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In the meantime—see if you can use your ‘charming personality’ :smilewinkgrin: --to get more people involved in your original post—b/c the question itself is not only interesting, but it could have consequences on Rev 11 or vice-versa. Maybe someone who is adamantly ‘pro’ or ‘anti’ cessationist...

The elders do seem to play more of a priestly role than the living creatures, so I could see where they are more prominent in these actions. And the particular translation of v 9 you posted, with the pronoun ‘us’ would certainly favor what you’re saying. But V 9 has a textual variant & the...

Not sure if I follow the wording of your question—but along w/ the 24 elders, the 4 living creatures are also involved in rev 5:8-9--& they are angelic—so not sure how redemption being applied to angels is relevant—but as far as angelic redemption is concerned-- Heb 2 makes clear that they...

I completely agree with the idea that the “two” in Rev 11 is symbolic & not literal. For many of the same reasons you gave. The only noticeable difference would be the 24 elder identification, who I personally hold to be angelic in nature (divine council reference), but the connection w/ the...

Bib—now u know I love ya—& your probably my favorite older gentleman in California--but make sure your hearing me right—these are real questions—not statements—what marks the transition into the so-called ‘70th week’ of Daniel (out of the Apostolic era) & when will we know we are in this time...

Interesting post—didn’t plan on interacting so soon Bib--lol—but that’s a question I’ve looked at a lot over the past few years—I certainly agree that most professed prophets since the composition of Scripture—are indeed false! Most make these self-proclamations b/c they desire some kind of...

First I hope this shows why studying Gen 6 in depth is truly necessary. It not only has major consequences of biblical demonology—it also has consequences on one’s ability to protect against liberal attacks. Furthermore, I hope this demonstrates that I’m not “imagining” anything, nor am I making...

Biblicist-I applaud the effort & the fact you’ve obviously spent the last day researching & thinking about this topic for yourself. When it comes to gen 6—this is all I ever ask. But I do want to clarify a few things. First, your internet post by Majors & Apologetic press (Church of Christ...

the fact you consider these men 'modern scholars'--proves what i mean when I say your 'archaic!' You do understand that quoting these types would get you laughed out of a college classroom--b/c internet searches on outdated free commentaries-- no longer hold any weight in the world of...

Actually read what I just wrote—attempt to actually refute what I said by breaking it down sentence by sentence—then find scholarly evidence that supports your suggestion (like the articles & commentaries I gave)—then attempt to say to me that I’m in any way skipping or ignoring the context of...

You seem to ‘forget’ that Gen 6:2-4 is a “pre-flood event’! LOL—it actually sets the stage for the flood itself! Second—you forget—the Bible NEVER explains if the angels fell w/ Satan or if there was one angelic rebellion or many! All we know is that Satan himself fell before or possibly during...

The Biblicist—sorry for the delay- I’ve been slammed the past week & just got a chance to see you responded—thank you for taking the time to keep the conversation going –w/ this being said—let us continue—I find it interesting that you reply by saying: Contextually speaking, the text does not...

Thank you for the kind words, they were extremely encouraging & much needed. We often have no clue what’s going on in the personal life of the individual behind the BB post, & w/ out getting into detail, your positive words were truly an answered prayer. Thank you for that--& I have no problem...

The Biblicist-- procreation is certainly designed to be restricted to marriage, but does this stop humans from having premarital sex? No! And while overstepping this boundary causes procreation outside of marriage to be a sin, the fact is fallen & rebellious angels do/have sinned & clearly...

Actually everything I just went over briefly says otherwise And here is another issue that many modern scholars are connecting to the angelic understanding of Gen 6--its 1 Pet 3--here is a summary of the debate (its a handout i use for teaching) 1 Pet 3:18-20, 22-For Christ also suffered once...

Now you have finally said something that contributes! This is a good question--but you've failed to take in the proper order--for example the Trinity is illogical to the human mind--but Scripture affirms this so we know its true--the incarnation of Jesus being 100% God & 100% man in 1 undivided...

Give me 1 Bible verse that explains the make up of a spirit--give me 1 scientific study that has studied what makes up an angel--Give 1 shred of evidence that totally explains angelic capability when they (spirits) become tangible (in angelophany)--(& btw in possession they technical do control...

Did you even read my post? Please actually take the time to read what I'm saying--& more importantly address the theological issues I'm raising--if not its all good--no love lost--God bless & keep up your studies

Now its been a while since I’ve taken a chemistry class (about 10 years ago while finishing my undergrad)—but I do remember the professor addressing the issue of how certain gases (which are made up of chemical components) could be studied-- when they have no way of being observed by any of the...