Mid-America Baptist Theological Seminary

SteganM,

I am a 1985 alum. I did a 96 sem hr ADiv degree. You must witness their way once a week to a lost person in order to get academic credit.

They are very stong SBC progam oriented, conservative, evangelical. You cannot go there if you have been divorced. You cannot be a woman and get into the MDiv degree program.

They prepare SBC people to do evangelism in any postion. Whatever one of their grads so, they will do it from an evangelist's view point. Very stoing on inerrancy and Biblical authority. Ultra conservative.

I will be glad to answer some direct questions if raised?! I live here near the school and go there often and still know the profs and some are friends of mine personally. I have an expertise in this area.

sdg!

rd

 

StephanM,

It was early this morning when I typed this, I am sorry I mispelled your name.

From MABTS' 2002-2004 catalogue pp. 38-39:

"Personal Witnessing:
All enrolled students must witness to an average of at least one person per week during the term. To constitute a personal witness, the interview is to include a presentation of the plan of salvation to a person believed to be unsaved and an invitation for that person to receive Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. . . ."

Further:

"(2) The student must witness to an average of at least one person per week during the term."

Further:

"However, no academic credit is given to any student for the term if he or she does not satisfy the minimal requirements for the Practical Missions Program for that term, . . . " and witnessing is one of three requirements.

I hope this helps. I would write and get a catalogue so I could see the program first hand. You can order it on line @ MABTS.edu.

If you have any more question please post them or email me off board!

sdg!

rd

 

StefanM,

First Question:

They are probably not any more or less Arminian than the SBC at-large.

There has been some circumstances there in the past that were quite devastating to some of us who are more Calvinistic than the "run of the mill SBC hand!" I cannot go into the details here, it is not the time and probably would not be ethical.

Secondly, they would mostly be "literal Kingdom of God on earh" with its different iterations. But, one would surely not be "looked down on" for holding some alternative view.

Thirdly, I would tell you up front that if you do not know anything about the "Landmark Baptists" you had better "get up to speed" on that issue if you go there. Many of the older profs hold that view of Church Theology.

Fourthly, if you are Calvinistic leaning you need to attach yourself to Dr. Jimmy Millikin and Dr. John Mahoney. They are "like minded." They will both work you "like a gov'ment mule" but are Godly men and you will learn much.

More questions!?

sdg!

rd

 

gb93433,

What do you understand the purpose of the MDiv degree to be? I am interested because of your comments about MABTS' evangelism ideals.

There seems to be two wide variances on the philosphies for the MDiv degree programs:

Is yours that:

The MDiv needs to train people who have BAs or BSs from other disciplines who need Bible, Theology, Church History, practical training, etc?

Or is yours that:

They should come to seminary with evanglism, missions, and practical stuff already "under their belts?"

It seems that you have told us where you believe the MDiv should lie. However, the programs cannot be that idealistic but must be done "in the real world. Many a young minister has "not a clue" when they get so seminary what will be expected of them. (Or for that matter what the ministry is!). Others, are blessed to have come from Bible college or Christian Liberal Arts Univ. and will have to repeat many things like OT & NT Surveys. Many come from evangelistic churches only. Others come from churches that will not even Baptize one who has not been through a "New Members" class or has been under "Watch Care" for several months.

Try to understand the different seminaries are doing the best they can, with what they have, where they are, with the $ they have, with their particular philosophy of ministry, under the Lord's leadership, at this place in their history.

Please try to temper your attitude a bit to be more loving because there is not a "one size fits all" theological education; or for that matter a "one size fits all" "philosophy of ministry!"

Questions &/or rebuttals welcome!?

sdg!

rd

 

gb93433,

I see things a bit differently from you, although I deeply appreciate your understandings.

I am not particularly defending MABTS point of view on evangelism. Or, do I think that there is not an ongoing need for discipleship. I see things from more of a Calvinistic Soteriologic sense.

I believe that what we need is both evangelism and discipleship. But, I believe that the "jerk them to Jesus" or so called "easy believism" techniques are NOT the Gospel necessarily. Just getting someone to pray the prayer to "close the deal" is not the Gospel spelled out in the NT. (In my humble but most accurate opinion! HA!!).

One of my profs at MABTS put it this way to me many years ago. "There is NO true evangelism because there is NO true evangel!"

I appreciate your continued interests and open attitudes in the discussion(s).

sdg!

rd

 

FYI!!

Today, May 10th, is the 20th Anniversay of my graduation from MABTS. I recieved my Diploma of Theology/Associate of Divinity on May 10th 1985.

Whatever can be said for it, it did set my feet on the path of higher education. If you can study there and do well you can go about anywhere and do the academic work.

In the "for what it's worth" column.

sdg!

rd

 

Dr. Tim,

On the continuum of <Investiagtion.................Indoctrination>, they are way to the right towards the end of indoctrination. This is my experience. I am an alum and have been around the school off and on since I graduated in 1985.

I would say that what you heard at NOBTS is probably for the most part true.

sdg!

rd

 

Dr. Tim.

Tell me what you mean by "recognition" and "tag" and I will be glad to give an informed opinion.

sdg!

rd

 

Pipedude,

Concerning MABTS' "theology teachers are nearly all Calvinist" (from above); AND IF THEY WERE THAT WOULD BOTHER YOU WHY!? (if it were true--and I don't necessarily grant it to be true?!) I am a five-point Calvinist, a 1985 Diploma of Theology grad, and have gone on to do doctoral work, and teach college at a Baptist institution, and have lived here, and been in constant touch with the school ever since.

Does the Calvinistic stream of SBC history offend you (generic YOU) so much that you "would bury your head (and heart) in the sand" and not consider the historical documents!?

Do you find it offensive that the four founder's of The Southern Baptist Theological Seminary were all "Fullerite" Calvinists; i.e., who believed in the sovereingty of God but had "a warm heart for the lost?!"

Do you find it offensive that these founder's had the influnence of Princeton on them?

Do you find it offensive that there was also the pietistic stream of SBC historical and theological thought who were more experientially oriented and less educated to be a major influence in SBC life!? (I do not necessarily agree w/them but will grant that they are part of my heritage and accept the brethren of this ilk and tint and hue w/open arms and in love).

Do you also find it offensive that this same "Southern Baptist Theological Seminary" to now be teaching these historic "Calvinistic" Doctrines; and that the president of said seminary holds to these doctrines and many who teach theology and baptist history there also hold to these doctrines?

Do you also find it offensive that there is a resurgence not only of Biblical and Theological conservatism but to those same doctrines unkindly and inadvertently known as "Tulip" or "Calvinism?"

Do you find it offensive that there has been a "ground swell" of individuals and groups like The Southern Baptist Founder's Conference" ministry bringing these doctrines to bear on church reformation and revival in the SBC?

I could go on with "Do you find it offensive. . . ?" but I think the point has been made.

My point is: PLEASE DO NOT BE OFFENDED BY WHAT USE TO BE COMMONLY HELD SBC THOUGHT!

Before you "jump" please look with great care and investigate whether or not what the convention has done since EY Mullins et al is really the Gospel? This "easy believism," "get them down the isle," "jerk them to Jesus," "close the salvation deal," seems to be a far cry from what Jesus and the Apostles seemed to teach and preach.

RSVPs expected!

sdg!

rd

 

Paul33,

Not having talked to each one individually, and not having a personal knowledge of each; I would not venture a guess.

I suppose one of the old "High Calvinist" would believe that the Father chose in eternity past, the Savior died for those for whom the Father chose, the Holy Spirit by the means of the preaching of the Gospel resurrects, regenerates, "quickens," justifies, sanctifies, & glorifies in time all those whom the Father chose in eternity past and for whom the Son died.

That may sound a bit simplistic (and probably is). But, sometimes it is much easier to stick with the exegesis of the Scripture rather than the philosophical and theological constructs.

Opinions, rebutals, and "angry exhortations" welcome and expected.

sdg!

rd