown god”. He didn’t tell them they couldn’t be “saved”, but preached Jesus and Him crucified and resurrected.
The outcome?? They were offended by the gospel, not by him mocking their worship of an “unknown god”. Maybe follow Paul’s example as a better idea?
And yet she ignores the prohibition against women preachers and lying, because she’s not preaching that counsel from God, is she?
Agreed
Then write her a letter and tell her how much you admire her preaching.
Peace to you
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
Yes preach the gospel but yon need to show that what they believe is false or they will just see the gospel as another way to be saved.
I have said that God can and has saved people that have never heard the gospel or do you think no one in the OT was saved.
I agree that no one should go out of their way to insult people or mock their traditions but you also have to point out the error they believe do you not.
Only if they understand that what they believe now will not save them.
They were offended because he told them that the only way to salvation was through Christ Jesus not the many Gods that they worshiped.
So contrary to your view he would have pointed out their traditions were wrong.
She preached salvation through Christ Jesus is that not the counsel of God?
At least we agree on something
canadyjd
Well-Known Member
Scripture verses to support you need to show what they believe is false IN ADDITION to preaching the gospel?
Explained many times. You are incapable of understanding people in the OT were saved by grace, through faith in God’s promise of the coming Messiah.
You preach the gospel. Should God Holy Spirit draw them to the truth of Jesus Christ, you will have opportunity to disciple them. That is where you correct misunderstandings.
Scripture verses to support this claim they cannot be saved if they don’t understand.
You are in error because you don’t know what the scripture says. The folks on Mars Hill were offended by Paul’s claim Jesus was resurrected.
Again, you are in error because of your ignorance of what scripture actually says.
She claimed to preach the “whole counsel” of God. You quoted her. How could you miss that?
If she isn’t preaching women shouldn’t be pastors, she isn’t preaching the “whole counsel” of God is she?
Or do you believe just preaching the verses you agree with somehow counts as the “whole counsel” of God.
And so we do
Peace to you
Foxmeister
Active Member
If you preach the Gospel, there is no need to tell them their false gods are not real. The Gospel does that indirectly.
Some forget that there were a small number of people present on Mars Hill who were saved. Because of that, they believe Paul failed there. When many hear the Gospel at one time and only one accepts Jesus as their Savior, then it was a success. I'm not directing this at you because I know you know that. This is for others who may think otherwise.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
Is that not what you do when you speak to someone about their salvation?
Have you not read Heb 11.
They were saved by grace because that believed God was faithful. They did not hear the gospel message or the name of Jesus Christ.
Over the years I have dealt with Mormons, JW's, atheists, and those that just have no view at all and have found that you have to show them the error before they will listen to the truth. If they do not know they sick they do not seek a doctor.
Which showed them that their views were wrong.
How do you continue to miss what is right in front of you?
You mean I do not follow your particular view of what scripture says.
It is your view that is what scripture teaches but I see that God has and still uses those He chooses.
You continue to limit God.
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
If you do not point out the error then they just see the gospel as another way.
One of the hardest groups to reach are those that think they are saved.
I have spoken with enough people over the years to see this is true.