Ah, Will, you wrote an essay about me? I'm honored! Did you think by not putting my name on this post I would not respond?Originally posted by Will J. Kinney:
Another common criticism of the King James Bible bites the dust.
The alleged error.
A professed Christian posts this alleged error over at the Baptist Board.
Will, Will, Will. You did not indicate the source of the quote. I did when I posted it.Hebrews 6 - Verse 6. If they shall fall away
"And having fallen away". I can express my own mind on this translation nearly in the words of Dr. Macknight: "The participles , who were enlightened, , have tasted, and , were made partakers, being aorists, are properly rendered by our translators in the past time; wherefore, [Greek omitted], being an aorist, ought likewise to have been translated in the past time, "HAVE fallen away". Nevertheless, our translators, following Beza, who without any authority from ancient MSS. has inserted in his version the word si, if, have rendered this clause, IF they fall away, that this text might not appear to contradict the doctrine of the perseverance of the saints. But as no translator should take upon him to add to or alter the Scriptures, for the sake of any favourite doctrine, I have translated [Greek omitted] in the past time, have fallen away, according to the true import of the word, as standing in connection with the other aorists in the preceding verses."
http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/28/2805.html#000008
(By the way, the source is Adam Clarke)
I am not really the scholar but I take it that you DO know how to translate it? I think the Greek students here are having some difficulty already with some of your assertions about Greek translation. BTW, do you have any MSS evidence to offer on the subject?First of all, the allegation that the KJB translators got their translation of "IF they shall fall away" from Beza's Greek text, without any authority from ancient manuscripts, is pure baloney. This "scholar" has absolutely no idea what he is talking about. ALL the Greek texts read the same in this passage. It is not a question of which text is followed, as he erroneously claims, but rather of how to translate it.
Not my opinion, Adam Clarke's citing Dr. MacKnight's.Secondly, the man has only voiced his own peculiar opinion as to how the aorist should be translated. ALL major versions I am aware of frequently translate the aorist tense just as it is found in the King James Bible. Many others of equal or superior education would disagree with this man about what "the true import of the word" really is.
Me or Adam Clarke? Well, either way, it's okay that you feel that way.This Bible corrector is just another puffed up, self-appointed critic who has no Bible anywhere on this earth that he considers to be the inerrant word of God.
Ah, the pontification begins!The Conditional Participle...
Who said that, Will? Certainly not me. Back it up with a link if you think I did. We check your sources everywhere else. Don't think you'll get away with that here on the same board!It is amusing to see how every man thinks he is an expert in Greek when it comes to criticizing the King James Bible. Anytime someone says: "All scholars agree that...." you should immediately know that the guy has no idea what he is talking about. All scholars do not agree on anything, and to say they do, is to be ignorant of the facts.
Well, enough on that. I'll check behind you on your quotes after dinner. I wonder if I'll find any taken out of context?
Again, "these Bibles are totally authoritative when they agree with the KJV. They are trash when they do not!" You're too much sometimes.Bible versions that render Hebrews 6:6 as "IF they shall fall away" are: Coverdale 1535, Geneva 1599, Webster's 1833, KJB, RSV 1952, the 2003 ESV (English Standard Version), Third Millenium Bible, New Life Bible, The Message, NKJV 1982 and the 1984 NIV.
Why? Because I point out your errors in logic and cite credible sources? Because I hold you accountable for your allegations?I believe God has given him over to a reprobate mind, as far as the Bible version issue is concerned.
"...but NEVER answer questions that will comprimise your position!"We who believe God has been faithful to keep His promises to preserve His inerrant words rejoice at having them in our beloved King James Holy Bible. As our blessed Lord said so many times: "He that hath ears to hear, let him hear."
Will Kinney
http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/28/2805.html#000009