RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
Please elaborate.
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2 Thess. 2:13-14, What does it say? pt2
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RipponRedeaux
Well-Known Member
The Canons of Dort were severely truncated in summary fashion in 1905 by Dr. Charles McAfee of Brooklyn, New York City. He gave a lecture for the very first time using the T.U.L.I.P acronym as a mnemonic devise. William H. Vail recorded the lecture in 1913.
He made it easy understand the basic scriptural propositions. I am thankful for his works.
McAfee led a full life as a pastor, professor, author, hymnwriter and lecturer, among other things.
Conditional election has no biblical merit and it is an attempt to lift up men while trying to diminish God.
What does the Bible teach about election?
Yet another taint so nonsense post, copy and pasting nonsense.
Folks, read the verse, individuals were chosen for salvation through faith in the truth. Game, set and match.
Salvation is wholly God's work, no need for false claims misrepresenting biblical truth.
please cite where the source word Trinity is used. I do not recall it. Thx
Silverhair
Well-Known Member
Note @JonC said the doctrine of the Trinity, not the word "trinity", is in the actual text of scripture.
The term "Trinity," coined by Tertullian, is not found in the bible, but the concept is pervasive.
Matthew 3:16-17; Matthew 28:19
John 14:26; John 15:26
Acts of the Apostles 2:32-33, Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39
Romans 8:1-4, Romans 8:8-10
I could provide more but I am sure that you get the idea. The Trinity is a biblical concept.
So, a clear explanation by John MacArthur, a Baptist pastor in high regard is nonsense to you.
The very verses we are looking at show us there is no "conditional election" in the verse. The concept of conditional election is manufactured by those who demand humans are the cause agents that effect God to action.
I am biased towards Systematic Theology, you are right there. The reason is that I have a degree in Systematic Theology. As a requirement I also had to take grad classes on Christian history (I say "had to", but I absolutely loved it).
What is interesting is that you identify Scripture as an early creed rather than a teaching of God through Paul. I have often heard some say certain passages may have been an early creed.
I cannot agree with you that Paul was quoting a creed rather than delivering to us God's Word. But that has more to do about my view of Scripture than it does with you (I believe Scripture is God's Word).
Yep.
The old "the word Trinity isn't in the Bible" so it does not matter that our doctrine isn't" is a foolish argument often made on this board by silly people.
The word Trinity is right next to the term Covenant of Redemption
There was a time Dispensationalism had not yet spread out of Calvinism.
Zwingli taught a covenant of grace and a covenant of works. But Covenant Theology as we know it was developed within the Presbyterian Church and spread from there (particularly within Reformed denominations, and sometimes as a justification for infant salvation).
@Marooncat79 ,
Please cite where I (or any other member) claimed that the word "Trinity" is used in Scripture.
As you can't (because I never claimed the word "Trinity" is used in Scripture) wouldn't you agree that is a very foolish request for you to make?
The word "Trinity" is not in the Bible.
You have been gone for a bit, so allow me to clarify.
Member 1 - "Jesus smoked pot".
Member 2 - "That's unbiblical"
Member 1 - "The word Trinity is not in the Bible, so saying Jesus smoked pot is no more unbiblical."
The point is NO member thus far has claimed that the word "Trinity" is in the Bible.
The entire "the word Trinity isn't in the Bible" is a foolish attempt to conceal the fact the one making the charge cannot defend his or her doctrine biblically.
We'd call it a "smoke screen", or if we were being specific it's "begging the question" (a juvenile logical fallacy used by those who cannot defend their arguments).
The difference here is DOCTRINE. I don't know if you understand what Systematic Theology means, but it is a science (a type of theology) that uses Biblical Theology (Biblical Theology is the theology of narrow portions of Scripture, typically an epistle or a specific book) throughout Scripture as a whole, philosophy, and Historical Theology (at a minimum) to form doctrine.
The hope is that Systematic Theology be biblical. Unfortunately often times it is not (as with Covenant Theology). This can be due to an error in Biblical Theology (some SDA theology, for example). It can be in Historical Theology by blindly accepting one tradition (as in the Penal Substitution Theory of Atonement). Or it can be an erroneous philosophy (,as with Covenant Theology).
Either way the result is ALWAYS the same - unbiblical doctrine.
We are being told the Covenant of Grace is unbiblical and a crutch that children need and they can feed on it. Two posters seek to speak against these truths.
Let's look at what others say about such things, others who have learned the truth;
Now, I want to read to you a quote and I want you to guess who said this:
"The doctrine of the Covenant lies at the root of all true theology. It has been said that he who well understands the distinction between the Covenant of Works and the Covenant of Grace is a master of divinity. I am persuaded that most of the mistakes which men make concerning the doctrines of Scriptures are based upon fundamental errors with regard to the covenants of law and the covenants of grace. May God grant us now the power to instruct and you the grace to receive instruction on this vital subject."
That wasn't a Presbyterian. That wasn't even an Anglican.
That was a Baptist. His name was C.H. Spurgeon. And he knew that Covenant Theology is at the heart of the Gospel ministry because Covenant Theology is the Gospel.
And if you don't understand Covenant Theology, you are not ready to convey the Gospel in all of its glory and in all of it fullness to the people of God and to those outside of the covenant in order to draw them in to the experience of the fullness of the Covenant mercies.
So what we are talking about is not something peripheral. We are not talking about something that simply divides Christians, like Dispensationalists or Baptists and Presbyterians.
We are talking about something that strikes at the very heart of our understanding of the person and work of Christ, of the Gospel of salvation, of redemptive history, of the relationship between the Old and the New Testament. Covenant Theology is that central
The immature child who needed this crutch that Spurgeon evidently needed, is Dr.J.Ligon Duncan pg8 on Covenant Theology.
What could he possibly know???
Let's look at what others say about such things, others who have learned the truth;
Now, I want to read to you a quote and I want you to guess who said this:
"The doctrine of the Covenant lies at the root of all true theology. It has been said that he who well understands the distinction between the Covenant of Works and the Covenant of Grace is a master of divinity. I am persuaded that most of the mistakes which men make concerning the doctrines of Scriptures are based upon fundamental errors with regard to the covenants of law and the covenants of grace. May God grant us now the power to instruct and you the grace to receive instruction on this vital subject."
That wasn't a Presbyterian. That wasn't even an Anglican.
That was a Baptist. His name was C.H. Spurgeon. And he knew that Covenant Theology is at the heart of the Gospel ministry because Covenant Theology is the Gospel.
And if you don't understand Covenant Theology, you are not ready to convey the Gospel in all of its glory and in all of it fullness to the people of God and to those outside of the covenant in order to draw them in to the experience of the fullness of the Covenant mercies.
So what we are talking about is not something peripheral. We are not talking about something that simply divides Christians, like Dispensationalists or Baptists and Presbyterians.
We are talking about something that strikes at the very heart of our understanding of the person and work of Christ, of the Gospel of salvation, of redemptive history, of the relationship between the Old and the New Testament. Covenant Theology is that central
The immature child who needed this crutch that Spurgeon evidently needed, is Dr.J.Ligon Duncan pg8 on Covenant Theology.
What could he possibly know???
Let's play a game.We are being told the Covenant of Grace is unbiblical and a crutch that children need and they can feed on it. Two posters seek to speak against these truths.
Let's look at what others say about such things, others who have learned the truth;
Now, I want to read to you a quote and I want you to guess who said this:
"The doctrine of the Covenant lies at the root of all true theology. It has been said that he who well understands the distinction between the Covenant of Works and the Covenant of Grace is a master of divinity. I am persuaded that most of the mistakes which men make concerning the doctrines of Scriptures are based upon fundamental errors with regard to the covenants of law and the covenants of grace. May God grant us now the power to instruct and you the grace to receive instruction on this vital subject."
That wasn't a Presbyterian. That wasn't even an Anglican.
That was a Baptist. His name was C.H. Spurgeon. And he knew that Covenant Theology is at the heart of the Gospel ministry because Covenant Theology is the Gospel.
And if you don't understand Covenant Theology, you are not ready to convey the Gospel in all of its glory and in all of it fullness to the people of God and to those outside of the covenant in order to draw them in to the experience of the fullness of the Covenant mercies.
So what we are talking about is not something peripheral. We are not talking about something that simply divides Christians, like Dispensationalists or Baptists and Presbyterians.
We are talking about something that strikes at the very heart of our understanding of the person and work of Christ, of the Gospel of salvation, of redemptive history, of the relationship between the Old and the New Testament. Covenant Theology is that central
The immature child who needed this crutch that Spurgeon evidently needed, is Dr.J.Ligon Duncan pg8 on Covenant Theology.
What could he possibly know???
Let's call it "The Integrity Test".
Please provide a quote of any member on this forum claiming the word "Trinity" is in the Bible.
It's a cool game as this is a Christian board and responses (or silence) often reveals character.
Not really.We are being told the Covenant of Grace is unbiblical and a crutch that children need and they can feed on it. Two posters seek to speak against these truths.
Let's look at what others say about such things, others who have learned the truth;
Now, I want to read to you a quote and I want you to guess who said this:
"The doctrine of the Covenant lies at the root of all true theology. It has been said that he who well understands the distinction between the Covenant of Works and the Covenant of Grace is a master of divinity. I am persuaded that most of the mistakes which men make concerning the doctrines of Scriptures are based upon fundamental errors with regard to the covenants of law and the covenants of grace. May God grant us now the power to instruct and you the grace to receive instruction on this vital subject."
That wasn't a Presbyterian. That wasn't even an Anglican.
That was a Baptist. His name was C.H. Spurgeon. And he knew that Covenant Theology is at the heart of the Gospel ministry because Covenant Theology is the Gospel.
And if you don't understand Covenant Theology, you are not ready to convey the Gospel in all of its glory and in all of it fullness to the people of God and to those outside of the covenant in order to draw them in to the experience of the fullness of the Covenant mercies.
So what we are talking about is not something peripheral. We are not talking about something that simply divides Christians, like Dispensationalists or Baptists and Presbyterians.
We are talking about something that strikes at the very heart of our understanding of the person and work of Christ, of the Gospel of salvation, of redemptive history, of the relationship between the Old and the New Testament. Covenant Theology is that central
The immature child who needed this crutch that Spurgeon evidently needed, is Dr.J.Ligon Duncan pg8 on Covenant Theology.
What could he possibly know???
Covenant Theology is a new way of viewing Scripture by viewing God's salvation economy under a specific set of covenants. Covenant Theology is based on 16th century ideas but was not developed until the 17th century.
The Apostles wrote nothing of Covenant Theology. Christianity knew nothing of Covenant Theology until Presbyterian theologians developed the idea
That does not mean it is wrong, but it is not in Scripture and it was foreign to Christianity until the 17th century. And even now it is a minority view primarily limited to Calvies.
It is a crutch some use to organize Scripture (and redemptive history) in a way they can understand. So it can be helpful, at least to make points about God's interaction with men. The issue is some love ve these crutches more than they love God's Word.
Thank you. Much of that actually came from a Calvinist scholar at Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary.More awesome posting,
Theology can be a difficult subject, but it is a worthwhile endeavor.
How are you coming on the "Integrity Game"? Did you find ANY post where a member claims the word "Trinity" is in the Bible?
Try using the "search" feature at the top of the page. Over the last twenty plus years surely somebody made the claim....right?
Now this is interesting.
The claim here is that nobody until at least the 17th century (until Covenant Theology was developed....perhaps longer depending on ones view) was ready to convey the Gospel in all its glory.
This is something to consider. It was not until the Presbyterian Church developed Covenant Theology as a method to view God's interaction with man that Christians could truly convey the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
We owe so much to the post-Reformation Presbyterian Church. They did what God could not do.
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