70 weeks described in Dan. 11

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

antiaging:
"Everlasting righteousness has certainly not happened to Israel as a nation, nor for the rest of the world for that matter. It will happen when Christ returns and Satan is bound a thousand years. "

GE
For sure, everlasting righteousness has certainly not happened to Israel as a nation, nor for most of the rest of the world for that matter. Tragedie is, it won't happen when Christ returns. "Today if you hear His Voice, harden not your heart" "For He shall NOT speak of another day after that" DAY OF CHRIST, WHILE, Satan is bound a thousand years. When Christ comes again, satan shall be set loose and mislead everyone not "in Christ" into the lake of fire and brimstone, when he will take death with him into it. In that day it will be too late.

 

[BobRyan]

Gerhard Ebersoehn: //How do you get this: "Your point has Jesus committing the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION?//

// ... in the midst of the week He (Christ) shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations He (Christ) shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, ... //

This (which isn't scripture) shows Christ causing the desolation of abomination (DoA)

While it is true that your view does elimate the Messiah from the greatest Messianic prophecy in the OT -- the great 490 year timeline predicting the start of the Messiah's ministry - His death on the Cross AND the prediction of Dan 9 seen to be fulfilled in Heb 10 where "the offerings and sacrifices were put to an end" through his ONCE FOR ALL atoning sacrifice.

It is not true that my view would make such a gross error.

That is the one thing we both agree on.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Gerhard Ebersoehn: //How do you get this: "Your point has Jesus committing the ABOMINATION OF DESOLATION?//

// ... in the midst of the week He (Christ) shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations He (Christ) shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, ... //

This (which isn't scripture) shows Christ causing the desolation of abomination (DoA)

The Bible says (would be nice ot know which version???)
//Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.//

Here is the way I read it:

"Daniel 9:27, interperted. 'Antichrist' is the one NOT MESSIAH mentioned in Daniel 9:26. This PRINCE's people destroy Jerusalem (Romans in AD0070). Messiah the Prince's people would be Jews, not Romans.

And he (Antichrist) shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Sorry Brother Gerhard Ebersoehn, you attribute future events of the Antichrist to past events of the Christ. That is bad theology, bad doctrine, and bad echatology.

GE
At least I do not have 'my way of reading' the text which is directly contradicting the text. I attribute to Christ the making desolate the abomination. It seems you make Christ the great loser?

 

[BobRyan]

Daniel 9:27 in the middle of the week He will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering;

Here we do not see "the covenant ended" - rather the covenant is strengthened for the full 7 years. What we see is that the sacrifices of the OT Hebrew nation church - end in the middle of the week. Letting “the Bible interpret the Bible” we see the Bible explaining the Messianic work of Dan 9 in Heb 10.THe Messiah's atoning sacrifice brings about the end of sacrifices. So DID the Messiah put a STOP to sacrifices and offerings (from God’s POV) when He came – but only in the midst of the week (3.5 years into His ministry)?

Heb 10
4 For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins.
5 Therefore, when He comes into the world, He says, "" SACRIFICE AND OFFERING YOU HAVE NOT DESIRED, BUT A BODY YOU HAVE PREPARED FOR ME;
6 IN WHOLE BURNT OFFERINGS AND sacrifices FOR SIN YOU HAVE TAKEN NO PLEASURE.
...
9 then He said, "" BEHOLD, I HAVE COME TO DO YOUR WILL.'' He takes away the first in order to establish the second.
10 By this will we have been sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.
...
16 "" THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THEM AFTER THOSE DAYS, SAYS THE LORD: I WILL PUT MY LAWS UPON THEIR HEART, AND ON THEIR MIND I WILL WRITE THEM,'' He then says,
17 "" AND THEIR SINS AND THEIR LAWLESS DEEDS I WILL REMEMBER NO MORE.''
18 Now where there is forgiveness of these things, there is no longer any offering for sin.

Heb 7
12 For when the priesthood is changed, of necessity there takes place a change of law also.
13 For the one concerning whom these things are spoken belongs to another tribe, from which no one has officiated at the altar.
14 For it is evident that our Lord was descended from Judah, a tribe with reference to which Moses spoke nothing concerning priests.
...
19 (for the Law made nothing perfect), and on the other hand there is a bringing in of a better hope, through which we draw near to God.

 

[Ed Edwards]

I don't see how one can put 'Christ' and 'abomination' in one sentence without several negatives.


Daniel 9:25 ((TNIV = Today's NIV /Zondervan 2006/ ) :
Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven 'sevens,' and sixty-two 'sevens.'

Sorry, clear as a bell, restore command to the Anointed One - 7+62=69 'sevens'.

Romans 10:14 (HCSB = Christian Standard Bible /Holman, 2003 / ) :

14 But how can they call on Him in whom they have not believed?

The pronoun 'Him' starts with a capital 'H' indicating a member of the Blessed Trinity is to whom the the pronoun referrs. This is done in the HCSB to honor members of the Diety.


References to Messiah are underlined; references to the Anti-messiah are bolded. The small 'h' in 'he' gives the main clues:

Daniel 9:26-27
After those 62 weeks
the Messiah will be cut off
and will have nothing.

The people of the coming prince
will destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end will come with a flood,
and until the end there will be war;
desolations are decreed.
27 He will make a firm covenant
with many for one week,
but in the middle of the week
he will put a stop to sacrifice and offering.
And the abomination of desolation
will be on a wing of the temple
until the decreed destruction
is poured out on the desolator.

As far as I can determine "after the 62 weeks" means before the 70th Week begins. I find no other timed prophecy that put two splits into the timing sequence. That makes this prophecy different. BTW, misunderstanding this prophecy as shown above leaves holes in the rest of the prophecy. The pause between the end of the 69th week and the beginning of the 70th week is a sign of the rejection of Christ by the Jews. But even with the split, God's promise to save the Jews will be kept. God keeps the promises He makes

God's plan is real good. At the mid-Tribulation crises, the Antichrist (who has deceived the Jews to this point) will go into the temple and and end the daily sacrifice. Millions of Jews will see that the Antichirst is NOT their Messiah.l They will see the truthabout the rejected Messiah Jesus, call Jesus Messiah (confess Jesus as Lord while believing that Christi raised Him from the Dead) -- Millions of individual Jews will be saved the day that the Antichrist commits the AoD (Abomation of Desolation). Prior to about 1930 this could not be understood - or more like 1938 when the first TV station opened in New York City. All people will see the Antichrist on TV enter the Temple, and declare himself as God. It all fits the other parts of the Bible prophecies - the gentile gap in a Jewish/Israeli timeline. How long is the gap? One Thousand, Nine Hundred and Seventy-Five years AT LEAST. Yep, 2008 is the 1,975th (could be a few more) since the Messiah was cut off.

-Ed Edwards,
waiting patiently with full HOPE for the signless Coming of Jesus to get me and take me to heaven

P.S.
-----------------------
2c. the mid-tribulation events
(these items are not necessarily in time sequence)

2c1. The Little Scroll (Rev 10)
2c2. AC killed (Rev 13:3)
2c3. Satan cast out of heaven (Rev 12:7,9)
2c4. Resurrection of AC (Rev 13:3,4)
2c5. 3 kings killed, 7 submit to AC
2c6. destruction by AC of false church completed (Rev 7:16)
2c7. Death/resurrection of two witnesses
2c8. Worship of the AC starts (Rev 13:3,4,8 )
2c9. Rise of the False Prophet completed (Rev 13:11-15)
2c10. MOB=mark of the beast initiated (Rev 13:16-18 )
2c11. 7-year covenant broken (Isaiah 28:18; Daniel 11:41)
2c12. AOD=abomination of Desolation ----- (Daniel 9:27; Matthew 24:15,16; 2 Thess 2:4)
2c13. Persecution of the Jews begins ----- (Rev 12:1-6)

 

[BobRyan]

In Dan 9 and in Heb 10 -- God's Word tells us that Messiah the Prince of Peace puts a stop to sin offerings and sacrifices --

But those who INSERT GAPS into the 490 year timeline - imagine that the antichrist does it instead. Not too surprising since they also insert massive gaps of "yet to be defined time" into the 490 year timeline.

Dan 9 says "70 weeks are determined" - seventy weeks of years -- 490 yers -- pretty clear for all to read.

And all scholars agree that this 490 year timeline predicts the time of the first coming of Christ. They all agree that if we leave it as it is stated - and do not inserts massive GAPS of "yet to be defined time" into it -- then the 490 years terminate long before 70 A.D

Couldnt be any easier.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[BobRyan]

I did not turn 11 years of age until after I turned the age of 10. Seems like 11 comes after Ten to me..

Looks like 70 comes after 69 when you read Dan 9 in the same way that it appears that 8 comes right after the 7th week in Dan 9.

Couldn't be any easier.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Ed Edwards]

// ... all scholars agree ... //

I doubt that ever happens.

//Dan 9 says "70 weeks are determined" - seventy weeks of years -- 490 yers -- pretty clear for all to read.//

But it is the only time line in the Bible that I know of which also mentions parts:

--- first 7 'sevens'
Dan 9:25

--- second 62 'sevens'
Dan 9:25
Dan 9:26 - at the end Messiah comes

--- last 'seven' & the middle of the last 'seven' (the 70th 'seven')
Dan 9:27

//In Dan 9 and in Heb 10 -- God's Word tells us that Messiah the Prince of Peace puts a stop to sin offerings and sacrifices --//

Show me word for word from the scripture.
I don't find either. First, Dan 9 is generally a prophecy and what it tells is what will happen (from Daniel's viewpoint)

Second, Hebrews 10 is talking about the sacrifices of saved people NOT OF UNSAVED JEWS. I have no need for additional sin offerings - there are other people in the world who think they have a need.

Why does Ezekiel 40-44 (5 chapters) talk about a temple that has yet to be built? Why does Ezekiel talk about giving of sacrifices? Sorry, God has NOT taken away His promises He made in the Old Testament. One's theories of eschatology need to include Ezekiel 40-44 somewhere.

(you are making a pretty picture of the future, but you have some parts left over :laugh: )

 

[antiaging]

GE

Or, a sooner Return! What then?!

I am not date setting.
The Ezekiel chapters 38 and 39 prophecy will happen first. Armies gathering to attack Israel, and God destroying those armies. That is not about to happen yet. The middle east is moving in that direction. After that prophecy, then the rebuilding of the temple, a daily sacrifice started in Israel, antichrist coming to power, then the last 7 years. It looks to me like the end could be a long way off. It all depends on what happens in the middle east and when the Ezekiel 38 & 39 prophecy happens. Then after that there is still an indeterminate amout of time to set up the following events.

 

[antiaging]

Hint: The 490 years of Dan 9 predicts the first coming of Christ not the second (as all Bible scholars agree) and it can not be chopped into pieces.



There is no gap at all in the 490 year timeline of Dan 9 just as there is no gap in the 70 years nor in the 490 years nor between the 7weeks and the 62 weeks of the 490 years nor between the 62 weeks and the 70th week.

I.e -- this couldn't be any easier!

in Christ,

Bob

Daniel 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

Daniel 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

Daniel 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Seven weeks of rebuilding in troublous times.
62 weeks of persecution mostly by Egypt and Syria fighting and then by Rome that took over the northern kingdom. Jews persecuted during all 69 weeks.

Jesus is killed. The people of the prince that shall come, [people of the antichrist] the romans destroy the temple in 70 AD. The Jews are scattered and Israel no longer a nation until 1948; desolations.

The he in verse 27 is the antichrist, the prince that shall come, a future prince. He will be a roman, of the people that destroyed the temple in AD 70. He makes a covenant with many for 7 years, that starts the 70th week. Many Jews are back in the land, it is a nation of Israel again and no longer desolate. He causes the sacrifice to cease and sets up some kind of idol in the temple. This is when the antichrist takes over Israel in the middle of the last 7 years. The Jews again flee out of the land and it is desolate again for the last 3.5 years.

 

[Palatka51]

The people of the coming prince
will destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end will come with a flood,
and until the end there will be war;
desolations are decreed.
27 He will make a firm covenant
with many for one week,
but in the middle of the week
he will put a stop to sacrifice and offering.
And the abomination of desolation
will be on a wing of the temple
until the decreed destruction
is poured out on the desolator.

Where in the above verses does it indicate that the Jewish people will believe that the Antichrist is Messiah? All that I see is that he will sign a treaty with many people. This does not indicate that Jews will consider him to be the Messiah.

God's plan is real good. At the mid-Tribulation crises, the Antichrist (who has deceived the Jews to this point) will go into the temple and and end the daily sacrifice. Millions of Jews will see that the Antichirst is NOT their Messiah.l They will see the truthabout the rejected Messiah Jesus, call Jesus Messiah (confess Jesus as Lord while believing that Christi raised Him from the Dead) -- Millions of individual Jews will be saved the day that the Antichrist commits the AoD (Abomation of Desolation). Prior to about 1930 this could not be understood - or more like 1938 when the first TV station opened in New York City. All people will see the Antichrist on TV enter the Temple, and declare himself as God. It all fits the other parts of the Bible prophecies - the gentile gap in a Jewish/Israeli timeline. How long is the gap? One Thousand, Nine Hundred and Seventy-Five years AT LEAST. Yep, 2008 is the 1,975th (could be a few more) since the Messiah was cut off.

-Ed Edwards,

Again, how is it that the Jewish nation will even consider the antichrist as a messiah when he is a Gentile? After all, the above scripture does indicate that he is the "Prince to come" of the people that destroy Herod's Temple at Jerusalem in 70ad.

 

[BobRyan]

// Bob said -- Dan 9 says "70 weeks are determined" - seventy weeks of years -- 490 yers -- pretty clear for all to read.//

But it is the only time line in the Bible that I know of which also mentions parts:

--- first 7 'sevens'
Dan 9:25

--- second 62 'sevens'
Dan 9:25
Dan 9:26 - at the end Messiah comes

If you insert a GAP of thousands of years of "yet to be defined time" between the 7-weeks (49 years) of Dan 9 and the 62-weeks of years -- then "the Messiah STILL has not come".

NO 490 year timeline or 70 year timeline or 2300 year timeline will survive such abuse.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[Ed Edwards]

In reference to Daniel 9:26b-27 Brother Palatka51 says:

//Where in the above verses does it indicate that the Jewish people will believe that the Antichrist is Messiah? All that I see is that he will sign a treaty with many people. This does not indicate that Jews will consider him to be the Messiah.//

Nowhere in that verse. However, it can be logically concluded from things said in the whole Bible. All the saved Gentiles (and their Church Age Messanic Jews) will be raptured/resurrected out of the world at the start of the Tribulation period, Daniel's 70th 'Seven' (or week). This removal means there will be Jews not saved Gentiles around to welcom the Antichrist. "Christ" is a Greek term meaning "chosen one of God". "Antichrist" then means 'not chosen of God'. Of course the Jews will be the one who believes the 'Antichrist' is the Messiah.

The 70th week of Daniel is about Jews, not Gentiles.

 

[Ed Edwards]

If you insert a GAP of thousands of years of "yet to be defined time" between the 7-weeks (49 years) of Dan 9 and the 62-weeks of years -- then "the Messiah STILL has not come".

NO 490 year timeline or 70 year timeline or 2300 year timeline will survive such abuse.

in Christ,

Bob

I guess you missed that part in your hurry to repeat the same lame arguments you always have.

Dan 9:25 (Geneva Bible, 1599 Edition):
Knowe therefore and vnderstande, that from the going foorth of the commandement to bring againe the people, and to builde Ierusalem, vnto Messiah the prince, shall be seuen weekes and threescore and two weekes, and the streete shalbe built againe, and the wall euen in a troublous time.

Along came Messiah the prince EXACTLY 69 complete 'sevens' after the commandment to build Ierusalem -- just as the prophecy said. The decree went out in 487BC and 7x69=487 years later on 1 Jan AD 0001* - right on schedule Jesus the Messiah was circumcised & made a Jewish human person (not to be confused with gentile goy non-human persons).

Jesus was not crucified 3½-years into His ministry (more like two years);
Jesus was not resurrected 3½-years before the destruction of Jerusalm (more like AD70-AD33=37 /not 40/ ) .
Daniel's 70th week has been delayed for the time it takes the Gentile Church to get it's full number (which number only God the Father knows).


*note on the Birthday of Jesus. Jesus was born on the first day of His life on what we could call 25 Dec 0001BC. On the 8th day of His life (01 Jan AD 0001) Jesus was circumcised as required by the Law of Moses.

 

[BobRyan]

I guess you missed that part in your hurry to repeat the same lame arguments you always have.

Dan 9:25 (Geneva Bible, 1599 Edition):
Knowe therefore and vnderstande, that from the going foorth of the commandement to bring againe the people, and to builde Ierusalem, vnto Messiah the prince, shall be seuen weekes and threescore and two weekes, and the streete shalbe built againe, and the wall euen in a troublous time.

Along came Messiah the prince EXACTLY 69 complete 'sevens' after the commandment to build Ierusalem -- just as the prophecy said.

I find it hard to believe that you think that I missed that.

I also did not miss the fact that the single 490 year timeline is given as "70 sevens" (490 years) AND ALSO as
7-7's
62-7s
1 - 7

So that those who insist on "inserting AS YET undefined segments of time totalling 1000's of years" into each segement -- would be denying both the first coming .

Jesus was not crucified 3½-years into His ministry (more like two years);

The text says "in the MIDST of the week" not "in the exact mathematical middle".

The probems with the "slice and dice" method some attempt to use on this one prophecy -- are myriad.

in Christ,

Bob

 

[antiaging]

I guess you missed that part in your hurry to repeat the same lame arguments you always have.

Dan 9:25 (Geneva Bible, 1599 Edition):
Knowe therefore and vnderstande, that from the going foorth of the commandement to bring againe the people, and to builde Ierusalem, vnto Messiah the prince, shall be seuen weekes and threescore and two weekes, and the streete shalbe built againe, and the wall euen in a troublous time.

Along came Messiah the prince EXACTLY 69 complete 'sevens' after the commandment to build Ierusalem -- just as the prophecy said.

I find it hard to believe that you think that I missed that.

I also did not miss the fact that the single 490 year timeline is given as "70 sevens" (490 years) AND ALSO as
7-7's
62-7s
1 - 7

So that those who insist on "inserting AS YET undefined segments of time totalling 1000's of years" into each segement -- would be denying both the first coming .




The text says "in the MIDST of the week" not "in the exact mathematical middle".

The probems with the "slice and dice" method some attempt to use on this one prophecy -- are myriad.

in Christ,

Bob

The gap is only separating the last week of 7 years. There is no gap between the first 7 weeks and the 62 weeks. The 69 weeks lead right up to the first coming of Messiah and the timing is correct to match it to Jesus Christ.

Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Romans 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
Romans 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

When Christ returns, at the end of the 70th week, after the fulness of the gentiles is brought in, you will have the fullfillment of the 9:24, on the nation of Israel. Dan.9:24 deals with Israel as a nation, "thy people".

Daniel 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

The reason for the desolations causing the gap is because they did not recognize Jesus as the Messiah and they killed Him. They also said to Pilate, His blood be upon us and our children.

Luke 19:42 Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes.
Luke 19:43 For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side,
Luke 19:44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.

Luke 13:34 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, which killest the prophets, and stonest them that are sent unto thee; how often would I have gathered thy children together, as a hen doth gather her brood under her wings, and ye would not!
Luke 13:35 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate: and verily I say unto you, Ye shall not see me, until the time come when ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

Palatka51:
"Where in the above verses does it indicate that the Jewish people will believe that the Antichrist is Messiah? All that I see is that he will sign a treaty with many people. This does not indicate that Jews will consider him to be the Messiah."

GE
Indeed!
These people seem to never have read Acts 28:25b-28!
"Well spake the Holy Ghost by Esaias the prophet unto our fathers, Saying, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive: For the heart of this people (Israel to the flesh) is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed, lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heel them. Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles: An they, will, hear!

But be assured, there are those not of Israel after the flesh, who are just so, forever rejected by God, for no other reason than here mentioned. John calls them the 'luke warm'. They are they who claim to 'have the light'! They are all over. Their own doctrines they have made their belly, to worship it as were it God or Christ.

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

I must make an apology which I was not asked to make; I saw my mistake myself. I misunderstood Ed Edwards for saying Christ did the abomination of desolation. I was wrong.
But it doesn't mean He will only do so in future, because He had done with desolating the abomination when he triumphed through cross and resurrection: "ONCE FOR ALL"!

 

[Gerhard Ebersoehn]

I guess you missed that part in your hurry to repeat the same lame arguments you always have.

Dan 9:25 (Geneva Bible, 1599 Edition):
Knowe therefore and vnderstande, that from the going foorth of the commandement to bring againe the people, and to builde Ierusalem, vnto Messiah the prince, shall be seuen weekes and threescore and two weekes, and the streete shalbe built againe, and the wall euen in a troublous time.

Along came Messiah the prince EXACTLY 69 complete 'sevens' after the commandment to build Ierusalem -- just as the prophecy said. The decree went out in 487BC and 7x69=487 years later on 1 Jan AD 0001* - right on schedule Jesus the Messiah was circumcised & made a Jewish human person (not to be confused with gentile goy non-human persons).

Jesus was not crucified 3½-years into His ministry (more like two years);
Jesus was not resurrected 3½-years before the destruction of Jerusalm (more like AD70-AD33=37 /not 40/ ) .
Daniel's 70th week has been delayed for the time it takes the Gentile Church to get it's full number (which number only God the Father knows).


*note on the Birthday of Jesus. Jesus was born on the first day of His life on what we could call 25 Dec 0001BC. On the 8th day of His life (01 Jan AD 0001) Jesus was circumcised as required by the Law of Moses.

GE

And you talk of BobRyan's 'lame arguments! It's a joke!

These three last 'arguments' of yours e.g., where on earth will one find easier to demolish -- to lay desolate the abomination? Ed Edwards, you haven't passed Kindergarten yet!

 

[Ed Edwards]

GE says:

Indeed!
These people seem to never have read Acts 28:25b-28!
"Well spake the Holy Ghost by Esaias the prophet unto our fathers, Saying, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive: For the heart of this people (Israel to the flesh) is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes have they closed, lest they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heel them. Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation of God is sent unto the Gentiles: An they, will, hear!

Thank you Brother GE for the nice verse. That says so much better what I was trying to say. After the time of the Gentiles, the Church Age, God will win all the Gentiles He wants and then 'all Israel will be saved" (God's promise in NT).

[FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Romans 11:25 TNIV = Today's New International Version (Zondervan, 2006)

I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not think you are superior: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way all Israel will be saved. As it is written: "The deliverer will come from Zion; he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.

God's plan for Jesus to save the Jews is via the Gentiles - that is where we are today: wating until the full number of the Gentiles has come in. Then shall the Day of the Lord (when Messiah Jesus intervenes in the affairs of Mankind -- the Tribulation Period, the 70th Week of Daniel.

- -Ed
Maranatha! - Even so, Come Lord Jesus!


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