Search results

Dave Lets start out with Eph. I'm happy that it says so much of God's sovereignty, but that does not prove that man must be born again before He believes. Look at chapter two, vs. 1-10. Right in the midst of explaining spiritual life to death, he says this. vs. 5-6 even when we were dead in...

Dave G You're trying to reframe the discussion into an all or nothing argument. God's sovereignty vs. the flesh. God's sovereignty is not in question. What is in question is you're belief that a person must be born again to believe. Scripture does not allow your interpretation.

Hey Dave, thanks for the reply. It is vert important to recognize the transition taking place from the Old Covenant to the New Covenant, or the Old Testament to the New Testament. There are promises that were made way back in the OT that are being fulfilled at that transition. One of them is...

Yes E, we are all saved by the same cross, but it had to actually happen. For us, it already happened, for them it was still in promise only. It was owed to them. These promises were/are realized through the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, called the baptism/placing into/immersion with the Holy...

Hey KY These are two different discussions. You see it as black and white. In other words, if they weren't born again, then it must be from the flesh. But OT believers had the Holy Spirit upon them. That didn't make them born again, but it did have an effect on them. And there are other things...

Hebrews 9:16-17 For where there is a testament, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is in force after men are dead, since it has no power at all while the testator lives. John 1:12-13 is speaking of those who received Jesus during His earthy ministry...

@Silverhair I'll need to answer this tomorrow. I was expecting this thread to be closed. Maybe it will be tomorrow. If not....

This is one of a few proof texts used to prove that man must be born again before He can believe. The problem is that this text doesn't actually say that. John 1:12-13 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: who were...

Some people come to Scripture with preconceived ideas and try to smash those ideas into the text. I've seen it at both ends of the theological spectrum. They try to define the Bible by the system, instead of the other way around. Like the idea that man is born again before He comes to faith...

@Silverhair, do you hold Biblical consistency over theological consistency? God is sovereign over all things because He "works all things according to the counsel of His will" (Eph 1:11). And we know that those same things, "all things work together for good to those who love God" (Romans...

@Silverhair I think that we're on the same page, but there is some overlapping in the conversations going on. Romans tells us that this hardening was only partial, and while earned by these same unbelievers, was also used to usher in the Gentiles. Those passages spoken of as referring to mans...

In Galatians 5:22, I think the idea is faithfulness. In Romans 5:1-2, we have access to that grace by faith. Ephesians 2:8 says the same thing that we are saved by grace, through faith. In other words, faith takes u to that grace. Galatians 3:3 Paul asks the question, did we receive the Holy...

Hi bright The point being, if the remnant in vs 11:4-5 are already believe and are saved. Then the ones that are being provoked to jealousy Vs. 11, and the ones spoken of later to hopefully be grafted back in if they do not continue in unbelief vs. 23, must be different.

Romans 5:1-2 Therefore, having been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.

Contrast Romans 11:4-5, the remnant, with verse 14. these are not the same people.

Remember, a lot of these same people also believe that a person is born again before they come to faith, which I disagree with. Whether or not we come to faith from God or not, it's not from being born again. Being born again is always the result of faith. They see it as an all or nothing, since...

In the past I've always held to the idea that there is a passivity in Gods eternal decree. Not a bare permission, but a positive allowing. That 'predestined' speaks specifically of what He actually positively causes. So I always understood that the term 'ordained' encompasses God's complete...

What if what they believe is unbelief? John 12:40 "He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, Lest they should see with their eyes, Lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, So that I should heal them."

Both these first two OT passages are speaking of being born again, but still a future event to be realized. Later in John it's called the Promise of the Father. The Holy Spirit. OT-EZ 36:26-37 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of...

I believe that I addressed that idea in the OP. The context. Faith comes by hearing the Word of God. His Word in and of itself has the power to draw. Why did Jesus speak in parables? Because in seeing they might see, and hearing they might hear (Matthew 13:13, Mark 4:12). If they were dead and...